Candlekeep Forum
Candlekeep Forum
Home | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Active Polls | Members | Private Messages | Search | FAQ
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 Forgotten Realms Journals
 General Forgotten Realms Chat
 Magic: The Gathering Movie confirmed. Is D&D Next?
 New Topic  New Poll New Poll
 Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Next Page
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic
Page: of 2

Dark Wizard
Senior Scribe

USA
830 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  02:25:25  Show Profile Send Dark Wizard a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
Hollywood Reporter has an article (Link) about Hasbro inking a deal with 20th Century Fox for a Magic: The Gathering movie franchise. They've signed writer-producer Simon Kinberg (Fox's X-Men and Fantastic Four franchises) to lead the development.

I noticed the article said Hasbro, which means it's the head office making the movie decisions, not Wizards of the Coast. Makes sense as these are expensive efforts and they need the big shots calling all the shots. The potential benefits reach into the billion dollar range if they launch a successful movie franchise (and sell more Magic cards, novels, merchandise) and that's not even talking about LotR or Harry Potter numbers. I'm sure Hasbro is hoping for Transformer numbers or even GI Joe numbers (and not Battleship numbers).

The relevance to the Realms and D&D. Well it gives extra urgency to the lawsuit Hasbro has with the previous (current) D&D movie producer and the studio he's signed with, since Hasbro wants to launch its own D&D movie effort. It seems the Hasbro giant has awoken and is hungry for more big movie franchises made from its IP.

It's D&D's 40th Anniversary this year, and MtG's 20th Anniversary. Despite the card game doing better business, it's D&D that holds more cultural significance.

If Hasbro cannot get a generic D&D movie off the ground, do you think they would resort to using one of the settings to launch a movie instead, such as Dragonlance or Forgotten Realms?

Edited by - Dark Wizard on 14 Jan 2014 02:28:24

The Arcanamach
Master of Realmslore

1842 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  02:51:39  Show Profile Send The Arcanamach a Private Message  Reply with Quote
*sigh* The problem is a movie has to be done RIGHT. The last DnD movie was awful and I don't hold out hope for a better one. Don't get me wrong. A FR movie would be great and I would pay to see it...but Hasbro would need to get the right Directors, producers, and writers to make it work and they would need to get good actors willing to play in it. I'm not sure how many talented actors with enough popularity to pull a mainstream audience would be willing to participate.

I have a dream that one day, all game worlds will exist as one.
Go to Top of Page

sfdragon
Great Reader

2285 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  03:06:12  Show Profile Send sfdragon a Private Message  Reply with Quote
the dragonlance one stunk....

as for one in the FR or even Greyhawk, it would still have to depend on what it was on.

For instance one in Greyhawk, you would want to do it on the Temple of Elemental evil. One in the realms....Eye of the Beholder or something

why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power


My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234
Go to Top of Page

Dark Wizard
Senior Scribe

USA
830 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  04:40:09  Show Profile Send Dark Wizard a Private Message  Reply with Quote
If the movies made from Hasbro's other IP are any example, best we can hope for are loose adaptations of decades worth of material, seeing as Transformers and GI Joe have numerous comics and TV series. The movies will disregard those, opting instead to highlight one major plot or villain per movie. Some main characters (heroes and adversaries) will carry over from each movie to the next, but the line-up changes.

That is if they don't invent something entirely new, like for Battleship, but understandable since Battleship never had a semblance of a setting or plot.

Count on the look and/or personalities of characters to be altered for the movie adaptation. The character names seem to survive translation intact.
Go to Top of Page

Madpig
Learned Scribe

Finland
148 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  06:02:17  Show Profile Send Madpig a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by The Arcanamach

*sigh* The problem is a movie has to be done RIGHT. The last DnD movie was awful and I don't hold out hope for a better one. Don't get me wrong. A FR movie would be great and I would pay to see it...but Hasbro would need to get the right Directors, producers, and writers to make it work and they would need to get good actors willing to play in it. I'm not sure how many talented actors with enough popularity to pull a mainstream audience would be willing to participate.



One actor who has really big pulling force is Vin Diesel. He has even written to Dragon in the past. He would surely participate. Orlando Bloom would also be a good kandidate.
Go to Top of Page

sfdragon
Great Reader

2285 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  07:15:35  Show Profile Send sfdragon a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Johnny Depp might be a good candidate too.... he does a mean pirate... should make a good rogue too.......ar ye savvy....

why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power


My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234
Go to Top of Page

Thauranil
Master of Realmslore

India
1591 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  07:47:23  Show Profile Send Thauranil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'm glad Wizards of the Coast is making some progress in adapting their products to the big screen but I would have preferred it if FR which has richer source material and soooo much unexplored potential were to be brought to life in the hands of a good director.
Go to Top of Page

Dalor Darden
Great Reader

USA
4211 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  08:18:01  Show Profile Send Dalor Darden a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Madpig

quote:
Originally posted by The Arcanamach

*sigh* The problem is a movie has to be done RIGHT. The last DnD movie was awful and I don't hold out hope for a better one. Don't get me wrong. A FR movie would be great and I would pay to see it...but Hasbro would need to get the right Directors, producers, and writers to make it work and they would need to get good actors willing to play in it. I'm not sure how many talented actors with enough popularity to pull a mainstream audience would be willing to participate.



THIS...

Vin would be an awesome actor for a movie based on D&D...as long as it had a solid director.

One actor who has really big pulling force is Vin Diesel. He has even written to Dragon in the past. He would surely participate. Orlando Bloom would also be a good kandidate.


The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me!
Go to Top of Page

ZeshinX
Learned Scribe

Canada
210 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  13:52:23  Show Profile  Visit ZeshinX's Homepage Send ZeshinX a Private Message  Reply with Quote
D&D has had four chances being made into a movie (three live-action ones and the animated Dragonlance one). They have all been abject crap. If there is a fifth attempt, I'm going to make the prediction that it will also be utter garbage and not worth anyone's money. I'm sorry if that's a defeatist or negative attitude, but the track record speaks for itself.

"...because despite the best advice of those who know what they are talking about, other people insist on doing the most massively stupid things."
-Galen, technomage

Edited by - ZeshinX on 14 Jan 2014 14:03:03
Go to Top of Page

Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
36779 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  14:18:29  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ZeshinX

D&D has had four chances being made into a movie (three live-action ones and the animated Dragonlance one). They have all been abject crap. If there is a fifth attempt, I'm going to make the prediction that it will also be utter garbage and not worth anyone's money. I'm sorry if that's a defeatist or negative attitude, but the track record speaks for itself.



There were multiple attempts at making movies from The Lord of the Rings, too. Pretty sure the last attempt proved that the prior attempts can be ignored.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
Go to Top of Page

sfdragon
Great Reader

2285 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  14:41:39  Show Profile Send sfdragon a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by ZeshinX

D&D has had four chances being made into a movie (three live-action ones and the animated Dragonlance one). They have all been abject crap. If there is a fifth attempt, I'm going to make the prediction that it will also be utter garbage and not worth anyone's money. I'm sorry if that's a defeatist or negative attitude, but the track record speaks for itself.



There were multiple attempts at making movies from The Lord of the Rings, too. Pretty sure the last attempt proved that the prior attempts can be ignored.



without saying.

many of them had bad animation or varied off from the novel .....

why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power


My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234
Go to Top of Page

ZeshinX
Learned Scribe

Canada
210 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  15:21:52  Show Profile  Visit ZeshinX's Homepage Send ZeshinX a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Oh I'm not suggesting it's impossible, just unlikely. The holders of the D&D brand, Hasbro, seem to treat it with a casual disdain, like it's the unwanted baggage that came with the WotC acquisition. Of course that's just a feeling, not fact. If there's any truth to that feeling, I wouldn't expect to see much in the way of support for a D&D movie.

Though to inject something more positive instead of just being a dark cloud, I would have much greater enthusiasm and hope regarding a D&D TV and/or mini-series (like Once Upon A Time or Game of Thrones).

"...because despite the best advice of those who know what they are talking about, other people insist on doing the most massively stupid things."
-Galen, technomage

Edited by - ZeshinX on 14 Jan 2014 15:26:29
Go to Top of Page

SirUrza
Master of Realmslore

USA
1283 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  16:35:22  Show Profile Send SirUrza a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I think the problem is that as long as it's treated as "Dungeons & Dragons" we'll see generic crap fantasy. The movie has to have a focal point. Existing and recognizable branding BEYOND Dungeons & Dragons that guide the creative forces.

Drizzt and the Companions of the Hall remain our best chance for a "good" movie.

Magic the Gathering as a movie could be a visual spectacular of spellslinging littered with MTG troupes and lore that people can reference right back to the flavor text of the original sets and themes of the modern game or it'll be generic crap fantasy.

"Evil prevails when good men fail to act."
The original and unapologetic Arilyn, Aribeth, Seoni Fanboy.

Edited by - SirUrza on 14 Jan 2014 16:37:41
Go to Top of Page

Werthead
Learned Scribe

United Kingdom
165 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  19:10:40  Show Profile  Visit Werthead's Homepage Send Werthead a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hasbro WERE attempting to do this. Unfortunately, it all blew up because Sweetpea Entertainment - the company run by Courtney Solomon that made the three live-action D&D movies (the Jeremy Irons one, WRATH OF THE DRAGON GOD and BOOK OF VILE DARKNESS) - disputed Hasbro's attempt to use the rights.

http://thewertzone.blogspot.co.uk/2013/11/d-movie-rights-battle-escalates.html

The argument runs that Sweetpea failed to uphold their end of the bargain - by making a theatrical or straight-to-video/DVD movie once every five years - because the third film was a TV movie (it aired on SyFy before hitting DVD). Sweetpea are disputing that. Both companies have film studios backing them: Warner Brothers were working on a new film with Solomon and Sweetpea, whilst Universal are in talks with Hasbro and WotC.

The matter is going before judges and there will be a legal ruling in March in LA to determine who actually has the rights. Quite a lot of money is riding on this.

Complicating matters more is what the rights entail. Sweetpea/Solomon's rights only cover the core D&D rulebooks and the various creatures, spells etc in them. He certainly does not have the rights to FORGOTTEN REALMS, DRAGONLANCE or any of the individual novels. If Hasbro lost the court case, they could in theory still do, say, a Drizzt movie, but they'd have to remove any D&D-specific elements from it (no Melf's Acid Arrows or beholders, for example). Things which are generic fantasy tropes - fireballs, elves, dwarves - should be okay. It's unclear where drow fit into the equation.

Anyway, if and when we get a new D&D movie is dependent on the aforementioned legal battle getting sorted out.
Go to Top of Page

Diffan
Great Reader

USA
4425 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  20:50:44  Show Profile Send Diffan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Basically anything that has been removed from the 3.5 SRD site is off the table. If you notice, it's a few monsters (Beholders, Mindflayers, etc) and the wizard's names removed from spells (Melf's Acid Arrow to just acid arrow). Basically anything on the SRD is open content and thus, allowed to be features in some way in the movie (meaning using the terms of the classes such as Barbarian or Paladin, Drow, and even magical items).
Go to Top of Page

sfdragon
Great Reader

2285 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  20:59:07  Show Profile Send sfdragon a Private Message  Reply with Quote
meh..... they should just do what they did with the pc game license. Just license it per movie.

let the other guy do generic dnd, let universal do setting specific movies......

besides.. Warner Brothers wont stick their names on next film if they think the first one is crap.

why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power


My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234
Go to Top of Page

Dark Wizard
Senior Scribe

USA
830 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  22:40:59  Show Profile Send Dark Wizard a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ZeshinX

Oh I'm not suggesting it's impossible, just unlikely. The holders of the D&D brand, Hasbro, seem to treat it with a casual disdain, like it's the unwanted baggage that came with the WotC acquisition. Of course that's just a feeling, not fact. If there's any truth to that feeling, I wouldn't expect to see much in the way of support for a D&D movie.


I wouldn't say Hasbro treats D&D with disdain, at least no more than any other property under their control (which is to say, none at all).

Linking an article (Here) from a couple of years ago right at the cusp of 4E's (premature) waning days and the announcement of D&D Next. It provides a brief history of Hasbro's relationship with WotC throughout the 3E era and into the transition to 4E. More importantly it reveals why WotC went about 4E the way they did.

How does the old adage go? Don't attribute to 'malice' what can be attributed to 'greed'. In this case it's not even greed. As a for-profit company, Hasbro/WotC has to make money or wither away, it's simple capitalism (and even more basic than that, pure general economics).

Toys aren't the business the used to be (even before there were ups and downs). Manufacturing costs are rising (material and labor costs are rising in Asia where everyone contracts or built factories) at the same time physical/analog toys are declining in popularity due to the popularity of electronic/digital toys and games.

The execs at Hasbro noticed the trends and saw the success of Marvel (in the similarly declining business of comicbooks) converting their IP into successful, big budget (with big box office intake) movie franchises. Ergo Transformers and GI Joe, and Battleship (well, they can't all be winners, right?). They're basically doing the best thing they could right now, turning toys into transmedia phenomenon. The alternative is to let IP sit fallow until they have a plan to redesign/refresh/reactivate it for the next generation.

The Core Brands ($50 million annual sales with plans for $100 mil growth) and the Non-Core Brands (sub-$50 mil properties) may seem arbitrary to us, but it's simply a company focusing its limited resources on the furthering its success. More success actually means they can afford to expand the other IP in their control, just as Marvel is expending their cinematic (also, television & digital streaming) universe with more heroes. They're moving into second and third tier characters now (characters who wouldn't get the light of day in other environments).

Magic the Gathering is a Core Brand and the movie deal is likely going to further the brand (and its prospects for sales & profit), whether the movie is good or bad (it's a giant advertisement on the silver screen). As long as the movie delivers some passably satisfying fantasy action, most people will probably be satisfied enough and keep buying Magic cards (or try the game if they haven't before).

D&D doesn't have the numbers of a Core Brand and in that light, the actions of the WotC team to do something different with 4E (rules innovation, shake up for the Realms, the push towards DDI) makes a lot of sense. I disagree with their execution, but I don't fault them for trying. If they were successful with pushing 4E past $50 million annual, it means they would have put D&D on the radar of Hasbro, which means more access to funds and promotion. Success builds success. It was a bit of a gamble sure, but if they did nothing, under Hasbro's policies and business model at the time, D&D may well be one of those brands shelved for a decade.

Fortunately, corporate memory is only as long as the guys who failed to reach goals and quotas is on the job (most of the 4E team is gone now, either let go or left on their own). While not a fresh start, 5E is a second chance.

I don't think Hasbro has it out for D&D (maybe that was the case in the last days of TSR). The executives at Hasbro have every reason to get successful franchises producing greater and greater numbers. Otherwise they wouldn't spend the lawyer fees on the D&D movie lawsuit. I think Hasbro understands the value of D&D, they just have a different definition of value from us gamers. I'm okay with that considering the alternative (and the current state of D&D movies).

quote:
Originally posted by ZeshinX

Though to inject something more positive instead of just being a dark cloud, I would have much greater enthusiasm and hope regarding a D&D TV and/or mini-series (like Once Upon A Time or Game of Thrones).



We can only hope.
I think it's more feasible if they produce an animated TV series, since Hasbro partly owns Hub Network, a children's channel that also airs Transformer, GI Joe, and My Little Pony cartoons.

If the MtG movie is successful, even mildly, I think we'll see a Magic cartoon show.

Edited by - Dark Wizard on 14 Jan 2014 22:45:17
Go to Top of Page

Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 14 Jan 2014 :  23:25:24  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Werthead

If Hasbro lost the court case, they could in theory still do, say, a Drizzt movie, but they'd have to remove any D&D-specific elements from it (no Melf's Acid Arrows or beholders, for example). Things which are generic fantasy tropes - fireballs, elves, dwarves - should be okay. It's unclear where drow fit into the equation.
Doing a Drizzt movie without any Drow would be just a tad bit hard.

A big studio would probably want to play-up 'the race card' anyway - you know, the 'Forbidden Romance', like in Twilight. In fact, they'd probably focus it for that sort of audience (and the Hunger Games crowd, etc). 'Young Adults' are the demographic to shoot for these days.

So young, angsty characters led by a gruff, old dwarf. Sounds about right. They have to kill-off Bruenor, though, to get the formula right. The mentor has to die for the others to get all, "We can do this!". If they do the script correctly, they can even bring him back in the end (cut his way out of the dragon's belly?)

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

Go to Top of Page

Caolin
Senior Scribe

768 Posts

Posted - 15 Jan 2014 :  01:03:58  Show Profile Send Caolin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I personally do not want to see any form of live action Realms movie. There just isn't enough interest from the general public to insure that it will be taken seriously by any film makers. It would be a slapped together "let's catch the GoT wave" type movie. Magic may get better treatment due to it's widespread popularity.

I'm also highly skeptical that a high-fantasy movie can ever be done right. Most screenwriters and directors don't get the subject matter and so they tend to make fun of it rather than treat it as a serious vehicle for story telling. LotR and GoT differ in that they are a much more muted form of fantasy compared to Magic or the Realms. Just look at that gods awful DnD movie from 2000. It was a straight up joke.
Go to Top of Page

ZeshinX
Learned Scribe

Canada
210 Posts

Posted - 15 Jan 2014 :  01:14:22  Show Profile  Visit ZeshinX's Homepage Send ZeshinX a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I hereby stand well rebuked by Dark Wizard.

"...because despite the best advice of those who know what they are talking about, other people insist on doing the most massively stupid things."
-Galen, technomage

Edited by - ZeshinX on 15 Jan 2014 01:14:48
Go to Top of Page

ZeshinX
Learned Scribe

Canada
210 Posts

Posted - 15 Jan 2014 :  01:17:30  Show Profile  Visit ZeshinX's Homepage Send ZeshinX a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Caolin

I personally do not want to see any form of live action Realms movie. There just isn't enough interest from the general public to insure that it will be taken seriously by any film makers. It would be a slapped together "let's catch the GoT wave" type movie. Magic may get better treatment due to it's widespread popularity.

I'm also highly skeptical that a high-fantasy movie can ever be done right. Most screenwriters and directors don't get the subject matter and so they tend to make fun of it rather than treat it as a serious vehicle for story telling. LotR and GoT differ in that they are a much more muted form of fantasy compared to Magic or the Realms. Just look at that gods awful DnD movie from 2000. It was a straight up joke.




Indeed. I got up and left when they distracted the beholder, a creature with prehensile eyestalks...with a thrown rock.

Still, if you think that one was bad, hoo boy, check out the two follow ups! Every once in a while I watch them with buddies, just to laugh at the immense terribleness of them all.

"...because despite the best advice of those who know what they are talking about, other people insist on doing the most massively stupid things."
-Galen, technomage
Go to Top of Page

Barastir
Master of Realmslore

Brazil
1600 Posts

Posted - 15 Jan 2014 :  13:23:15  Show Profile Send Barastir a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Caolin

I personally do not want to see any form of live action Realms movie. There just isn't enough interest from the general public to insure that it will be taken seriously by any film makers.
(...)
I'm also highly skeptical that a high-fantasy movie can ever be done right.

I agree, in part. Even LoTR and the Hobbit movies sometimes disappoint me, but in general fantasy movies got way better than they were some years ago. Maybe some B-movies are part of the process, and in the future better movies will be made. See the Marvel and other superhero movies: the ones made until the 90s were awful, but today we have nice movies.

PS: Is D&D Next? No, but it will be this Summer, apparently.

"Goodness is not a natural state, but must be
fought for to be attained and maintained.
Lead by example.
Let your deeds speak your intentions.
Goodness radiated from the heart."

The Paladin's Virtues, excerpt from the "Quentin's Monograph"
(by Ed Greenwood)

Edited by - Barastir on 15 Jan 2014 13:27:51
Go to Top of Page

Werthead
Learned Scribe

United Kingdom
165 Posts

Posted - 15 Jan 2014 :  17:30:01  Show Profile  Visit Werthead's Homepage Send Werthead a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
I don't think Hasbro has it out for D&D (maybe that was the case in the last days of TSR). The executives at Hasbro have every reason to get successful franchises producing greater and greater numbers. Otherwise they wouldn't spend the lawyer fees on the D&D movie lawsuit. I think Hasbro understands the value of D&D, they just have a different definition of value from us gamers. I'm okay with that considering the alternative (and the current state of D&D movies).


Yup. Hasbro sees the value of D&D: The Franchise, not just D&D: The Game. If the RPG doesn't do well, but the novels keep selling and the computer games keep selling (and NEVERWINTER has been reasonably successful and the BALDUR'S GATE relaunch has apparently done better than expected), Hasbro will focus more on those areas than the RPG. A situation where the RPG simply ceases to exist - if only for a few years - but books, comics and video games keep coming out is quite possible, if dismaying for RP fans.
Go to Top of Page

BEAST
Master of Realmslore

USA
1714 Posts

Posted - 15 Jan 2014 :  17:30:42  Show Profile  Visit BEAST's Homepage Send BEAST a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Sign me up for (a) Drizzt flick(s)! I'll help with the script, art department, and serve ye up one bad-arse Bruenor.

"'You don't know my history,' he said dryly."
--Drizzt Do'Urden (The Pirate King, Part 1: Chapter 2)

<"Comprehensive Chronology of R.A. Salvatore Forgotten Realms Works">
Go to Top of Page

Dark Wizard
Senior Scribe

USA
830 Posts

Posted - 15 Jan 2014 :  22:52:14  Show Profile Send Dark Wizard a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Barastir


PS: Is D&D Next? No, but it will be this Summer, apparently.



Glad someone pun-ished that title.

quote:
Originally posted by Werthead

Yup. Hasbro sees the value of D&D: The Franchise, not just D&D: The Game. If the RPG doesn't do well, but the novels keep selling and the computer games keep selling (and NEVERWINTER has been reasonably successful and the BALDUR'S GATE relaunch has apparently done better than expected), Hasbro will focus more on those areas than the RPG. A situation where the RPG simply ceases to exist - if only for a few years - but books, comics and video games keep coming out is quite possible, if dismaying for RP fans.



Indeed, they mean D&D: The Franchise and not the RPG.

Thought that was a negative at first also, then I started looking at things happening outside of D&D. Major media (multimedia, transmedia) franchises have PnP RPG games both in the past with a long history stretching decades and many currently active games.

- Star Wars (currently with FFG, formerly WotC, formerly WEG)
- Star Trek (once FASA, LUG, Decipher, I'm missing a couple in between)
- Marvel (recently discontinued Marvel Heroic from MWP, formerly SAGA and Marvel Superheroes from TSR, Marvel published their own diceless system in between)
- DC Comics (currently with Green Ronin's Mutants & Mastermind system, previously with Mayfair and another one or two somewhere)
- LotR (several including the venerable MERP from Iron Crown, CODA system from Decipher, and now The One Ring from Cubicle 7)
- Doctor Who (currently with Cubicle 7)
- Firefly (current, Cortex system based from MWP who licensed a bunch of TV shows for their Cortex system, Smallville, Supernatural, Leverage)
- Everquest (previously d20 based, from Sword & Sorcery, a part of White Wolf)
- World of Warcraft (d20 based with a latter revision, also from S&S I think. I believe there were rumors of something happening with a WoW TTRPG)
- Diablo II (once licensed by TSR/WotC for 2E then 3E)
- Starcraft (once licensed by TSR/WotC for Alternity)
- TMNT (had one, based on Palladium Rifts I believe)
- Dresden Files (currently with Evil Hat Productions using FATE system)
- Dragon Age (currently the AGE system from Green Ronin)
- Conan the Cimmerian (several, including two different attempts from TSR, and the extensive d20 line from Mongoose)
- Solomon Kane (current, using Savage Worlds)
- Jack Vance's Dying Earth (current, from Pelgrane Press)
- Elric (with Chaosium games at some point, maybe still current)
- The Cthulhu Mythos (Call of Cthulhu (current and long standing), plus others)
- Judge Dredd (currently with Mongoose Games I think)
- The Black Company (once licensed by Green Ronin)
- Thieves' World (also once GR)
- Lankhmar/Fafhrd & the Grey Mouser (formerly TSR, then went somewhere else, I want to say Chaosium, could still be current.)
- Street Fighter the RPG (once from White Wolf, using the Storyteller system, believe it or not)
- Various Sci-Fi shows had an RPG (Babylon 5, Farscape, Stargate SG-1). BSG had a board game, but I think there may have been a Cortex-based rpg at once point.

Some of those are getting very niche, in particular the novel and pulp characters. They're known within the genre but not as well known as the major movie franchises. Yet billion dollar franchises such as Star Wars and LotR still license their IP for PnP RPG, which produce dollar amounts worth less than rounding out a few zeroes compared to their main money generators (movies, toys, merchandise, video games, even novels). They still give RPGs the time of day because no one is allergic to money.

On the flip side, we have smaller tabletop RPGs or (wargames) other than D&D making headway into other media.

- Games Workshop's Warhammer 40K and WH Fantasy spawned numberous video games, a big budget MMO, board games, and a novel line.
- Paizo's Pathfinder has an MMO in progress.
- The roots of Wasteland 1 and the upcoming sequel is a modified version of Mercenaries, Spies & Private Eyes, itself a modification of Tunnels & Trolls. Nothing is really happening with that link yet, but if someone wanted to stir the pot, it's a heck of a decent jumpstart.
- Monte Cook's Numenera is the setting for the next Torment (as in Planescape: Torment) game. This one is significant because Monte created and published Numenera after he left the 5E development team, then signed a deal for an old school isometric CRPG (marketed as the spiritual successor of one of the most venerable and highly rated D&D-based CRPGs no less), all before 5E announced a solid release date. This is the CRPG D&D should have put into production to launch on the heels of 5E, thus converting fans of the CRPG to the setting and possibly the tabletop game (this gamer and Realms fan was a BG convert).
- Cyberpunk 2077 is based on Cyberpunk 2020 (designed by Mike Pondsmith, from R. Talsorian Games) from the makers of the Witcher CRPG series using next-gen (well, current gen now) technology. This is probably one of the best examples of a tabletop RPGs turned A-level (or even Triple-A level) video game. Mike Pondsmith is working closely with the team at CD Projekt Red. If this leads to a new edition of the TTRPG, there's a good chance the video game will inspire people to check out the pen and paper version. Basically, this is the video game D&D wished it has in the works.

And they may yet, Hasbro/WotC has the clout and connections to work this out. Around 4E, they pulled (or didn't renew) all their outstanding licenses (Dragonlance and Ravenloft in particular). Recently Bruce Heard (one of the designers of Mystara/Known World) wanted to license that setting. WotC refused. The makers of Torment, inXile Entertainment, wanted to license Planescape for the next Torment game. WotC declined. They're holding tight to their settings (probably the most valuable IP Hasbro obtained from WotC other than D&D and Magic). While this may seem obtuse to us, it could just be the standard NDA type of hold while they're negotiating rights and agreements with partners.

What does this mean for D&D as an RPG? Well, let's take a look at the number suggested in the Dancey article I linked early, he said D&D does something like $25-30 million annual (sans licensing income for video games), 4E was a plan to push them to $50 million sustained on just the PnP RPG and DDI alone.

We don't know that 4E failed (as in went in the red). I have a feeling if it did, there wouldn't be a D&D Next. My guess is it simply didn't make the $50 million mark and in corporate/business terms, it means the managers failed on their projected goal (and thus let go).

What if 4E & DDI brought us to $35-40 or $45 million? Or if the old edition reprints were literally like printing money for WotC? And Hasbro realized there's a lot of unclaimed potential in the D&D franchise, such as the contested movie rights for one, and the debacle with the video game licenses with Atari/Infogrames.

If Hasbro can consolidate all the D&D rights into one entity, D&D could easily bust $100 million. Even at $250 million, the RPG side at $25 million would be 10% of their business. If billion dollar franchises like Star Wars, Marvel, or LotR have RPGs (probably generating less than 1% of their annual sales), then D&D will certainly have an RPG, especially since they're not licensing it to anyone. The RPG is their IP generator, just like the comics are for Marvel. In the transmedia concept, the big corporations want to saturate your eyeballs (and senses) with their franchise; movies (in progress), books (check), comics (check), games (check), toys (see Kre-Os, check).

A strong D&D franchise means the RPG has a better chance to stay active.

Edited by - Dark Wizard on 16 Jan 2014 00:34:31
Go to Top of Page

Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 16 Jan 2014 :  17:53:47  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote

Cautiously hopeful. May they not mess this up. As for the plot, if it is a complete book adaptation, while I like the old stories (The Brothers War, Arena, etc.), I think it would be best if they go for those that are relatively new (Test of Metal, Agents of Artifice, etc.) or at least pick some from the new. I'd welcome a crossover too.

Every beginning has an end.
Go to Top of Page

Thauranil
Master of Realmslore

India
1591 Posts

Posted - 17 Jan 2014 :  14:10:32  Show Profile Send Thauranil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Fantasy is popular right now movies like LOTR, the Hobbit and Tv series like GOT have proved this so frankly I think they should strike while the iron is hot.
However since this is a franchise that most people are unaware of the first movie should at least be well made and have at least a little star power.
Go to Top of Page

Dark Wizard
Senior Scribe

USA
830 Posts

Posted - 17 Jan 2014 :  22:21:12  Show Profile Send Dark Wizard a Private Message  Reply with Quote
This calls for the skills of a veteran, award-winning actor stage-trained on Shakespeare with fantasy and period genre experience... what about Jeremy Irons, perfect candidate to bring some gravitas to the project.

Add another book/TV show to RPG license list:

- Game of Thrones has the Song of Ice and Fire RPG from Green Ronin. They re-released the game with an updated cover (the Game of Thrones Edition) after the TV premier and sales picked up. This is actually the second system for a GoT RPG, an earlier one was based on the d20 system.
Go to Top of Page

Thauranil
Master of Realmslore

India
1591 Posts

Posted - 18 Jan 2014 :  16:43:06  Show Profile Send Thauranil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Jeremy Irons is a good actor but after the Dungeons and Dragons movie fiasco and not to mention Eragon I think his reputation, at least when it comes to fantasy movies is rather stained.
Go to Top of Page

Thauranil
Master of Realmslore

India
1591 Posts

Posted - 18 Jan 2014 :  16:50:05  Show Profile Send Thauranil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Though this scene is pretty awesome whilst being totally ridiculous.
The sweet sound of overacting
Go to Top of Page

Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
36779 Posts

Posted - 21 Jan 2014 :  12:13:59  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Speaking of the M:TG movie... It's discussed in a recent Full Frontal Nerdity comic.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
Go to Top of Page
Page: of 2 Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
Next Page
 New Topic  New Poll New Poll
 Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Jump To:
Candlekeep Forum © 1999-2024 Candlekeep.com Go To Top Of Page
Snitz Forums 2000