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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
 Posted - 13 Jan 2011 : 06:45:58
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quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis
Was it discussed in any detail? Or just a passing mention? I'm looking for some in-depth info on the location.
There's several brief paragraphs worth of lore about Lothen on pg. 92 of Lost Empires of Faerűn. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 13 Jan 2011 06:46:58 |
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crazedventurers
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1073 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2011 : 08:28:26
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quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
Ustrin Thalonder was the long-ago rebuilder of Arabel's city walls.
Thank you very much for the very swift response
Cheers
Damian |
So saith Ed. I've never said he was sane, have I?
Gods, all this writing and he's running a constant fantasy version of Coronation Street in his head, too. .
shudder,
love to all,
THO
Candlekeep Forum 7 May 2005 |
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wakaman
Acolyte
12 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2011 : 12:50:15
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Hello, once more!
Sometime in 2008, I posted a query about mythallars and floating cities in modern day Faerun. The answers given there were comprehensive, and I greatly appreciate the effort that had been put into them!
I'd like to possibly expand on this, with a number of quite specific questions concerning the Netherese and their enclaves. Particularly, I'm interested in the nature of the Mythallars, and how they were used. Here are some specific questions and observations.
What is the size, shape and weight of a typical mythallar?
A look through the sources has produced seemingly contradictory statements. While Lost Empires of Faerun indicates that "it is a large polished crystal as tall as a man, though it may take other forms as well" (p 156), the Encyclopedia Arcana by slade with Jim Butler states that "This magical device looked much like a crystal ball but was about 150 feet in diameter. The globe shed a very bright light—almost as blinding as looking directly into the disc of the sun—with dimmer shadows and shapes moving across its surface. An ornate stand kept the perfectly spherical device in place" (p 7). Which of these is a more accurate description?
Concerning the nature of the mythallars and the way that they were used by the Netherese
In the Lords of Darkness, there is a rather extensive description of a mythallar in a Netherese outpost (p90) as well as a very quick mention of how mythallars could allow cities to float (p80). Another account which is consistent with these exists in Netheril: Empire of magic, where it describes the mythallar that powered Karsus' enclave (p 102).
What these sources together seem to suggest is that the mythallars absorbed magic from the weave and then dispersed it steadily by emitting 'magical light', which the Netherese then manipulated to various effects in two ways:
A. By using crystals of different colors
I assume that when the 'light' hit the crystals they absorbed some of the energies and reflected only a specific spectrum of them (this is obviously the accepted view of how objects have various colors in our world), thus allowing them to separate and refine the raw energy that the mythallars emitted. My assumption is that they could use both the 'reflected', 'refined' light, which would correspond to a specific effect (corresponding to the formula of reflected light = mythallar light - absorbed crystal light) , but could also use the absorbed energies in the crystals, which would contain a new balance of energies that followed the formula of (crystal light= mythallar light-reflected light).
B. By using mirrors
These apparently reflected the magical light that the mythallars emitted back onto the mythallar or to desired places, thus preventing any of the emitted energy from being wasted and, in addition, allowing the energies to be focused and redirected. There seems to be a general theme to suggest that the 'reverse gravity' and 'levitation' magics that kept the city afloat and "upside down" (Netheril: Empire of magic, p 7) virtually indefinitely were facilitated by these mirrors reflecting back onto the mythallar (as in LoD p80). This would also suggest that the 'permanency' effects that the mythallar created for quasi-magical items was also facilitated, at least in part, by these mirrors.
From this rather nitty-gritty analysis (Which I do apologize for!) it appears that the mythallars were immense, but possibly not infinite, stores of magic, that radiated the magic almost like normal radiation today. This magic radiation was -extremely- non-specific. These energies were then harvested, redirected, and conserved by use of mirrors and crystals of various colors to create and facilitate a huge variety of effects (weather control, forcing people to read a sign, possibly creating a mythal effect, etc, as described in Netheril: empire of magic).
I realize that this is only an interpretation, and am deferring to your ultimate knowledge. Is this how you envisioned that mythallars worked, and how the Netherese manipulated and used their energies?
How the cities floated
Based on the above assumptions and sources, it is apparent that the cities were kept afloat by the casting of the levitation and reverse gravity magics, both of which were augmented and made virtually 'permanent' by the mythallars.
Precisely -how- they achieved this is the subject of my next question.
A. It is obvious that a single levitation, or even multiple levitations from an individual wizard could not keep the enclaves afloat, simply because of the weight issue (levitate only allows levitation of 100 lb/cl).
My assumption is therefore that the mythallar not only allowed this effect to become permanent, but also greatly augmented its magnitude. Otherwise, if the mythallar could only achieve 'permanency' effects, floating up of the enclave would require the coordination of hundreds, if not thousands of arcanists, to cast levitation magics that would cover the entire enclave's surface and would account for the weight. Therefore, I would have to conclude that the mythallar augmented this levitation spell's magnitude by thousands or even millions fold. Is this a correct conclusion?
B. If the mythallars were able to augment the levitation and reverse gravity to such an effect, then this begs the question as to why it augmented specifically these magics and not every spell that was cast within the mythallar's sphere of influence. This would therefore indicate a deliberate effort by the creators of the mythallar to augment these two spells specifically, while leaving most others unaffected. Based on this, I have come up with two ways in which this could be achieved:
B.1. The first possibility is that the mythallars were previously attuned to specifically augment those magics. In truth, however, based on my very rudimentary understanding of mythallars as non-specific batteries of magic, I don't find this explanation appealing.
B.2. The second and more appealing possibility is based on the assumption that most mythallars had quite a non-specific aura of magic. This would lead me to believe that the Netherese had to experiment with the 'magical light', using a series of mirrors and crystals in sequence to refine the energy until it achieved the effect of augmenting said magics. This would be consistent with what was mentioned in LoD p80, and would also be consistent with my (possibly erroneous) view of mythallars as non-specific magical batteries.
Again, I realize that this is a rather tedious analysis, and I defer entirely to your opinion on the matter: Did the mythallars augment the levitation and reverse gravity spells and give them a permanency effect? did the mythallars achieve this by virtue of being previously attuned, or by virtue of mirrors and crystals? or was there a completely different method for all of these effects that I am ignorant of?
Repair of mythallars
based on the above observations and assumptions, my next questions regard the potential repair of mythallars.
A. I assume that mythallars could potentially be pieced back together; but how could this be achieved?
B. I also assume that the crystals and the mirrors were an important aspect of the mythallar's normal function, so the restoration of these apparatuses would also be quite important in order to get the mythallar up and running again. This might be particularly important in getting the enclave floating and upright, if these apparatuses were important for augmenting the levitation and reverse gravity spells. Am I also correct in this assumption?
I thank you for reading this extremely extensive and tedious post, and hope that my queries don't seem trivial or unimportant.
I thank you up front for your reply!
wakaman. |
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Hoondatha
Great Reader
USA
2449 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2011 : 13:22:52
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@Alystra: While it's not exactly what you're looking for (and I'm curious to hear what Ed has to say as well), here's an old thread where a couple of us were discussing Lothen.
http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12307
The short of it is that there really isn't much information on it at all, so I and a few others were discussing what we had done with it, and why we didn't like what the established lore had to say for it. Hope it can provide some inspiration while we wait for Ed. |
Doggedly converting 3e back to what D&D should be...
Sigh... And now 4e as well. |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Blueblade
Senior Scribe
USA
804 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jan 2011 : 01:30:44
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Mr Misc, you have read ELMINSTER MUST DIE!, yes?
(It's FULL of hauntings in the Royal Palace, and I think there are mentions of a few in the Royal Court, too, and the buildings are linked by many tunnels under the courtyard between them . . .)
BB |
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althen artren
Senior Scribe
USA
780 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jan 2011 : 02:41:35
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Well, a tidbit of the Laughing Hero of the North appears in the
First Shadows of the Avatar's book, where Elminster "seeming"
appears to turn himself younger and fights madly in melee with
a bunch of Zhent swords. After the battle, he looks completely
spent (much like barbarian rage?) and says to Shar "... tis draws deep."
Edit: Ive been meaning to ask this myself. |
Edited by - althen artren on 15 Jan 2011 02:42:20 |
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5056 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jan 2011 : 19:40:05
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Hi again, all! Ed is very busy right now with real-world obligations (aka inescapable timesinks) and with rush Realms writing work, but with his permission I'm making the baldest of beginning at a reply to Mr_Miscellany:
"Are there any persistent, lurking ghosts of War Wizards that haunt the Royal Court or where the War Wizards reside in Suzail?"
A: Oh, yes. Many.
"Of these, are any like those from the Harry Potter books? The sort to jaunt around a specific area, dispensing good advice or being a pest, as befits their nature when they were alive?"
A: Yes, most of them.
"Are any like watchghosts that guard a specific area, room or individual (like the ghost I [vaguely] remember reading about that lurks near Mirt’s abode in Waterdeep)?"
A: Yes. A few.
"Or are such hauntings more of the “we just learned to deal with the ghostly presence of the long-dead War Wizard and got on with our business as best we could” type?"
A: Yes, this describes the attitude of many of the circa-1479 DR Wizards of War and courtiers fairly well. Note that hauntings are among the matters 'not generally discussed' with the wider public.
"Have the priesthoods of various deities ever been tasked with eradicating, hemming in or bringing to heel persistent, hard-to-kill-once-and-for-all type ghosts (and not just ghosts of War Wizards) around the Royal Court?"
A: Yes.
"Seems like with all the intrigue in Cormyr there ought to be a menacing ghost or two in the great sprawl of the Royal Court that can’t rest until some foul wrong is made right."
A: Oh, yes. 
love,
THO
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Edited by - The Hooded One on 15 Jan 2011 19:55:49 |
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Blueblade
Senior Scribe
USA
804 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jan 2011 : 20:01:54
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Dear Ed and THO,
A general question about Cormyr, now that Ed has written two novels, bits of more, some short stories, the Waterdeep bible, and bits of some rulebooks (not to mention those Eye on the Realms columns) set in the 4e Realms...
Is the spread and accuracy of "the news" (rumors, gossip, Crown announcements, everything) better circa 1479 DR than it was in the 1370s, or worse, or about the same? Is there more censorship? More misunderstandings and/or "blank spots"/topics? More openness? "?" 
Thanks!
BB |
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5056 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jan 2011 : 20:31:14
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Hi again, all.
I bring a surprise quick reply from Ed, re. this from Alisttair: "If someone wanted to open up a coffee shop (similar to our world's Starbucks, or maybe Tim Horton's) in Waterdeep, what sort of expenses and other hurdles can be expected? What are the chances of a steady clientele (I'm guessing it would mostly be from the nobility)?"
Ed replies:
There are over a dozen such shops in Waterdeep already, circa the 1370s, and over thirty circa 1479 DR. The hurdles would mainly be competition. Any such shop stands and falls on two things: the price/quality of their hot food (tarts, both sweet and savory [[meat pies and fish rolls]], and pastries, including eggbread buns with sugar melted over the top of them, and bacon-fried apple fritters ditto: literally, slices of apple coated in batter and fried in bacon fat, alongside bacon), and the variety and quality of their hot drinks (hot chocolate and hot fruit-pulp drinks and teas as well as coffees).
So, get good suppliers, keep the place clean, have a serving window for the street pass-through traffic and some cozy corners and/or booths for those who want to linger and do deals/talk semi-privately...and you're golden. As in coins. Miss out on these...and you'll miss out on riches, too.
BTW: no problems re "protection" rackets and the like, because the guilds as well as the Watch wantr more places like these to frequent, and will fiercely defend them if welcomed/made to feel at home.
So saith Ed. Dispensing free Realmslore wherever he goes...
love to all,
THO |
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createvmind
Senior Scribe
490 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jan 2011 : 20:50:47
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| Have there ever been ghost/spectral spirit hordes with so many mass deaths occuring throughout faerun's history? If so how were they dealt with or does the nature of ghost types keep them keyed to an area that they are unable to leave and still be "potent"? |
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crazedventurers
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1073 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jan 2011 : 21:43:52
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Well Again All
Cormyr and Codpieces:
Did Azoun (the fourth of that name) have any enchanted or outlandish codpieces?
Do codpieces fall in and out of fashion in the court during his reign?
If there was an up and coming young dashing noble new to court, where would he buy one from? are there many makers of high-quality codpieces?
Best regards
Damian
ps same questions for ruff's please |
So saith Ed. I've never said he was sane, have I?
Gods, all this writing and he's running a constant fantasy version of Coronation Street in his head, too. .
shudder,
love to all,
THO
Candlekeep Forum 7 May 2005 |
Edited by - crazedventurers on 15 Jan 2011 21:50:28 |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jan 2011 : 21:56:53
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Ed and THO,
I have a question regarding Theymarsh in the Border Kingdoms. In a novel, I believe it is Spellfire, it is said that Glassware is common there...
Is there anything else at all that can be shared about this tiny thorp in the Border Kingdoms? Or, for the time it takes you to answer that, is there aught you can offer about Thort or Urspreth as well?
I always loved the articles about the Border Kingdom...but I'd love to hear anything about it at all...especially those areas mentioned above as well as anything about Pirates! |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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wintermute27
Learned Scribe
USA
179 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jan 2011 : 04:02:10
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Dearest Ed and Lovely Hooded One,
In "Faiths and Avatars" it talks about worshipers of Torm reciting set prayers four times a day and that there are specific litanies used for various circumstances. Could you enlighten us on what these prayers would be, if not in their entirety, then at least what kinda of things would be part of them? Thank you in advance for anything you can provide on this topic.
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My Current Campaign: The Adventures of the Stonelanders |
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Azuth
Senior Scribe
USA
404 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2011 : 07:52:15
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Ed and THO,
I have had a dilemma now for many months, and happily stumbled upon this marvelous site where I am hopeful it might be resolved as only Ed has the answer. As a fan of the Realms since "the Gray Box" and a happy Dungeon Master and player throughout, both I and my entire gaming group went into a kind of shock with the...transition...of the Realms to the 4th Edition. We loved the intrigue and challenges of the Pantheon, and felt it a cross between the Greco-Roman world and the Medieval ages. I'm sad to say that after purchasing all of the 4E books and Realms supplements when launched, we returned them because we were so very lost. Clerics/Priests and divinity were an important factor in our campaign, and "The Balance" (as originally introduced by Ao in the Avatar Series and continued throughout most recently by R.A. Salvatore in the Tymora's Stone triology) was an integral part of the game. Luck (Tymora) had unluck (Beshaba), Bane vs. Torm, Selűne v. Shar, Sune v. Talona, et cetera. We realize that all good things must come to an end, but aside from a few names, this edition has very little in common with its predecessors. The second and third editions brought new insight into the Realms, and expanded the depth of the world and our enjoyment in playing the game. I understand that Ed's Realms are darker than those published, but I'm curious A) how did Ed deal with the death of nearly all of the gods, B) will we ever learn how Mystra died in book form beyond a footnote? C)Given the importance of The Weave, we're not quite sure how Mystra could die and not have another "Time of Troubles" (and that includes this very-confused DM) and would welcome insight into thoughts on this. D) In a yes or no answer only (we know about trade secrets) will *any* of the Gods resurface in the fifth edition? And finally, E) Ao was never mentioned in Ed's original work, but what happened to Ao's mandate of the Balance, and presuming he's still alive, wouldn't he intercede to at minimum restore the Weave? (aside: we love the new Elminster novel and await the next book eagerly...we may not like what's happened to the world for game play, but Ed's writing remains top notch)
I know that there are a lot of questions packed in there, and if any were previously answered and I just missed them in my search, I welcome pointers to them. Otherwise, I look forward to replies when Ed graciously devotes time to this bedeviled DM.
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Azuth, the First Magister
Lord of All Spells
The greatest expression of creativity is through Art.
Offense can never be given, only taken. |
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createvmind
Senior Scribe
490 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2011 : 16:34:29
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Hello,
Ed do slime and Jelly creature starve and what happens during this process, what was size of largest slime/jelly you created in game, info? |
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5056 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2011 : 17:47:37
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Hi, Azuth. Good questions, all, and I understand and sympathize with your situation. I’ve sent your questions on to Ed for a response, but in the interests of giving you some sort of answers until he replies, here are some initial stabs on my part to your questions:
“A) how did Ed deal with the death of nearly all of the gods”
In the home Realms campaign, none of this has happened yet. We’re still in the initial wild-rumors phases of the about-to-unfold Time of Troubles.
As a designer (and creator of the pantheon and most of the gods in it), I imagine Ed took it in stride. He has always, from the beginning (while understanding that gamers always have a hunger to know more about deities and the overarching “way things work”), taken the position that mortals simply can’t know the truth about many things divine, because none of their sources of information (church doctrines, what priests say, rumors, even what they themselves witness or receive as visions) can be trusted.
Even the gods deceive, and when interpreting “what really went on/is going on,” most mortals are in the position of seeing only a glimpse of a confrontation between folk they’ve never seen before, and then having to extrapolate the lives, aims, and back stories of everyone involved, and somehow, by sheer luck, getting it all correct.
You may have noticed, in Ed’s novels, some characters using the expression “the Watching Gods.” From the very outset of the Realms, before TSR ever published one word about it in long-ago DRAGON articles, Ed has murmured to players (through Elminster [[himself an “unreliable narrator,” always remember]], Khelben, various sages, and manifestations of Mystra, your namesake, and Mielikki, not to mention PC-overheard conversations among sages and archwizards) the notion that a LOT of what we “know” about the gods is spurious, that some gods have always masqueraded as others, that what priests and therefore believers see as several separate deities and demigods may well all be aspects of one entity . . . and so on.
So no one in the Realms can be certain that many gods perished. They’ve been TOLD that this happened, and may have seen events explained as being part of this or that god’s destruction, BUT . . .
(Note that Ed built this into the Realms from the very beginning for two very good reasons. One was not to offend the personal religious beliefs of individual DMs and players, by offering them a measure of “plausible deniability” so they could accept the Realms as published and happily play in it, “knowing” that the truth was other than as presented. The second was to give DMs full freedom to have “the truth” be different in their Realms, without feeling that they were “breaking canon.” Other commentators and designers have taken other approaches since, but this is Ed’s, because he has always looked ahead down the road to see implications.)
All of which is to say that perhaps not all the gods died, or this particular one, or that particular one. Did any of us SEE Azuth destroyed by Asmodeus? No. Nor did we see Mystra go down. All we “know” for certain is that the Weave collapsed - - and the Chosen of Mystra also know that they abruptly lost all contact with Mystra and Azuth, receiving instead only . . . silence.
“B) will we ever learn how Mystra died in book form beyond a footnote?”
Right now, we just don’t know. Wizards of the Coast controls the published Realms, and their current philosophy is to publish fiction set in or after 1479, the Year of the Ageless One. Certain authors have been given the leeway (or in Ed’s case, have never legally lost it) to include “flashbacks” in their works, showing events during the Spellplague or the “century jump,” IF NECESSARY FOR STORY REASONS. However, the intent has been to NOT exhaustively detail major events, in order to give future Realms authors and designers the most creative room to tell new tales/spin new adventures/write new lore. However, “ever” is a very long time, and the only constant in anyone’s ever is ongoing change . . .
“C) Given the importance of The Weave, we're not quite sure how Mystra could die and not have another "Time of Troubles" (and that includes this very-confused DM) and would welcome insight into thoughts on this.”
Heh. So would I. Perhaps she didn’t die, hmm?
Or perhaps someone, or several someones, was just much better prepared to handle consequences, this time around (i.e. as opposed to the Time of Troubles). Remember that the Weave is NOT “all magic” or even “all the natural world forces harnessed by magic” but rather a way (and for eons, THE most popular, refined, and best understood way) of harnessing those forces. There are other systems of magic, and always have been, from Ed’s initial creation of the Realms. The Time of Troubles was (as far as we mortals can determine) a war among the gods, complete with all the turbulence attending on actual combat. Perhaps someone - - perhaps Mystra herself - - prepared matters beforehand.
THERE you go. Perhaps this is all a plot engineered by Mystra and Azuth, to force magic-using humans to be more self-reliant, to thin out the ranks of their fellow deities, and to humble (the Red Wizards, the Zhentarim) or move (Halruaa) potential trouble-sources, to establish a “New Order” they can return to, to reign over more effectively.
Or perhaps not.
“D) In a yes or no answer only (we know about trade secrets) will *any* of the Gods resurface in the fifth edition?”
Neither Ed nor I nor anyone else can at this time give you any sort of answer. We either honestly don’t know (and that’s the case for Ed, me, and anyone else not an employee of WotC involved in certain roles at that company), or we’re contractually bound not to say a word about any future company projects until formally approved to “spill a little,” or both.
If/when there is a 5th edition, and anything Realmsian gets designed for it, that ultimately wouldn’t be an Ed decision anyway. He doesn’t control the Realms, and hasn’t (except by friendly influence and providing design aid that wise staffers accept and run with) since 1979, really. One would HOPE that Ed would be part of such design decisions, but it’s just a hope.
Me, I hope there is a 5th edition, and that it’s still something pencil-and-paper RPG grognards like myself recognize, because I don’t want D&D to fade away or get much more fragmented. Or the Realms to get truly “forgotten” in the process.
“E) Ao was never mentioned in Ed's original work, but what happened to Ao's mandate of the Balance, and presuming he's still alive, wouldn't he intercede to at minimum restore the Weave?”
One would certainly expect Ao to intercede, wouldn’t one? So perhaps something’s happened to him. Perhaps the Balance itself has been swept away. The point to be made (or rather, reiterated) here is that we just don’t know. Anything we say is speculation, and Ed is bound by “don’t tell” legal fetters (those oft-mentioned NDAs) anyway.
Believe me, Azuth, I would dearly love answers to most of what you’ve asked (the only answers I don’t want being those that would harm my enjoyment playing in Ed’s campaign, because I would “know too much” that my characters shouldn’t/couldn’t know). I suspect Ed won’t be able to say much beyond echoing what I’ve said here…but would love to be able to.
We’ll just have to wait and see.
love,
THO
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5056 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2011 : 17:53:54
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A postscript, Azuth:
In your Realms gaming, the "death" of a god needn't change much, except to create bewilderment and strife among the clergy of that deity: some will refuse to believe the god is gone (after all, in some cases, their prayers are still being answered by visions, guiding pronouncements, and spells, which are either provided by the deity because they've not be destroyed or banished from the Realms, or are being provided by another deity hoping to harness the power of a large new group of worshippers, who is masquerading as the former deity), and others will choose to believe the deity has been captured or oppressed in some way by other deities or other forces, and that their duty is now to "free" or "restore" the deity, or even to "pass the test" that the deity is obviously visiting upon "all true believers."
In short, the DM can have very little change in an ongoing campaign, even if the 4e situation is being accepted as canon. Or can use the 4e changes to rejigger many things, great and small, in a campaign. Or settle somewhere in between, using some of what i've just mentioned as pretext for new adventures (which is, after all, what it's all about).
I know very well this has all been said before and it's scant consolation, but . . .
Don't let anyone's changes ruin your game. It's YOUR game.
love,
THO |
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5056 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2011 : 18:01:22
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Hi again, all. Just a brief note to wakaman, relayed from Ed:
Great mythallar questions. It's going to take me a little while to craft a proper reply to you, because much of what you ask has been designed and purchased by TSR (now WotC) long ago, and therefore can't be offered by me here. In short, I have to dance around NDAs and paraphrase, in the same way that Candlekeep scribes have to paraphrase what's said in sources rather than quoting long passages outright.
I'll respond as soon as I can. Promise.
So saith Ed. Who is shoulder-deep in beholders right now (don't ask me why; he didn't say - - but he IS learning to cook  ).
love to all,
THO |
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Daviot
Senior Scribe
USA
372 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2011 : 21:02:15
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This is something of a pesky "still interested" reminder, but...
Back in 2009, I asked about a series of lesser-known Cormyrean noble families: The Arcantlets, Bryarns, the Haldoneirs (and their wayward daughters), and finally, the Sorndrakes. I'm sure the numerous distractions of life got in the way, but if and when Ed gets time, I'd still love to hear about the Sorndrake family.  |
One usually has far more to fear from the soft-spoken wizard with a blade and well-worn boots than from the boisterous one in the ivory tower.
My Tabletop Writing CV. |
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Daviot
Senior Scribe
USA
372 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2011 : 21:44:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Mr_Miscellany
Daviot, I believe your questions were answered. The "All About Cormyr" scroll has nicely collected those replies. See this link and scroll down to start reading. :)
I had indeed double-checked through Ed's previous replies (including those on the linked scroll) before I asked, and Ed never got a chance to go into detail on the Sorndrakes. |
One usually has far more to fear from the soft-spoken wizard with a blade and well-worn boots than from the boisterous one in the ivory tower.
My Tabletop Writing CV. |
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Azuth
Senior Scribe
USA
404 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2011 : 22:53:54
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Thanks, THO.
As an author myself, I know what happens once you turn control of a script over to "the editors," and can only imagine what happens when an entire world is turned over to a company.
Perhaps someday Ed can start saying, "Well, if I ran the Realms, this is what I would say..." (This is how anyone not a physician can legally not-give advice on what to do when talking with someone who has a cold, for example. "I would take Tylenol" is different than "you should take Tylenol..." but I don't know the particulars of his NDAs.)
How truly amazing it must be to play in Ed's Realms. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't a bit jealous, and truly, I think that's one reason we've collectively not moved to the 4E books... right or wrong, we don't feel that they're the Realms as we've come to know and love them. In all sincerity, I think that the THAC0 system was superior in some ways, and if "there was an App for that" then it'd work just fine. Having run a group for over 20 years now, I realize that the gods (as much as the NPCs) are ways through which I can interact with my party as a DM. Anyway, I look forward to Ed's replies, whatever they may be. His books continue to delight, and when I master world domination, he'll be named Overlord of WoTC (we'll have to change the name) and then he will own his Realms again.
Cheers,
Azuth, the First Magister.
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
A postscript, Azuth:
In your Realms gaming, the "death" of a god needn't change much, except to create bewilderment and strife among the clergy of that deity: some will refuse to believe the god is gone (after all, in some cases, their prayers are still being answered by visions, guiding pronouncements, and spells, which are either provided by the deity because they've not be destroyed or banished from the Realms, or are being provided by another deity hoping to harness the power of a large new group of worshippers, who is masquerading as the former deity), and others will choose to believe the deity has been captured or oppressed in some way by other deities or other forces, and that their duty is now to "free" or "restore" the deity, or even to "pass the test" that the deity is obviously visiting upon "all true believers."
In short, the DM can have very little change in an ongoing campaign, even if the 4e situation is being accepted as canon. Or can use the 4e changes to rejigger many things, great and small, in a campaign. Or settle somewhere in between, using some of what i've just mentioned as pretext for new adventures (which is, after all, what it's all about).
I know very well this has all been said before and it's scant consolation, but . . .
Don't let anyone's changes ruin your game. It's YOUR game.
love,
THO
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Azuth, the First Magister
Lord of All Spells
The greatest expression of creativity is through Art.
Offense can never be given, only taken. |
Edited by - Azuth on 17 Jan 2011 22:56:58 |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2011 : 00:21:41
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quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
Heh. So would I. Perhaps she didn’t die, hmm?
Or perhaps someone, or several someones, was just much better prepared to handle consequences, this time around (i.e. as opposed to the Time of Troubles). Remember that the Weave is NOT “all magic” or even “all the natural world forces harnessed by magic” but rather a way (and for eons, THE most popular, refined, and best understood way) of harnessing those forces. There are other systems of magic, and always have been, from Ed’s initial creation of the Realms. The Time of Troubles was (as far as we mortals can determine) a war among the gods, complete with all the turbulence attending on actual combat. Perhaps someone - - perhaps Mystra herself - - prepared matters beforehand.
THERE you go. Perhaps this is all a plot engineered by Mystra and Azuth, to force magic-using humans to be more self-reliant, to thin out the ranks of their fellow deities, and to humble (the Red Wizards, the Zhentarim) or move (Halruaa) potential trouble-sources, to establish a “New Order” they can return to, to reign over more effectively.
Or perhaps not.
I find this very, very interesting Ed. And it slightly underlines some of my own pending theories about Mystra 2.0, her death, and the potential for her return. [Including delving into some old stuff involving Mystryl.] |
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Azuth
Senior Scribe
USA
404 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2011 : 00:24:11
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Mystral, Jergal, and Tyche could all be staging a big comeback to greater-power status? Intriguing. 
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
Heh. So would I. Perhaps she didn’t die, hmm?
Or perhaps someone, or several someones, was just much better prepared to handle consequences, this time around (i.e. as opposed to the Time of Troubles). Remember that the Weave is NOT “all magic” or even “all the natural world forces harnessed by magic” but rather a way (and for eons, THE most popular, refined, and best understood way) of harnessing those forces. There are other systems of magic, and always have been, from Ed’s initial creation of the Realms. The Time of Troubles was (as far as we mortals can determine) a war among the gods, complete with all the turbulence attending on actual combat. Perhaps someone - - perhaps Mystra herself - - prepared matters beforehand.
THERE you go. Perhaps this is all a plot engineered by Mystra and Azuth, to force magic-using humans to be more self-reliant, to thin out the ranks of their fellow deities, and to humble (the Red Wizards, the Zhentarim) or move (Halruaa) potential trouble-sources, to establish a “New Order” they can return to, to reign over more effectively.
Or perhaps not.
I find this very, very interesting Ed. And it slightly underlines some of my own pending theories about Mystra 2.0, her death, and the potential for her return. [Including delving into some old stuff involving Mystryl.]
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Azuth, the First Magister
Lord of All Spells
The greatest expression of creativity is through Art.
Offense can never be given, only taken. |
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Veritas
Learned Scribe
209 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2011 : 00:57:40
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Some of the previous replies raises the question to my mind..., what could possibly dispense with or do away with Ao? (Other than Publisher fiat).
Note that I'm not asking what, if anything actually did away with the old man, but what potentially could?
Mayhap he feasted overmuch on Volo's Voluminous Cinnabons and his girth grew so large as to *ahem* break his weave. |
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Azuth
Senior Scribe
USA
404 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2011 : 01:03:18
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Well, in Waterdeep he does report to a "Master" at the end of the book (is that a spoiler this late in the game?) but I think Publisher ignorance/fiat is really the only explanation. I believe I read that Ao "willed himself into being" or something similar to that (hence my question to Ed on Ao's origins) and if Ao were gone, wouldn't his gods fade as well? At least the ones that were previously in his pantheon, thus his creation, if nothing else?
Hmm.
Azuth, the First Magister
Lord of All Spells
quote:
Originally posted by Veritas
Some of the previous replies raises the question to my mind..., what could possibly dispense with or do away with Ao? (Other than Publisher fiat).
Note that I'm not asking what, if anything actually did away with the old man, but what potentially could?
Mayhap he feasted overmuch on Volo's Voluminous Cinnabons and his girth grew so large as to *ahem* break his weave.
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Azuth, the First Magister
Lord of All Spells
The greatest expression of creativity is through Art.
Offense can never be given, only taken. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2011 : 02:40:00
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Well, I'm not Ed, but I can answer part of the bit about Ao's current status. About two-and-a-bit years ago, Rich Baker stated on the Wizards boards, that Ao was largely being ignored and, effectively, written out of the post-Spellplague Realms.
From my own POV, Ao was a clumsy personification of certain divine and cosmic rules and forces anyway. I won't loose any sleep on seeing him depart from the setting. However, he does still represent a fundamental aspect integral to the divine in the Realms -- that being, the check on godly power. And ignoring that aspect of checks on divine action, I think, opens the door for some rather harsh abuse re: just what gods can and cannot do in the Realms.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Azuth
Senior Scribe
USA
404 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2011 : 03:16:04
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An interesting insight. I never had any problems with Ao - it was clear in all of the literature that he utterly ignored mortals, but I liked his role in the Avatar Series books, especially the last two by Ciencin and Denning. What you stated about the check on godly powers is (in my opinion) why Ao is needed. I particularly like how the gods were tied to worship, and losing worship meant losing power. I find the fact that the Wizards people quietly wrote him out (AKA ignoring him) without officially doing so in the core rules in effect gives them (for the point of argument) an equally-weak plot tool to bring the gods back if they so choose. On the one or two occasions when I've used Ao in my game, it was in connection with some supposedly beyond-godly artifact (I love tomes in particular) that the characters must find. Of course, it never existed, but it's all about good storytelling and fun campaigns anyway. All that being said, I would be sorry to see Ao written off - he was a good "check and balance" on the gods of Toril, and a great balance - no pun intended - on making sure the gods weren't too powerful. With respect to what THO said about him, I'm curious about Ed's take on the situation as it's still unclear to me who created Ao: Ed, or the TSR people behind "Avatar?"
Azuth, the First Magister…perhaps an undead god of immense power
Lord of All Spells
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Well, I'm not Ed, but I can answer part of the bit about Ao's current status. About two-and-a-bit years ago, Rich Baker stated on the Wizards boards, that Ao was largely being ignored and, effectively, written out of the post-Spellplague Realms.
From my own POV, Ao was a clumsy personification of certain divine and cosmic rules and forces anyway. I won't loose any sleep on seeing him depart from the setting. However, he does still represent a fundamental aspect integral to the divine in the Realms -- that being, the check on godly power. And ignoring that aspect of checks on divine action, I think, opens the door for some rather harsh abuse re: just what gods can and cannot do in the Realms.
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Azuth, the First Magister
Lord of All Spells
The greatest expression of creativity is through Art.
Offense can never be given, only taken. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2011 : 04:24:31
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Ao was not something Ed created. TSR come up with the concept of Ao and he was brought into the setting during the Time of Troubles -- through the 1e to 2e change over. As it stands, Ed has no idea on where TSR came up with the concept of Ao.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Questions for Ed Greenwood (2011)
Topic Locked
