Candlekeep Forum
Candlekeep Forum
Home | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Active Polls | Members | Private Messages | Search | FAQ
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 Realmslore
 Chamber of Sages
 Questions for Ed Greenwood (2004)
 New Topic  Topic Locked
 Printer Friendly
Previous Page | Next Page
Author Previous Topic Topic 
Page: of 81

The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 12 Mar 2004 :  16:33:45  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
As promised, The Hooded One returns with more from Ed:

Karth, your hypothetical question is one I’ve been asked many times over the years by TSR staffers, as we wrestled to all come to the same view of the root nature of the Zhents. Getting rich by control of that “shorter, cheaper, faster, and all ours” trade route betwixt the Sword Coast and the (mineral wealth of the) Moonsea North is what -- originally, anyway -- the Zhentarim were all about.
Future secret projects prevent me from discussing one of the ‘ends of the route’ you mention in any detail, but thankfully the ‘given’ you postulate doesn’t make that necessary: the ‘end’ is assumed lost, and we’re looking at alternative routes. So here they are:
The Zhent reaction would of course be to change the route rather than abandoning it, and in the long run seek to re-establish this ‘best’ route, as all of the alternatives are longer, slower, and more expensive.
The worst (from the Zhent point of view) route, the “fallback/defeat/failure” route -- which they use for a comparative trickle of goods right now, keeping it open ‘just in case,’ is via Tilver’s Gap and the Stonelands. To make this work for the full workload the Zhents would need it to carry, they would have to establish dozens of legitimate costers to perform carriage through the Dales (all traffic east of Tilver’s Gap), and beef up Darkhold to be ready to defend the western end (bringing caravans onto the existing roads at various points around Corm Orp and nearby places).
The two more desirable alternatives both begin in the east at the Citadel of the Raven, and require hewing a ‘safe’ route through the Border Forest (probably by establishing two small citadels at either end of the forest trail, and patrolling heavily between them) to reach Anauroch. From there, the Zhents would have to spend a lot of coin sending forth caravans that carry only firewood, food, and water (out into the desert, dump at specific sites, and then return). In this manner, they would establish a series of “water and warmth” waystops across the frigid desert (thanks to the cold, spell-controlled rothe or as a less desirable alternative, caribou, would have to be the beasts of burden instead of horses). If I was the Zhent commander, I’d run the route along those three isolated peaks, Azrrhat being the most easterly, so as to use the heights as navigational aids and signal beacons. This icy route would of course damage some sorts of goods, and would reach the western edge of Anauroch at one of two places: either the north end of the Far Forest or the south end. Which of the two was chosen would depend on how fiercely Llorkh is held against the Zhents -- in other words, can they barge down the Delimibyr? This river will be their first choice, as it allows them to use their existing agents in Loudwater and elsewhere who represent the ‘western end’ of their present route.
If they can’t use the Delimibyr, then it’s the harder way: west across the headwaters of the Delimibyr and along the southern edge of the Nether Mountains to the valley of the Rauvin, and down through the Silver Marches. If I was one of the top Zhents, I’d give orders to try to establish all of these routes, but end up only heavily using the one that proved to have the lowest loss rate of men and cargo. I hope this helps.

So saith Ed. The Hooded One signing off, with a “You’re welcome” to Karth. I hope I can give you another big grin with this little gem: me leaving to walk to the bus to get to Ed’s for the weekly Realms session, and my mother calling out the front door: “Dear, dear, you’ve forgotten your dice!”
Whereupon I, on the sidewalk, call back: “It’s all right, mom: I don’t expect there’ll be swords out tonight!”
(curious looks from other pedestrians)
Mom frowns. “No swords?” (not knowing that Ed’s Realms are very different from the D&D games she’s seen kids playing at school, which are ALL ‘hack the monster, take the treasure, hack the next monster’)
Me: “No. We start tonight with me lying nude on the altar.”
(REALLY strange looks from two old men walking past on the sidewalk, in different directions) :}
To those readers who think our Realms sessions were one long orgy, I hasten to explain that they were actually . . . a series of short orgies. :} No, SERIOUSLY now: two female Knights were staying (without the other Knights) in the house of a merchant who was a devoted worshipper of Sharess. We suspected he was pandering for various temples of the goddess by luring unhappy and restless young lasses away from family and home with gifts and promises of rich husbands and the high life in distant glittering cities -- and that he was doing some tax dodging on the side by making these gals claim that certain coffers travelling in his wagons with them were their own personal property, rather than his wares. The other Knights were waiting to pounce if the merchant revealed any of this to be true, and my character was posing as a young lass smitten by his offers, who upon finding his private altar to Sharess is possessed by her manifested favour, and goes into wild raptures. My character didn’t dare speak for the goddess [who might just smite her down for such blasphemy], but we hoped that her writhings and then wild dancings might unsettle the merchant enough that he would jump to the wrong conclusions . . . which he did. I had problems keeping a straight face during the roleplaying that night, though, because as Ed (playing the merchant) shuffled around wringing his hands and imploring Sharess to forgive him, I kept seeing the shocked face of one of the old men on the sidewalk.
Go to Top of Page

The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 12 Mar 2004 :  18:30:51  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hmmm. Let amend my last post. Instead of "shocked face" let me correct it to read: "shocked and disbelievingly delighted."
So there. :}
The Hooded One, not Ed. Ed almost always looks delighted.
Go to Top of Page

The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 12 Mar 2004 :  22:23:48  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Addendum to the above Realmsplay tale: the true beauty of Ed's original Realms campaign is that we've NEVER felt like he was running us through a prepared adventure. WE have council-of-war sessions and decide who to ask for news, where to go adventuring, what to do ... and Ed just shows us the unfolding world as we do our thing.
Go to Top of Page

Dargoth
Great Reader

Australia
4569 Posts

Posted - 12 Mar 2004 :  23:05:06  Show Profile  Visit Dargoth's Homepage Send Dargoth a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Karth

Got another one for you, Ed. Hypothetical...

Given the current structure of the Zhentarim, @ 1370, what would be the likely reaction to one end of the Anauroch trade route being seriously disrupted in a way that they could not quickly overturn? By this I mean either Dagger Falls being retaken by Randall Morn with good local support or Llorkh being taken by a powerful force allied to the Lords' Alliance and Harpers. In this scenario, assume that taking back the lost territory is not viable for the Zhents in the near term and they are forced to explore other options to re-link their trade route across Anauroch.

As you would play it, what are their first three choices as alternate routes or trade scenarios?

Hooded One: Thanks for the glimpse at a "snowbound winter evening in Toronto". You put a great big grin on my face... ;)

-KN



Interestly enough thats one of the major plot lines in the campaign Im running

Overview

After Banes return Fzoul decides to reacess the goals and strategy of the Eastern Zhentarim.

The goals of church of Bane and the Zhentarim have in the last 100 years or so have been to control trade from the Moonsea across Annouch Desert to Waterdeep and the sea of Sword, this made it necessary for the Zhentarim to occupy Dagger Dale in order to control the link between Zhentil keep and The Black Road which spans the Desert and connects the Eastern and Western halves of the organisation. However these goals and objectives no longer seem important

1) The Return of Shade has restricted the amounted of Traffic that can travel down the Black Road.

2) The Western Cyric dominated Half of the Zhentarim has or likely will leave the organization (likely be subsumed by the Church of Cyric)

3) Daggerdale has driven the Zhentarim out of the dale effectively cutting off Zhentarim traffic heading out of the Moonsea area and Along the Black road.

4) Fzoul and Khelbhan Blackstaff made a pact where Fzoul would not expand the Zhentarim West of the Desert for next 30 years.

For these reasons Fzoul decides to cut his losses and abandon the Western Zhentarim to the Cyricist.

So whats a chosen of Bane to do with all this free time? He looks else where

For years it has been the gaol to conqueror Shadowdale but every attempt has resulted in failure. Fzoul recognises this and decides to leave Shadowdale alone, the costs of launching a campaign against it is simply to high and the potential gains limited.

So where else can they go?

North?

The northern Moonsea is undeveloped and scantily defended, but it would require a huge amount of recourses to Garrison and the rewards would not be that great and why bother when another strategy will drop the northern cities into the palm of Banes Hand.

Fzoul decides that the Southern Moonsea and the Western Dragon coast are his goals.

To this end the following happens

Scyllua Darkhope travels to Scardale and presses her claim as the rightful Lord of Scardale as the Daughter of its former ruler Lashan. Her claim is accepted and her rulership confirmed. A church of Bane is established in Scardale town however it focus on Law and obedience and it quickly brings order to Scardale town with help of the 500 Zhentarim soldiers Fzoul sends to garrison the town.

Scyllua rules Scardale with a Velvet glove she keeps the more destructive Banites out of Scardale. She wins the people of Scardale over by demonstrating the advantages of a strong lawful ruler which the people of Scardale find a pleasant change from the Chaotic and disorderly rule they’ve experienced since Lashans fall.

Fzouls other goal is to Dominate the southern Moonsea, and the major opponent to that goal is Zhentil keeps old foe Hillsfar, because of this Fzoul has decided that Hilsfar must be conquerored, to achieve this end Fzoul intends sending 2 Armys, one from Voonlar made up of troops from Zhentil Keep and one from Mulmaster they will link up outside Hillsfar and together lay siege to the city. Fzoul plans to bribe the less loyal leaders of Purple Plumes and assassinate those leaders who remain loyal to Hillsfar. At sea the navys of both Mulmaster and Zhentil Keep will blockade Hillsfar port, cutting it off from its sea trade routes and starving the city into submission.

The assault on Hillsfar will begin in 1374

With the taking of Hillsfar the Zhentarim will control the entire southern coast from Zhentil keep in the west to Mulmaster in the east. He also intends to seize the strategic River Lis that connects the Moonsea with the Sea of Fallen stars. He intends to build a series of Fortresses along the length of the river making it impossible for non Zhentarim traffic to transit the river and enter the Moonsea . This will starve the Northern Moonsea cities of income and force them to enter the Zhentrium fold or face economic ruin.

After the fall o Hillsfar Fzoul intends on invading Harrowdale thus linking Scardale with the Zhentriums Moonsea possessions.

Hillsfar has few allies who are willing to help it against the Zhentarim, the most likely to help them would be Sembia however Sembian troops would have to travel a long way to reach Hillsfar and would face a major obstacle in the form of Drow who occupy the territory a Sembian army would have to march through.

When the Zhentarim take over of Scardale will also distract them and make them less willing to send troops north to Hillsfar when Zhentarim troops are on there door step.

To make life for the Sembians even harder Scyllua will bribe the Monks of the Long death, who have a monastery in Scardale to wage a campaign of murder and terror across Sembia killing off the leaders of Sembias merchant familys.

The campaign starts with a modified version of Raiders of Galaths roost

When Fzoul decided to abandon the Western Zhentrium and focus on Hillsfar instead he ordered Suddilis to gather all those members of Darkholds garrision who where followers of Bane or loyal to the Eastern Zhentrium and lead them East back to Zhentil Keep. This he did and on one moonless night 350 members of Darkholds garrision slipped out and headed for the Zhentrium outpost that contained the portal to Galaths roost.

“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”

Emperor Sigismund

"Its good to be the King!"

Mel Brooks
Go to Top of Page

Karth
Learned Scribe

USA
81 Posts

Posted - 13 Mar 2004 :  02:24:28  Show Profile  Visit Karth's Homepage  Send Karth an AOL message Send Karth a Private Message
If I was one of the top Zhents, I’d give orders to try to establish all of these routes, but end up only heavily using the one that proved to have the lowest loss rate of men and cargo. I hope this helps.
***
Rock. Thanks, Ed. It certainly helps clarify the reasonable options open to them. Another poster has just addressed this same thing on the thread and his post leads to a secondary query on something I don't believe you wrote. I'd still like to hear what you think, though. Am I correct in assuming that Fzoul can get around the letter of his private treaty with Khelben simply by leaving someone else in nominal control of the Western Zhents and having a "trade agreement" with them that keeps the trade route intact?

In other words, if the Western Zhents are technically an autonomous organization, then Fzoul can't be held responsible for what they might do with regard to the terms of the treaty. If Fzoul could keep such an arrangment profitable and unimploded by Western ambitions, it would at least partially undermine the whole raison d'etre for Khelben's deal and make him look more than a little foolish in the eyes of the good-guy PTBs. I suppose that's what Khelben would get for dancing with the devil, as it were...

Any thoughts on that?
****************************************************

the Hooded One wrote:
<Hmmm. Let amend my last post. Instead of "shocked face" let me correct it to read: "shocked and disbelievingly delighted."
So there. :}>
***
It is one of the unique pleasures given to odd folk like us to be able to easily "scare the straights". You can hardly be blamed for taking full enjoyment of it, Hooded One. ;)

"We ARE the wierdos, Mister..."

-Fairuza Balk, The Craft

In any case, Hooded One, you did indeed get another grin out of me...

Regards,

-Karth
***********************************************

Go to Top of Page

arilyn742
Seeker

Ireland
54 Posts

Posted - 13 Mar 2004 :  02:42:39  Show Profile  Visit arilyn742's Homepage  Send arilyn742 a Yahoo! Message Send arilyn742 a Private Message
O Great Hooded One:

I'm in the dark as to what exactly you have done for FR. I know you created Elminster, the Seven Sisters and the like, but could you explain to me roughly how much (or how little) of Faerun there was when you first appeared? (I'm relatively new to the Forgotten Realms, so I don't know much outside some computer games, 3E game products and novels.)

Oh yeah, and who exactly was this Volo I heard so much about in the Baldur's Gate manuals and what (apparently) happened to him?

Yonde iru, mune no doko ka oku de
Itsumo kokoro odoru yume wo mitai
Kanashimi wa kazoekirenai keredo
Sono mukou de kitto anata ni aeru
Go to Top of Page

The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 13 Mar 2004 :  15:48:25  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Karth, The Hooded One sends this reply:

I’m reluctant to get very specific in answering this because a certain [must remain nameless] longtime FR designer is currently working on something [which must remain vague for now] near to this topic.
However, my personal opinion (which I’d follow if this befell in the ‘home’ Realms campaign) would be that Fzoul would be reluctant to try so obvious a ploy, because he’d know that Khelben would hold him responsible, whatever the ‘letter’ (specific wording) of their agreement was. They both entered into the pact knowing it would be broken, sooner or later; it was a time-buying affair for both of them.
Khelben would view Fzoul as in charge of any ‘Western Zhents’ whether he claimed not to be, or not. Due to the highly authoritarian nature of the Zhentarim, the Zhents can’t fairly be equated to the Harpers, and Khelben did openly leave the Harpers to found the Moonstars.
If you look back over the history of the Zhentarim to date, Fzoul is an opportunistic survivor, who always tries to put himself into the ‘right place’ or position at any given time -- and it would be stupid (and therefore out of character) for him to pick a fight with Khelben over this.
After all, the caravan trade into and from the Sword Coast existed prior to their agreement, and can continue without challenging that agreement so long as the Zhents don’t establish more agents at the western end of the route, increase investments and bribes in the Sword Coast lands, move important Zhents there, or increase their missions or political manipulations. Khelben is as interested as anyone else in goods flowing across Faerun and arriving at their destinations as cheaply as possible, because that lets commoners buy things without paying ruinous prices (rising prices would lead to people being in need, and eventually widespread unrest).
That doesn’t mean that Fzoul wouldn’t try to covertly influence a few individuals whom he could label as foes rather than rival Zhents into helping the Zhentarim. For instance, if Fzoul could get a Red Wizard of Thay or two, who are in trade enclaves in the Sword Coast region, into unwittingly furthering Zhent schemes or abetting Zhent trading, he’d do it in a shot -- but I doubt he’s figured out a way to successfully do that, yet. Blow it, and that would be “dancing with the devil” far more than making an agreement with Khelben ever was.
After all, looking at what the Red Wizards are up to in the western Heartlands right now, they are becoming the true foe and threat to the Zhentarim by simply being bigger and better occupiers of the same market niche, if you will. :}


So saith Ed. The Hooded One points to this for Candlekeep readers who may not give two hoots about trade or the Zhentarim, and I say this: Ed’s word’s here are a perfect example of how he ‘thinks Realms,’ always seeing consequences and alliances and ‘the interconnectedness of all things.’ This is one very important way in which any good DM makes a campaign seem alive, and can keep play going a long, long time.
Go to Top of Page

The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 13 Mar 2004 :  15:50:03  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
o arilyn742, I (the Hooded One) make reply: I haven’t done much for the Realms beyond be part of Ed’s band of ham-acting, extremely-demanding players. So you might say I’ve wielded one paint brush in adding colour to the great tapestry that is the Realms.
Ed, however, IS the Realms. Everything you read about them was either created by him, or expanded by others from his notes, guidance, and direct aid, with a very few exceptions.
Ed DIDN’T create Vaasa, Damara, Bloodstone Pass, the people or folk of the Moonshaes (though the name is his), the Uthgardt barbarians, Drizzt or the drow (though he did give the drow lots of Realms rules and two gods, Eilistraee and Vhaeraun), Kara-Tur, Al-Qadim (though he did contribute some spells to that setting), Shade, some features in Anauroch, the Hordelands, or Maztica. He isn’t responsible for the Egyptian pantheon of gods put into Old Empires, or most of the nonhuman deities (though he created a few gods for the dwarves). He didn’t create Danilo Thann or Arilyn, though he DID create Elaith. Most of the lead characters in novels not by him were created by others, though he did name and create a surprising number of them, from almost all of the Uskevrens in the Sembia series to Myrmeen Lhal in The Night Parade.
Everything else came originally from Ed, even to the name “Forgotten Realms.” The map of Faerun has been tinkered with a bit, but what you see today is, more or less, what Ed handed to TSR back in 1986.
Ed is very quick to credit others for expanding his creation and putting it into D&D form, from staffers like Jeff Grubb and Steven Schend to freelancers like Eric Boyd and many, many others. The Realms is a shared world, now, but as someone who saw it before TSR ever did, I can swear beyond any doubt that Ed Greenwood is THE Creator of the Realms. He even created Candlekeep (not this site, but the monastery it is named for . . . plus Alaundo, most of the Roll of Years, the Calendar of Harptos and Harptos himself, and so on and on and on).
As for Volo: I once heard Volo called the “Geraldo Rivera of the Realms,” but I think that’s a trifle unfair to the real Mr. Rivera. Volo is a young, amoral rogue itching with the need to learn secrets and trumpet them to the world. A minor mage and major rogue, he wanders Faerun penning acidic travel guides (the Volo’s Guides, which are available as downloads and are ESSENTIAL to making a Realms campaign seem colourful and ‘real’). There’s even a Volo’s Guide to Baldur’s Gate II, which was meant to go with the computer game. Volo went so far as to write a book entitled Volo’s Guide To All Things Magical, and was threatened (by various wizards) with dire consequences if it was ever published.
Inevitably, it was, and as a result Volo (for his own protection, the Old Mage insists) spent some time as an ornamental frog sculpture in Elminster’s pond. He’s free again now, and I fear we’ve all not heard the last from Volo. :}
Go to Top of Page

ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author

2290 Posts

Posted - 13 Mar 2004 :  20:19:19  Show Profile  Visit ElaineCunningham's Homepage Send ElaineCunningham a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
As for Volo: I once heard Volo called the “Geraldo Rivera of the Realms,” but I think that’s a trifle unfair to the real Mr. Rivera.



Frankly, I think it's rather unfair to Volo...

Go to Top of Page

Foxhelm
Senior Scribe

Canada
592 Posts

Posted - 13 Mar 2004 :  22:26:14  Show Profile  Click to see Foxhelm's MSN Messenger address  Send Foxhelm a Yahoo! Message Send Foxhelm a Private Message
Me again.

Just curious, will we see another Wizards Three again? Especially with the Return of Dragonlance and the enpowerment of Greyhawk? Will there be other meetings with Wizards?

And will there every be a collection of your Wizards three stories?

Thanks

Ed Greenwood! The Solution... and Cause of all the Realms Problems!
Go to Top of Page

Lashan
Learned Scribe

USA
235 Posts

Posted - 13 Mar 2004 :  22:44:28  Show Profile  Visit Lashan's Homepage Send Lashan a Private Message
Mr. Greenwood, you have been most helpful in answering my many questions. Still, I have more! This time, I am curious about Dragons in the Vast. I have always enjoyed the Dragons of the North articles, but frankly, I don't usually play in the North. I've always been a bigger fan of the Inner Sea area. So, I'm curious about dragons of the Vast (and consider this a request to perhaps do a few extra articles about dragons in other areas :) ). Now, I figure that there are some black dragons in the Flooded Forest. I image that the silver and red dragons fight in the mountains, but I would love to hear more about them. Also, are there white dragons in the Glacier of the White Worm? I know that is not how the glacier got its name, but perhaps some reside there?
Go to Top of Page

SiriusBlack
Great Reader

USA
5517 Posts

Posted - 13 Mar 2004 :  23:49:28  Show Profile  Visit SiriusBlack's Homepage Send SiriusBlack a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham
Frankly, I think it's rather unfair to Volo...





Nice to see I wasn't the only one thinking that.
Go to Top of Page

Dargoth
Great Reader

Australia
4569 Posts

Posted - 14 Mar 2004 :  00:20:53  Show Profile  Visit Dargoth's Homepage Send Dargoth a Private Message
Got a question for Ed

If Scyulla Darkhope went to Scardale to press her claim as Lashans daughter how would they go about determining that she was or wasnt Lashans Daughter?

The obvious solution would be to cast a Legend lore spell however who would be an exceptable caster the current ruler of Scardale is a follower of Torm and Scyllua is follower of Bane so thats going to eliminate any spell caster from the Zhentrim or a follower of Torm from casting the spell as there likely to be biased. The obvious solution would be to goto Leaves of Learning the church to Oghma in Deepingdale, its possiable this that the church would have Birth records for the people of the Dales also Atlar the High Priest of the Church could cast a Legend Lore spell however Atlar is LG and therfore going to be morally oppossed to telling a servant of Bane that they are the rightful ruler and then theres also the churchs links to the Harpers

It would make an interesting moral delihema for a cleric of Oghma

He could

1) Cast the spell and if it comes out that Scyllua is Lashans daughter then tell them the truth.

2) The "Moral" choice cast the spell hope Scyllua's not Lashans Daughter and if the spell says she is then lie and tell everyone she isnt. This option is likely to drop the High Priet in hot water with his god concealing Knowledge and lying are big no nos for followers of Oghma.

3) He can refuse to cast the spell and thus avoid a conflict between his morals and his gods Dogma

Also what was Lashans patron deity? Id assume either Tempus (After all he did start a huge war in the Dalelands) or Bane (Lashans was quite Tyranical and the war caused alot of Strife) perhaps an othodox Banite after all the Reformed Banites fought against Lashan

“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”

Emperor Sigismund

"Its good to be the King!"

Mel Brooks
Go to Top of Page

Steven Schend
Forgotten Realms Designer & Author

USA
1632 Posts

Posted - 14 Mar 2004 :  17:34:00  Show Profile  Visit Steven Schend's Homepage  Send Steven Schend a Yahoo! Message Send Steven Schend a Private Message
quote:
Karth, Steve Schend catalogued Alustriel’s sons elsewhere and elsewhen, and to avoid stepping on the toes of folks currently at work on must-remain-mysterious-for-now things in the Realms, I’m going to bow out of giving you names, order of birth, levels, et al. Sorry.


Hail and well met. With some insistence on Ed's part (and Eric Boyd's and a few other who shall remain nameless), I'm ending my sabbatical and returning to the Realms as a fan and fellow Waterdhavian by proxy.

As for Ed's comment above, I did a dig through the hard drive to find the info I had set aside long ago (circa 1996-1997ish, during the design of Cloak & Dagger). Even so, no reason to leave it buried.

Bear in mind though, folks, that none of this lore is at all official, since I'm no longer affiliated with Wizards save by old friendships and some very occasional work. With that in mind, here's what my old brain came up with for Alustriel's Sons aka the Tall Ones.

Steven Schend
Who unofficially adopted Silverymoon as a pet project for a few years before leaving WotC in 2000



At 05:06 PM 3/18/99 -0500, you wrote:
>
>North boxed set for Alustriel's sons? Bob in Streams of Silver? fr5
>Savage Frontier? Don't know where that ref might be, myself....

Actually, I found it in the back of 7 Sisters, under Alustriel's bit in the campaign use chapter. They allegedly all use the surname Aerasume, which translates to Silverymoon, though I'm going to amend that and scatter their surnames among our three options now (though all with the same father). Their names are (alphabetically) Andelver, Boesild, Dolthauvin, Elinthalar, Ghaelryss, Inthylyn, Lilinthar, Methrammar, Naerond, Raerilarr, Tarthilmor, and Uoundeld. They seem to have connections to the Harpers (since they can contact Cylyria Dragonbreast and Sharanralee of Everlund as well as Mom....).

Tarthilmor Aerasume (CG hem F11/W12) is set as one of the two Captains of the Spellguard under Jorus Azuremantle. DRAGON ANNUAL #1, p60

Methrammar Aerasume, the Shining Guard (LG hem F14/W12) and commander of Luruar's armies. THE NORTH, Cities p55

At this point, here's my suggestions for birthdates and whatnot on these guys (of whom there are now 17, but 5 of them are either unknown to the Silverymoon folks but famous within the Moonwood and their father's people or are dead:

Alustriel Silverhand + Taerntym Tanagathor/"Taern Moonweather" (sorta married, at least as elves go...)

Dalbrant Tanagathor (1240 - 1313?) Disappeared while on quest for Taerntym

Hardorbryn Tanagathor (1242 - 1343) Twin of Alondel; died in battle with the Moonlight Men

Alondel Tanagathor (1242 - 1343) Twin of Hardorbryn; died in battle with the Moonlight Men

Boesild Aerasume (1244 - ?) Oldest known/acknowledged surviving son of Alustriel; former apprentice of Khelben the Elder just after he left Waterdeep in 1256; now part of the Teukiira/Moonstars.

Elnriyr Moonweather (1250 - 1347) Priest of Sehanine; died in the fire that destroys Everdusk Hall

Baerndar Tanagathor (1266 - ?)

Uoundeld of Silverymoon (1269 - ?) Teacher at the Lady's College (Tactical & Strategic Spellcasting)

Dolthauvin Aerasume (1295 - ?) Wanderer in the Moonwood & Coldwood

Elinthalar Tanagathor (1299 - ?) Twin of Andelver; wanderer of Lurkwood

Andelver Tressymfriend (1299 - ?) Twin of Elinthalar; wanderer of Lurkwood

Methrammar Aerasume (1304 - ?) The Shining Guard & most recognized son of Alustriel

Inthylyn of Silverymoon (1314 - ?) ?????????????????

Lilinthar Moonweather (1337 - ?) Triplet brother of Naerond & Tarthilmor; huntmaster of Moonweather clan in Moonwood?

Naerond Aerasume (1337 - ?) Triplet brother of Lilinthar & Tarthilmor; crusader/mage for Mystra?

Tarthilmor Aerasume (1337 - ?) Triplet brother of Naerond & Lilinthar; Spell Captain of the Spellguard in Silverymoon

Raerilarr Aerasume (1340 - ?) Smallest of Tall Ones at 6'7" and nicknamed "Tiny" by brothers; most hot-tempered of brothers, rabid drow hunter (and prejudiced vs. dwarves for some reason)

Ghaelryss the Bold (1345 - ?) Uses no surname, raised in Silverymoon, living in Everlund?

I see the younger ones bonding more like brothers, while the older ones (especially those among the elves) are almost more like uncles or foster fathers to the others, as Alustriel got too busy to help raise the children in the 1270s and 1340s (see Silverymoon timeline). How their levels and abilities differ, and how their deific backgrounds (as grandchildren of Mystra) might be reflected along with their half-elven blood is yet unknown--I see a few with silver hair, all of them with longer lifespans than average half-elves, and enhanced abilities almost equal to full elves (due to ties to Weave, including reverie rather than sleep).

How's that? With this being the case, I've adopted Boesild as my regional contact for Khelben, and we can easily ensconce him in the Vault of the Sages or the Lady's College in Silverymoon. That work for you?

SES
Go to Top of Page

The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 15 Mar 2004 :  02:56:26  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Ed has sent me his latest responses, and accordingly:

Foxhelm, I’ve no idea if there will ever be a collection of the Wizards Three tales. Given that 2nd Edition is fading into the publishing past, I doubt it. I’ve always intended to write more of those wonderful evening get-togethers, and the fate of Dalamar was the impediment that slowed and then stopped them. As far as I understand the current Dragonlance licensing situation, there may still be an impediment. I do have a future DRAGON column in the works, but no time, just now, to get to work on it.
As I’ve said before, I’ve no control over what Realms products get published. To play the time-honored-among-all-gamers-of-a-certain-age “If * I * Ran TSR” game: if I’d been controlling Realms publications, you’d have seen a Border Kingdoms sourcebook, an expanded Wyrms of the North collection, a Wizards Three product, and a Nine Hells sourcebook long ago, to say nothing of about another dozen Volo’s Guides, a Cormyr sourcebook -- and probably my tombstone, too: Here lies Ed, dead of overwork. :}
As for an all-Realms moot of mages, that’s an intriguing idea that I’ll have to talk to WotC about. (The original Wizards Three series began when the then-editor of DRAGON asked me to do something that would link all three TSR campaign ‘worlds.’) Thanks for thinking of the Wizards Three tales. They were LOTS of fun to do, even if (by the end, with changes in editorship) I was being forced to cut back on repartee and characterization, and give more and more spells. (Originally, I’d intended to put in a lot more magical processes, such as how to make spell inks, the order in which to cast warding spells to create magical defenses around a keep or a tent, and so on.)

So saith Ed. The Hooded One, continuing with her promised glimpses of Realmsplay in the original ‘home’ campaign:
One session, the Knights spent a frustrating day travelling through Tilver’s Gap and battling “highroad-blades” (brigands) and monsters all along the way. Just before nightfall, we reached an isolated way-inn (not on any Realms maps) just west of Daggerdale -- and, still hearing bugbear and hobgoblin calls around and ahead of us, and darkness swiftly drawing down, we decided to spend the ruinous prices and stay the night.
The Helm and Hearth looked like the onetime fortress it had once been, and its common-room was a tense, unhappy assembly of travellers (rival merchants, Sembians demanding debt-repayments from Cormyrean traders, Zhent agents, a family fleeing Hillsfar for reasons of their own, some half-orc hireswords who’d been firmly disarmed at the gates, a few dwarves who didn’t think much of the ale on offer, and so on) who’d have been at each other’s throats in an instant if it hadn’t been for the numerous and well-armed inn guards.
Our problem was this: not only did some of the other guests recognize us and want us swiftly dead, Florin recognized some of the guards as longtime Purple Dragons -- AND was certain he’d seen the innkeeper lying dead (in bodies he expected the Zhent-ordered orc patrols would have soon gathered, cooked, and eaten) at the north end of Daggerdale on our trip out.
So there was a LOT of creeping around the creaking old upper floor (and roof) of the inn, all through that night, with daggers being plunged enthusiastically into bodies, someone setting a fire that someone else quenched with a spell (and we’d seen no other wizards!), and so on. Ed was masterful at playing all the NPC parts, and we all ended up in a very interesting confrontation in the inn pantry, with Jhessail and an undercover War Wizard both threatening to blast each other to greet the gods (with all the rest of us, and most of that end of the inn, too), RIGHT NOW.
When it all got sorted out, it was revealed that a Cormyrean ‘under the cloak’ (undercover) force had infiltrated the inn because of fears that the longtime smuggling base had been taken over by the Zhents. That wasn’t true -- yet. However, they were suspicious of the innkeeper for the same reason we were: they’d arrested the man and carried him off to prison in Tilverton, so why was he here again, large as life, when they thought he was still safely manacled miles away?
The truth was that the inn was owned by a longtime trading family whose treasures included six masks that bonded to the flesh of anyone who put them on (though they could be removed at will), and these masks made their wearers all look like the same man. The innkeeper we’d collared was the third son of the original, who’d been killed by the Zhents for refusing their offer. The eldest son was the one we’d found dead in Daggerdale, the second son had taken over and promptly been captured by the Cormyreans, and now the third son was trembling with fear at his own impending death, and wondering what his two young sisters were going to do (after all, there WERE two masks left).
Learning of this, the War Wizard wanted the entire set of masks in the worst way (and settled for seizing all that were left to hand), the remnants of the family wanted to stay alive (and accepted an offer of accompanying us to a new life in Shadowdale), and we wanted a decent night’s sleep. So in the morning, all the other guests were ushered out, the Purple Dragons fought and slew the Zhent agent and those inn guards who objected to losing their jobs, and then scoured the place for all signs of smuggling—and we barricaded ourselves in a stone granary with horses, wagons for the family’s belongings, and the family themselves. When we emerged, the Cormyreans were gone, so we left too, arriving in Shadowdale safely.
Within the tenday, the Zhents stormed the place and burned it to the ground. A typical Realms adventure that left some of my fellow players busily making notes of the names of all the new War Wizards and Purple Dragons we’d encountered -- and all of us wondering just where those masks are now, and what use is being made of them.
Go to Top of Page

The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 15 Mar 2004 :  02:58:51  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Herewith, Ed’s next reply:

Lashan, I think my opportunity to do dragons articles has largely slipped away, though I’ll discuss your idea with folks at Wizards (Eric Boyd and Sean Reynolds have both tinkered with updating some of my Realmslore into 3rd Edition form, on the WotC website, and doing new dragons should be right up the old alley, so to speak).
I’ve always viewed the Vast as being rather ‘dragon light’ (in part due to the harvestings done by the mysterious power resident in Ironfang Keep), but you could certainly put a few keeping-low-profiles dragons in all of the places you mention, including the glacier. After all, the orcs and various herds in the ‘eastern tongue’ grasslands of the Vast (the Fire River valley) provide ready food sources for some dragon types.

So saith Ed. The Hooded One, recounting very briefly another memorable night of Realmsplay: Shaerl Rowanmantle was hosting some of her fellow Rowanmantles, other noble Cormryreans, and courtiers (a visiting embassy to her and her husband Lord Mourngrym, whom the Forest Kingdom was most anxious to subvertxx ahem, gain as an ally in the Dales). Mourngrym asked we Knights to attend (and prevent any War Wizard funny business), and we did so—only to discover that a powerful War Wizard was present in the delegation and using magic against us that went awry when clashing with our spells. The result was a wild evening of people’s minds temporarily inhabiting other people’s bodies, without warning or control. Thankfully, most of us Knights ended up swapping with each other, most of the time, but the results were still dangerous and at the same time screamingly-British-farce-funny, as a Shaerl who wasn’t Shaerl went off to bed with a Mourngrym who wasn’t Mourngrym, a War Wizard tried to plot with another War Wizard who was actually Torm, an overamorous courtier tried to seduce a chambermaid who was really Rathan, another courtier tried to bribe information out of the scullery maid who was really Jhessail, and the sly, snivelling junior War Wizard whom everyone in the Cormyrean party disliked even more than his hosts of Shadowdale did ended up in Jhessail’s body talking to a VERY suspicious Merith, whilst Florin ended up in HIS body.
We literally laughed ourselves to tears a couple of times, but agreed that there was no way Ed could do this in a novel and not give editors too much of a headache to ever inflict it on readers. Ed capped the joke, months later, by having an ‘aftershock’ that only affected the junior War Wizard and Florin, who briefly swapped bodies again at a moment when Dove was angry with her husband and forcefully telling him so -- and the War Wizard was being caught red-eared eavesdropping on the marriage-arrangement negotiations of two Cormyrean noble patriarchs planning the hitch the daughter of one to the son of the other for purely financial reasons. The results were, well, hilarious all over again.
And to SiriusBlack and to Lady Elaine: point taken, but I was trying to polite -- and if you knew what Volo did to one of my characters, in-game, you’d know why I have no reason at all to be either charitable or polite to him! :}
Go to Top of Page

SiriusBlack
Great Reader

USA
5517 Posts

Posted - 15 Mar 2004 :  03:01:14  Show Profile  Visit SiriusBlack's Homepage Send SiriusBlack a Private Message
Here's a question for Ed Greenwood:

I am reading the sample chapter for Elminster's Daughter and liking what I have read so far. However, on the title page, I've noticed underneath a certain author's name there is a symbol now that I don't recall ever being there before. Is the pipe something new or did I fall asleep and miss its addition? If new, is this something just for the Elminster series? Only for when you write a Realms novel?

Thanks in advance and from the few pages I've read so far, Wow! Remind me never to borrow money in Waterdeep.
Go to Top of Page

The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 15 Mar 2004 :  03:02:29  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Yes, I’m back with another of Ed’s replies:


Dargoth, I’m a little puzzled by your question. Why would Darkhope’s parentage matter to the current rulership of Scardale, one way or the other? Despite his claims at the time of his attempted conquest, Lashan isn’t seen by many in the Dales to have been the “rightful” ruler of anywhere except by brute force -- and there haven’t exactly been a shortage of brute-force rulers in the Dragonreach lands over the last few centuries. :}
Yet if this matter of lineage is important in your campaign, Atlar probably would be the nearest acceptable arbitrator. My reading of his alignment would be that he couldn’t do anything but tell the truth about her heritage, as he saw it (it’s up to you how good his temple records will be), and I believe you overestimate public knowledge of, or regard for, ties to the Harpers. (It’s a little like hearing vague rumors that someone might once have voted for a fringe political party without quite daring to ask them, and not having any real evidence as to their politics at all, one way or another. Remember, rumors about the Harpers and other power groups and shadowy organizations fly around the Realms like birds in spring.)
As I’ve said before, it’s quite incorrect to view most Realms NPCs (who aren’t priests or paladins or something of the sort) as having a single deity: everybody makes appeasement prayers to all sorts of deities, tending to worship a single one only if their situation dictates it (farmers praying mainly to Chauntea and appeasing mainly Talos, for example). However, my play notes indicate that Lashan did openly pray to Bane on one occasion in his battles around Essembra, if that helps.

So saith Ed. The Hooded One, signing off with just one more little Ed memory: we Knights carefully stalked, planned, and laid a trap for a certain wily Zhentarim wizard -- and when the time was right, we pounced. The place was a farmhouse on the northern outskirts of Voonlar, the battle was fierce (there were other Zhentarim mages with him, plus a nasty little spell-lure that we dubbed “beholder in a box”), and the place ended up as an inferno. We were satisfied that we’d finally managed to eliminate this murderer, and Torm was really pleased because he’d managed to loot the place first. His biggest prize was a gem the size of a small fist, which -- fighting still being fierce -- he stowed in his codpiece.
He was quite perturbed when the gem just vanished, after he’d put it on his mantle to admire back in Shadowdale and be called out of the room by Storm Silverhand (Ed) to apologize for a prank he’d played. We were ALL perturbed when we figured out that Torm had helpfully smuggled our intended Zhentarim target out of danger and into our midst (temporarily spell-disguised as the gem, of course). :}
Go to Top of Page

The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 15 Mar 2004 :  03:24:21  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
As it happens, Ed and I are e-catching up, so here’s an arrow-swift reply, SiriusBlack:


Glad you’ve enjoyed the little glimpse. I had a blast writing it; romp time! Romp time!
Yes, that little logo of Elminster’s Eversmoking Pipe denotes a novel in the Elminster series. May there be many more. :}
Ed

And there you have it. Gods above and below, I can’t wait for the Waterdeep book. I’ll just have to make do with The Silent House, I guess.
THO
Go to Top of Page

Blueblade
Senior Scribe

USA
804 Posts

Posted - 15 Mar 2004 :  03:51:36  Show Profile  Visit Blueblade's Homepage Send Blueblade a Private Message
Saw that sample chapter, too. Loved it! Great! More, more!
Go to Top of Page

ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author

2290 Posts

Posted - 15 Mar 2004 :  04:13:57  Show Profile  Visit ElaineCunningham's Homepage Send ElaineCunningham a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
And to SiriusBlack and to Lady Elaine: point taken, but I was trying to polite -- and if you knew what Volo did to one of my characters, in-game, you’d know why I have no reason at all to be either charitable or polite to him! :}



What heinous thing could Volo have done to evoke such ire? Hmmm... Perhaps he broadcast information about troop movements, thereby endangering the entire party?
Go to Top of Page

Dargoth
Great Reader

Australia
4569 Posts

Posted - 15 Mar 2004 :  04:15:33  Show Profile  Visit Dargoth's Homepage Send Dargoth a Private Message
Ed said: "Dargoth, I’m a little puzzled by your question. Why would Darkhope’s parentage matter to the current rulership of Scardale, one way or the other? Despite his claims at the time of his attempted conquest, Lashan isn’t seen by many in the Dales to have been the “rightful” ruler of anywhere except by brute force "

Wasnt Scardale a Heridatory monarchy?

The Scardale entry in the grey boxset says Lashan Aumersair inherited the dale from his father Uluf which I assume means it was a monarchy. If thats true and Scyllua is Lashans daughter then she would have a "legitimate" claim to Scardale.

“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”

Emperor Sigismund

"Its good to be the King!"

Mel Brooks
Go to Top of Page

Alexander Heppe
Seeker

Germany
62 Posts

Posted - 15 Mar 2004 :  08:35:28  Show Profile  Visit Alexander Heppe's Homepage  Send Alexander Heppe an AOL message Send Alexander Heppe a Private Message
Well, it´s been quite some time since your reply, THO and Ed, but anyway... Thank you so much for your inspiring response to my "visualizing" question.

Some of your answers (what area resembles which area on earth) I really could have anticipated, the most ones invoked my urge to travel even more than I do already.

According to some parts you described of the Silver Marches, I now have the answer why ceratain places "felt" so familiar when I was in Alaska last summer... (Honeymooning in Alaska, simply great!!)

Now you really made me want to travel the British Islands. (mmh.. maybe in conjunction with a short visit of GenCon Europe, I think...)
Go to Top of Page

The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 15 Mar 2004 :  14:55:55  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Lady Elaine, Volo did the prying journalist thing, publicly trying to worm information out of some Cormyrean nobles that would have endangered Shadowdale in the face of Zhent mobilizations – and the worm did it in MY name (claiming he’d gotten this info and that info from my character, and just wanted confirmation, because “after all I was but a woman, and woman are given to such wild fancies.”
I believe I judge him rather charitably, because he does such outrageous things with not a whit of Torm’s charm.
Go to Top of Page

The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 15 Mar 2004 :  15:01:01  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message

Dargoth, here’s Ed’s reply:

Ah, my apologies. Here’s where the simplification of the Realms to put it in print slaps us all. In the ‘home’ Realms, there were and are (though no one is daring to pursue them, any longer) several claims from various members of that family, and Lashan’s was by no means the strongest/most direct. So there are persons still alive in Faerun who have a stronger claim to the throne than a daughter of Lashan, and the counter-argument that “yes, but he actually ruled” brings us right back to “might makes right/possession is all.”
The public view of Lashan in the Dales is the same in Scardale as elsewhere: he brought death and strife and lawlessness and loss to us all by his cruel, grasping ambition . . . so now you want to give us MORE of same? If his daughter is anything like him we want no part of her, and if she’s a shy, retiring flower, how could she make a good ruler? No, let the past be the past and a burial to all that – just as we buried so many because of Lashan’s ambitions. Go from this house, and lash our ears no more with such foolishness!
And so on. There’ll be malcontents who’d back Darkhope, but Sembia, the Harpers, Hillsfar, and Tantras (just to name a quick few) want no part of renewed strife in Scardale, and will act firmly to stop it.

So there you have it. Of course (she said teasingly), an attempt to put her in charge anyway looks like great roleplaying opportunities galore to me, and Ed agrees with that. :}

Go to Top of Page
Page: of 81 Previous Topic Topic   
Previous Page | Next Page
 New Topic  Topic Locked
 Printer Friendly
Jump To:
Candlekeep Forum © 1999-2017 Candlekeep.com Go To Top Of Page
Snitz Forums 2000