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Arimol
Acolyte
United Kingdom
2 Posts |
 Posted - 02 Jun 2012 : 02:19:41
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I know I'm new here but something has been bugging me for a long time. At the end of Waterdeep we get a glimpse that Ao is NOT the overlord of Faeruen, just another pawn. Could this this unknown entity be having a say in what is going on?
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4685 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jun 2012 : 02:25:10
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| Well that has been open to interpretation, the general idea is that AO's overlord is the DM. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jun 2012 : 03:04:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Arimol
Could this this unknown entity be having a say in what is going on?
Absolutely. Though mortals and gods alike would hardly know of it. Ao's "Master" was never mentioned at all after the Waterdeep novel. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jun 2012 : 03:43:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Arimol
Could this this unknown entity be having a say in what is going on?
Absolutely. Though mortals and gods alike would hardly know of it. Ao's "Master" was never mentioned at all after the Waterdeep novel.
In fact, Ao's "master" isn't even known to the Gods. Only the reader of the novel has a clue he exists... |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7966 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jun 2012 : 03:45:25
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Most mortals are unaware of Ao, let alone his peers or masters.
The Faerūnian churches explicitly do not teach of Ao, he receives no official recognition. Various cults of Ao come and go, their priests receive no spells nor communion with Ao (although other deities have impersonated Ao at times for their own purposes), people of the Realms who've heard of Ao at all probably assume that he is little more than just another false god or aspect of an unimportant godling.
Ao is basically unknown and inconsequential in other worlds, even in places like Sigil - if known at all he would generally be regarded as the great godly overlord of only a single Prime, although perhaps the leader of a pantheon or supreme power in his world he is hardly a being of cosmic omni-importance.
I interpret the passage from Waterdeep as being a sort of in-joke, Ao's Masters (I got the impression there were several, even if Ao only reported to one) would be the DMs and authors who "run" his worlds, perhaps even the game designers at WotC. |
[/Ayrik] |
Edited by - Ayrik on 02 Jun 2012 03:49:03 |
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3736 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jun 2012 : 04:05:05
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quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
I interpret the passage from Waterdeep as being a sort of in-joke, Ao's Masters (I got the impression there were several, even if Ao only reported to one) would be the DMs and authors who "run" his worlds, perhaps even the game designers at WotC.
-As did I. |
(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)
Elves of Faerūn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerūn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium |
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Eldacar
Senior Scribe
438 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jun 2012 : 14:29:30
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I would find it unlikely that Ao's master takes any active role in Realmspace at all. Even Ao himself is only concerned with things that directly threaten the overarching Balance, and it takes quite a bit to get him to intervene. He doesn't even like mortals knowing he exists, which is why he's been scrubbing his name from memories, minds and history books since the Time of Troubles. He monitors and observes. He rarely intervenes.
His master would be even less inclined to take an active interest. Ao refers to Realmspace as an "assignment" in that epilogue, so if anything I would conclude that his master gives him an assignment and expects him to carry it out. While he might check in from time to time, Ao probably has free reign in administering to his job however he deems necessary. |
"The Wild Mages I have met exhibit a startling disregard for common sense, and are often meddling with powers far beyond their own control." ~Volo
"Not unlike a certain travelogue author with whom I am unfortunately acquainted." ~Elminster |
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3736 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jun 2012 : 02:44:46
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| -Agreed. The only 'repercussions' that Ao having a master is that, if Ao has a superior, then Ao isn't completely omnipotent within Realmspace, as presumably, Ao's superior would have the ability to undo something that Ao does. |
(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)
Elves of Faerūn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerūn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jun 2012 : 02:49:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus
-Agreed. The only 'repercussions' that Ao having a master is that, if Ao has a superior, then Ao isn't completely omnipotent within Realmspace, as presumably, Ao's superior would have the ability to undo something that Ao does.
Or Ao's boss can't "fit" into the Multiverse without causing some sort of balance issue...and so uses Ao as a free agent...just a thought. |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7966 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jun 2012 : 03:12:04
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| If Ao has peers and superiors, then it's likely there are overgod counterparts in Krynnspace, Greyspace, etc. Have they ever been described in canon? |
[/Ayrik] |
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Therise
Master of Realmslore
1272 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jun 2012 : 03:16:32
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I rather dislike Ao on principle, and don't use him. His "boss" could be the DM, but that would seriously break the 4th wall IMO. Having AO seems to defeat the whole purpose of multifaceted polytheistic deities anyway.. to me, him having a boss would make that even worse. Who are AO's peers, the Lady of Pain and ?
Nah, not for me. In my Realms, the gods are gods. They're distant, don't intervene in major ways, and the Time of Troubles didn't happen.
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Female, 40-year DM of a homebrew-evolved 1E Realms, including a few added tidbits of 2E and 3E lore; played originally in AD&D, then in Rolemaster. Be a DM for your kids and grandkids, gaming is excellent for families! |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jun 2012 : 03:21:44
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quote:
Originally posted by Therise
I rather dislike Ao on principle, and don't use him. His "boss" could be the DM, but that would seriously break the 4th wall IMO. Having AO seems to defeat the whole purpose of multifaceted polytheistic deities anyway.. to me, him having a boss would make that even worse. Who are AO's peers, the Lady of Pain and ?
Nah, not for me. In my Realms, the gods are gods. They're distant, don't intervene in major ways, and the Time of Troubles didn't happen.
I prefer that the Time of Troubles didn't happen either...and thus most of my games start before the 2nd Ed. era; although there are many published sources that I like to use still for lore.
I can't help jumping on the bandwagon though sometimes...I just like to stir the pot and see what cooks up. 
I'm sure some may have noticed by now that I don't always even remain constant in my views on things...but they may not realize I do it on purpose.  |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Gray Richardson
Master of Realmslore
USA
1291 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jun 2012 : 16:39:07
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Krynn's High God is considered an overgod. As far as I know, Ao and the High God are the only two acknowledged overgods. I suspect Ptah is also one. And Anubis is probably one too since he took over his role as guardian of the dead gods. The Lady of Pain is probably also an overgod, although that is a point of contention among many.
In the divine ranking system, there are 20 possible divine ranks that a deity can possess, similar to the 20 character levels that a PC can possess. Just as a PC becomes "epic" upon attaining a 21st level, gods become overgods at DVR 21 and above. So an overgod is similar to an "epic" deity. See page 6 of Faiths & Pantheons.
However, upon achieving overdivinity, the overgod breaks out of the divine system and is no longer considered a god. Overgods are qualitatively different from gods. They do not require worship. They are not beholden to mortal belief. They don't grant spells or answer prayers. They often wipe all memory and record of their existence. They operate under different rules. They are "beyond the ken" of mortal understanding. And their concerns presumably lie in greater dimensions beyond the universe we know.
Just as it takes some kind of epic quest, trial, or ritual for a mortal to ascend to divinity (see the details regarding divine ascension in Faiths & Avatars page 4) we might surmise that it also takes some kind of epic godly quest, trial, or ritual for a god to ascend to overdivine status. Think of it like a PhD thesis. Or an Eagle Scout project. One such ritual seems to be the creation of a crystal sphere.
Another such project might be to create a race and then spread that race to multiple worlds until a critical mass is reached. Gods like Corellon, Moradin, and Annam seem headed down that path. I surmise that Annam is quite close to achieving his goal, if he hasn't already. He has been cloistered in seclusion for centuries, some believe out of despair. But I suggest he has been preparing for overdivine ascension. In fact, he has been absent so long, that he may have already succeeded and no one has realized.
Note that humans have no racial patron, a strong indication that the patron god of humans ascended long ago and has been forgotten.
Another such ritual might be the destruction of a crystal sphere, of which there is evidence of at least one such cataclysm.
Faerūnian sages believe that Toril's crystal sphere was created roughly 70,000 years ago (give or take). Prior to that, Ao may have been simply a DVR 20 god seeking ascension to overdivinity. His creation of Realmspace probably put him over the top to DVR 21.
I'm not sure how long it takes an overgod to advance in ranks, and I don't know if 70,000 years is a long time or a short time in overdivine circles. It seems like a short period to me in cosmic scales, so presumably Ao has not advanced very far. He might be level 21, or 22, or 23.
In DVR terms, the first 5 divine ranks are demi-god status (now termed exarch) which usually means the god is subservient to a higher-level god. Very often the god that sponsored the demi-god's ascension. Byt the way, another qualification in Realmspace for a mortal to ascend to godhood is that he must be sponsored by an existing god. I don't know if the sponsorship of an overgod is required for a god to ascend to overdivinity, but that could be possible. Or if not absolutely required, sponsorship might make it less difficult to ascend than attempting it without sponsorship.
If there is some kind of sponsorship mechanism, then we might also infer there would be a period of service or apprenticeship that new overgods owe to their sponsors for a few millennia after ascending.
So there are probably as many overgods as there are crystal spheres. And then there are probably a lot more that ascended through other means. That's a lot of overgods. One might presume that they have some sort of organization or culture. When a god ascends to over-divinity, he is not ascending into a vacuum. New overgods are probably recruited to some crucial higher-dimensional task. And there could be different factions of overgods that pursue different interests. Some may work in concert with each other and it's possible that some groups work at odds to the others. We can only speculate.
So what do overgods do with their time? Well, they are probably concerned with higher dimensional things. Keeping the far realms from seeping into the multi-verse. Fending off threats to the multi-verse from within and without. Keeping physical constants from deviating. Or pursuits that we could not possibly fathom.
Some overgods may watch over their crystal spheres for a time. Until they lose interest, become distracted by greater things, or feel the gods within the crystal sphere have things under control and are keeping it stable.
Ao is not an active presence in Realmspace. He doesn't do any of the things that gods do. He is more like a sysadmin. He tries to keep things running smoothly and he seems to be in charge of granting permissions and clearance levels to all the gods.
The fact that no other crystal spheres, aside from Krynn, have overgods might mean that either those spheres have watchers that keep their existence a better secret, or they have lost interest and moved on to other things. I suspect that with older worlds, the latter is more often true. Perhaps when an overgod achieves DVR 26 he is promoted to lesser overgod and then can be more independent. But I'm just speculating.
All this to say that it is not surprising that Ao reports to a higher power. The luminous being may be the overgod who sponsored Ao's ascension. Or, having ascended, Ao found an organized community of overgods that recruited him to serve a function as protector of Realmspace. The luminous being might be the district manager, responsible for several crystal spheres in the vicinity of Realmspace.
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sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jun 2012 : 17:16:11
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| foolish mortals. AO's boss is the great and powerful Cthulu. |
why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jun 2012 : 20:19:30
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| Cthulu is actually a rather weak Great Old One...at least when compared to the likes of Hastur or (much worse!) Azathoth, the "Center of the Universe" which is the size of a star! |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3736 Posts |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7966 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jun 2012 : 20:57:41
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quote:
Gray Richardson
So what do overgods do with their time? Well, they are probably concerned with higher dimensional things. Keeping the far realms from seeping into the multi-verse. Fending off threats to the multi-verse from within and without. Keeping physical constants from deviating. Or pursuits that we could not possibly fathom.
As I understand it, lately they've been fairly busy designing and playtesting D&D "5E". |
[/Ayrik] |
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Nicolai Withander
Master of Realmslore
Denmark
1093 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jun 2012 : 23:41:44
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I dont want to create a "vs" question, but can it be said that the Lady of Pain is "stronger" than AO if on neutral ground, or can no such thing be said???
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jun 2012 : 05:02:30
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quote:
Originally posted by Nicolai Withander
I dont want to create a "vs" question, but can it be said that the Lady of Pain is "stronger" than AO if on neutral ground, or can no such thing be said???
We don't have enough info about either to make that call, thinks I. |
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jun 2012 : 06:06:13
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quote:
Originally posted by Gray Richardson
Krynn's High God is considered an overgod. As far as I know, Ao and the High God are the only two acknowledged overgods.
I wouldn't necessarily label Krynn's High God as an overgod similar in both status and power, to Ao. In fact, I'd say the High God ranks a little higher on the deity-scale.
We know, from several sources, that the High God created the entire "universe" and is the only source of creation in DRAGONLANCE. He/She/It has no known "Boss" or Lord Who Is Above [like the supposed entity said to reside in a existence well above that of Ao]. The High God is the Be-All and End-All of Krynnspace and Beyond. Whereas, Ao has an acknowledged superior -- an entity who, we can suppose, created the universe-entire, and the energy-form that would eventually coalesce into Ao.
If nothing else, and for the sake of comparison, I would say Chaos sits at the same level of power and status as that of Ao. A divinely primal force of creation [and, when the need requires, destruction] with an acknowledged superior being above. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3736 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jun 2012 : 20:16:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Nicolai Withander
I dont want to create a "vs" question, but can it be said that the Lady of Pain is "stronger" than AO if on neutral ground, or can no such thing be said???
-We don't have enough information. Who says that the Lady of Pain can leave Sigil, to go to neutral ground? Who says that Ao can leave Realmspace, to go to neutral ground? And then, of course, what exactly is neutral ground? |
(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)
Elves of Faerūn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerūn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium |
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Fellfire
Master of Realmslore
1965 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jun 2012 : 20:32:05
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Presumably, AO = Alpha Omega, the ''be-all, end-all.''
As usual, Gray Sage, your insights are fascinating. |
Misanthorpe
Love is a lie. Only hate endures. Light is blinding. Only in darkness do we see clearly.
"Oh, you think darkness is your ally? You merely adopted the dark. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn't see the light until I was already a man, by then it was nothing to me but.. blinding. The shadows betray you because they belong to me." - Bane The Dark Knight Rises
Green Dragonscale Dice Bag by Crystalsidyll - check it out
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Edited by - Fellfire on 04 Jun 2012 20:36:59 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jun 2012 : 21:22:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus
And then, of course, what exactly is neutral ground?
Switzerland, of course. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Nicolai Withander
Master of Realmslore
Denmark
1093 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jun 2012 : 21:29:26
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| True... |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7966 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jun 2012 : 21:45:14
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Ptah is a very interesting choice, in some ways seemingly something halfway between god and overgod. I'm not sure I can agree about Anubis, outside the Stargate universe he's not particularly remarkable. I shall ponder and cogitate upon these facts.
Then again, I find the entire notion of supreme overdeities a bit too convenient for my tastes. Different orders and scales of existence I can understand better, certainly Realmspace and Krynnspace (and our Solar System) could just be pretty marbles in somebody's overcosmic gaming ... but it still seems unnecessary and contrived. A painting of an artist shouldn't be able to paint itself. |
[/Ayrik] |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jun 2012 : 02:13:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Fellfire
Presumably, AO = Alpha Omega, the ''be-all, end-all.''
Ao is the name of thirteen cloud gods in Oceanic mythology, as I recall. And Ao is also the name of the four dragon kings in Chinese mythology.
I've heard arguments too, about the Anu/Ao connection. Honestly, Anu isn't a whole lot like Ao. They're both distant gods, but that's it, and they only have one letter of their names in common. Yeah, and the tablet thing, which is obviously Mesopotamian in influence, but the Tablet of Destiny was stolen from Enlil, not Anu.
The Alpha Omega idea seems much more persuasive to me, although the symbol for Omega doesn't look anything like the letter "o."
I still think the Aleph-Null idea isn't too much less likely, though. It was noted that an Aleph doesn't look like an A, but an Omega doesn't look like an O either. In either case, they work as English abbreviations.
Perhaps it's a combination of all or many of these things, subconscious and concious: the Anu thing, the Oceanian and Chinese deities, Alpha Omega and Aleph-Null. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jun 2012 : 04:06:22
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Fellfire
Presumably, AO = Alpha Omega, the ''be-all, end-all.''
Ao is the name of thirteen cloud gods in Oceanic mythology, as I recall. And Ao is also the name of the four dragon kings in Chinese mythology.
I've heard arguments too, about the Anu/Ao connection. Honestly, Anu isn't a whole lot like Ao. They're both distant gods, but that's it, and they only have one letter of their names in common. Yeah, and the tablet thing, which is obviously Mesopotamian in influence, but the Tablet of Destiny was stolen from Enlil, not Anu.
The Alpha Omega idea seems much more persuasive to me, although the symbol for Omega doesn't look anything like the letter "o."
I still think the Aleph-Null idea isn't too much less likely, though. It was noted that an Aleph doesn't look like an A, but an Omega doesn't look like an O either. In either case, they work as English abbreviations.
Perhaps it's a combination of all or many of these things, subconscious and concious: the Anu thing, the Oceanian and Chinese deities, Alpha Omega and Aleph-Null.
Or maybe it's like how Oz got it's name -- the author looked at a filing cabinet, saw that one of the drawers was labeled O-Z, and came up with the name Oz. (This is one of the stories on that, and may be only a legend -- but it's not too hard to imagine a similar inspiration for the word Ao) |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Eldacar
Senior Scribe
438 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jun 2012 : 06:12:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Gray Richardson
I'm not sure how long it takes an overgod to advance in ranks, and I don't know if 70,000 years is a long time or a short time in overdivine circles. It seems like a short period to me in cosmic scales, so presumably Ao has not advanced very far. He might be level 21, or 22, or 23.
I'm recalling a post on the old WotC Gleemax forums about overgods and how you might rank them. The person took the Divine Rank system up to 30, assigning specific "degrees of influence" to the various ranks. I've adapted it myself, and came up with the following:
21-24 - Overgod charged with a crystal sphere. The rank of the overgod reflects the power/size/influence of the sphere. I believe the person attributed it to the power of magic, with Ao higher ranked because Realmspace is more magic-rich than, say, a hypothetical Earth crystal sphere that we live in, which is dead magic, but that doesn't feel right to me, since the overgod could adjust magic in the sphere at a whim. So I'd bank on it being some other aspect instead. Within the sphere, the overgod is supreme and controls the allocation of resources and elements from outside/above into their assigned sphere (e.g. the rank 26-27 overgod-exemplars mentioned below), with the only exception being the person handing out their assignments having the ability to stop them if it is deemed needful. If a deity were to "break into" overgod status, they would join the ranks of the overgods and be given assignments in accordance with their new status.
25 - Probably equivalent to your "district" manager concept. This is the cosmic force administering the various crystal spheres. There are probably several of them, but as Ao mentions, there are millions of assignments like his, so they have a fairly broad purview.
26 - Multiversal exemplars of an alignment or concept. For example, the overgod of lawful evil (i.e. all of that alignment, quite literally the cosmic concept of it) would be Asmodeus (in my cosmos, anyway). The overgod-exemplar of Chaotic Evil would be the Abyss itself (it's hinted to be an overgod, or at least a conscious force of unspeakable power, in some sources).
27 - Multiversal concept of magic (e.g. the Serpent). It is an overgod in the sense that it is magic. All magic, everywhere. Other cosmic absolutes of this type would also rank on this level.
28 - Balance maintainers. More or less the Lady of Pain or similar. If you read comics, then the Endless would fit into this tier. Underlying concepts and patterns to existence as a whole, that maintain the balance and keep things running smoothly in some unknown fashion. They're not gods, really. They're patterns. Wave forms that form the structure of reality. Which might, in a place where belief can shape reality, be why the Lady is so against being thought of as a deity.
29 - No known occupants, but again, if anybody reads comics then the Living Tribunal from Marvel, or Lucifer Morningstar/Michael Demiurgos from DC, would fit into this slot.
30 - This is where the system ends. This is the One Above All Others. The Ultimate. The Singularity. Top Dog. Man In Charge. Nobody equals him, nobody exceeds him.
That's more or less the way I'd structure it. Of course, we can never really know, since it's explicitly beyond mortal understanding once you hit the overgod levels. I do like the comparison to a sysadmin, though. |
"The Wild Mages I have met exhibit a startling disregard for common sense, and are often meddling with powers far beyond their own control." ~Volo
"Not unlike a certain travelogue author with whom I am unfortunately acquainted." ~Elminster |
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Nicolai Withander
Master of Realmslore
Denmark
1093 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jun 2012 : 18:56:16
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| I like it... Though I do think I remember reading something like this somewhere. I might even have been yours. |
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3736 Posts |
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Othinnar
Acolyte
1 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jun 2012 : 21:50:00
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Nicolai, I think you may read it the Dicefreaks Forum. Eldacar, are you maybe someone imortant from Diceafreaks?
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Fellfire
Presumably, AO = Alpha Omega, the ''be-all, end-all.''
Ao is the name of thirteen cloud gods in Oceanic mythology, as I recall. And Ao is also the name of the four dragon kings in Chinese mythology.
I've heard arguments too, about the Anu/Ao connection. Honestly, Anu isn't a whole lot like Ao. They're both distant gods, but that's it, and they only have one letter of their names in common. Yeah, and the tablet thing, which is obviously Mesopotamian in influence, but the Tablet of Destiny was stolen from Enlil, not Anu.
The Alpha Omega idea seems much more persuasive to me, although the symbol for Omega doesn't look anything like the letter "o."
I still think the Aleph-Null idea isn't too much less likely, though. It was noted that an Aleph doesn't look like an A, but an Omega doesn't look like an O either. In either case, they work as English abbreviations.
Perhaps it's a combination of all or many of these things, subconscious and concious: the Anu thing, the Oceanian and Chinese deities, Alpha Omega and Aleph-Null.
Or maybe it's like how Oz got it's name -- the author looked at a filing cabinet, saw that one of the drawers was labeled O-Z, and came up with the name Oz. (This is one of the stories on that, and may be only a legend -- but it's not too hard to imagine a similar inspiration for the word Ao)
I'm one of the people who thought that Ao has a connection with Anu, and if I remember good, the Overgod was covered in stars in the books? If so, it's a very sky-god thing. Also the Mesopotamian tablets of fate were first in Anu's or Tiamat's possession, and later in Enlil's or Marduk's, depending on the version of myths. And I think that maybe Ao's author first got the name from filling tablets, and when developing the Over Power beyond the name, he was inspired by some, or all of the above deities? |
Edited by - Othinnar on 05 Jun 2012 21:56:30 |
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Ao's Boss
