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Gambit
Learned Scribe

110 Posts

Posted - 18 Oct 2010 :  23:26:21  Show Profile Send Gambit a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
Poll Question:
Ok ladies and gents, its time to take a trip to fantasy land...but then again we're all Realms fans here so we do that on a daily basis.

In this episode of the Twilight Zone you win the 1 billion dollar powerball, and along with whatever else you do with your newfound riches, you walk into the Hasbro coparate boardroom and drop a check on the table purchasing D&D and all rights, editions, settings, and intellectual property that goes along with it, past and present.

Now aside from what you would actually do to the game itself (I personally would make an edition that combines AD&D with several of the better things about 3.X) what would you do with our beloved Forgotten Realms?

Choices:

Reboot: Heres your new shiny hardback version of the Old Grey Box
Alternate Reality: The spellplague was just 1 possible outcome, heres what really happened post 1375
The Past is the Past: Continue the 4E post spellplague Forgotten Realms as is
Walk into Ed''s library in Canada and say "I''ve got a present for you, do with it what you please"
Other nefarious plots and schemes

(Anonymous Vote)

Edited by - Gambit on 18 Oct 2010 23:58:25

Mr_Miscellany
Senior Scribe

545 Posts

Posted - 18 Oct 2010 :  23:48:15  Show Profile Send Mr_Miscellany a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I voted for "other nefarious plots and schemes".

I would kidnap certain designers and authors, put millions of dollars in escrow to pay them for their time (but not tell them this until they were set free), then lock them in a room with plenty of soda, chips and tofu (for the vegetarians) and give them the task of deciding the question of "whither should the Realms go?"

Edited by - Mr_Miscellany on 18 Oct 2010 23:48:53
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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
3285 Posts

Posted - 18 Oct 2010 :  23:51:11  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Give it to Ed to do with as he pleases...

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
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Halidan
Senior Scribe

USA
470 Posts

Posted - 18 Oct 2010 :  23:55:58  Show Profile  Visit Halidan's Homepage Send Halidan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Back to Canada it goes....

"Over the Mountains
Of the Moon
Down the Valley of the Shadow,
Ride, boldly ride,"
The shade replied,
"If you seek for Eldorado!"

Edgar Allen Poe - 1849
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
36779 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  00:15:29  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Mr_Miscellany

I voted for "other nefarious plots and schemes".

I would kidnap certain designers and authors, put millions of dollars in escrow to pay them for their time (but not tell them this until they were set free), then lock them in a room with plenty of soda, chips and tofu (for the vegetarians) and give them the task of deciding the question of "whither should the Realms go?"



Pretty much my thinking. I have to add, though, that a reset would be involved (either to the OGB, which would prolly be easier, or to the end of 2E, which is my preference), and that Ed would be as heavily involved as I could get him. I'd also give him some assistants to help organize his lore. And every NDA would be reviewed.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31701 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  01:12:06  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Mr_Miscellany

I voted for "other nefarious plots and schemes".

I would kidnap certain designers and authors, put millions of dollars in escrow to pay them for their time (but not tell them this until they were set free), then lock them in a room with plenty of soda, chips and tofu (for the vegetarians) and give them the task of deciding the question of "whither should the Realms go?"



Pretty much my thinking. I have to add, though, that a reset would be involved (either to the OGB, which would prolly be easier, or to the end of 2E, which is my preference), and that Ed would be as heavily involved as I could get him. I'd also give him some assistants to help organize his lore. And every NDA would be reviewed.

I'm inclined to agree with both Miscellany and Wooly.

Though I wouldn't add the reset. I'd massage and nurture some of what has now been declared as part of the official Realms, making sure it developed greater connection with past events, re-imagine the "lost" plot hooks which have been necessarily abandoned [like the Manshoon Clone Wars, the Harper Schism, etc.], and formulate new strategies for lore expansion that promotes -- rather than neglects -- vital lore from previous editions.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)

"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage

Edited by - The Sage on 19 Oct 2010 03:05:43
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althen artren
Senior Scribe

USA
780 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  02:24:01  Show Profile Send althen artren a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Give it to Ed and his hand selected roadies.
Nobody does it better.
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader

USA
3750 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  02:51:30  Show Profile Send Alystra Illianniis a Private Message  Reply with Quote
What Sage said, but I'd give full control back to Ed as part of the deal.

The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.

"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491

"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs

Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469

My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188

Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u
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bladeinAmn
Learned Scribe

199 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  06:06:49  Show Profile  Visit bladeinAmn's Homepage Send bladeinAmn a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Gotta give this baby back to Ed of the Greenwood. Like althen artren juss said here, no one can do it better.

And I'd hope for the Alternate Reality outcome too: retconing everything from 1375 DR and beyond. And even other bits of lore from before that time, that made little sense!
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Quale
Master of Realmslore

1757 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  09:35:37  Show Profile Send Quale a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Alternate Reality 1371 DR, Spellplague (Ao instead of Mystra) would work backwards in time like the Sundering, leaving only the cool Realms

Ed would have Cormyr, Thay, Dalelands ... where is his home campaign, for other parts I'd re-hire the designers that proved to work well in FR, Schend, Boyd, Elaine, GK, BRJ. D&D mechanics books will be about the Realms, but much better than what they did with Greyhawk in 3e. No canon novels, with less restrictions on the authors, to compete with the non-shared world fantasy. Relations with the fans, like Paizo's.
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Nicolai Withander
Master of Realmslore

Denmark
1093 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  11:14:58  Show Profile Send Nicolai Withander a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Return it to the Maker! OFC!!!
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Zireael
Master of Realmslore

Poland
1190 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  11:35:05  Show Profile  Visit Zireael's Homepage Send Zireael a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Voted 'Other'.
I mean I'd give it to Ed and wait for him to continue from 1372 DR (that's third edition).

SiNafay Vrinn, the daughter of Lloth, from Ched Nasad!

http://zireael07.wordpress.com/
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Alisttair
Great Reader

Canada
3054 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  12:02:00  Show Profile  Visit Alisttair's Homepage Send Alisttair a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'd actually give half to Ed and do some plotting to make sure it remains a shared world as well with Ed to overlook things and do damage control.

Karsite Arcanar (Most Holy Servant of Karsus)

Anauria - Survivor State of Netheril as penned by me:
http://www.dmsguild.com/m/product/172023
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Jorkens
Great Reader

Norway
2950 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  13:26:38  Show Profile Send Jorkens a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The Realms back to Ed.

The problem for me would be to not involve myself in the further development, because as every one else I have a dream product which probably wouldn't match Ed's. But I would probably ask for two deluxe books by commission. One, the 15th century ED, a work that detailed the 4ed. Realms and worked into it most of the canon as of now. And then (mostly for myself) the thousand page tome of Eds early Realms, illustrated by Fabian and with rules created by Perrin. Then I would lean back and see how things developed further.

If I ended up with the whole D&D pack I would look into making a deal with Mentzer and Kasks new company in addition to leasing out or selling the rights to make 4th ed.

Edited by - Jorkens on 19 Oct 2010 18:00:18
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Tren of Twilight Tower
Seeker

51 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  17:31:23  Show Profile  Visit Tren of Twilight Tower's Homepage Send Tren of Twilight Tower a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I have decided not to vote on this one. As much as I worship Ed, and as much as I have my feelings mixed on what is going on with FR, I would need more information to decide on the matter.

However, what I like about scenario above is:
- it would be wonderful to have that much money
- it would be great to have a say on what is going to happen with FR
- it would be excellent to give Ed more space and rights to decide what is really good for realms
- it would be wonderful to have that much money...


Tren

*Edited for spelling - Tren

Edited by - Tren of Twilight Tower on 19 Oct 2010 18:53:21
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  17:49:19  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I voted Reboot, but truth be told it would be a little of everything.

I don't want D&D - I would just purchase the rights to the Forgotten Realms and all attached IP (which is feasible - buying all of D&D is not, IMHO). Then release (at a loss) a graphic novel of 'How the Realms were saved'. Make it available as a FREE download, and sell it at cost at comic shops and LGS'. This will be a critical point, so it must be extremely well-written with tons of thought behind it. That will create an in-game re-boot (like what they did with Star Trek), using a logical storyline for some sort of contingency plan Mystra put into action before her fall (maybe bring in the Chronomancer for this). It would not be the first time an event "Moved backwards and forwards in time", so we have a Realmsian precedent (at least one). This lore must be available for free, and be damn good - accept it as part of the price that must be paid for the Forgotten Realms. I say a graphic-novel because you are going to need a lot of awesome art to get people to read the thing (changing people's opinions, once they have gone completely the other way, is extremely hard and cost MONEY).

Make a deal with Paizo and use the Pathfinder system for a re-release of tOGB. Have Steven Schend, Ed, and Jeff Grubb rebuild it, and use all new artwork. 'Fix' any of the redundancy and derivativeness. Create a 500 pg. campaign guide and a 500 pg. Player's guide, and then 1 year later release a 'collector's edition' box set that comes with maps, cards, tokens, etc - all those goodies that D&D boxes used to come with. The collector's edition would also update the campaign setting to the 2e release era (which means it would be optional if you wanted to use the ToT, because there would be no rules changes between that first release and the collectors edition box).

Assume that would sell for a bare-minimum of $79.99, but it would include at least one item not available any other way (like a a limited edition miniature), and perhaps a signed Cyclopedia (which could up the price to $100).

Once all of that was up and running, I would start a publishing house for novels and give Ed Greenwood COMPLETE control over the novels (who writes them, content, etc...). Ed would be granted a lifetime free-usage contract on any of the Realms IP. Basically creative control of the Realms falls back into his hands for the duration of his life. A slight difference from the 'give it back to Ed' choice, but it is important to retain control after the man's passing (which I hope doesn't take place for several centuries).

Release the original two books with a re-release (and partial re-write) of the first Drizzt trilogy (re-write, adding new material, so people who have read it before re-purchase it). Also novels by Ed, Elaine, and Paul that first year. On the second release (boxed set) allow RAS to write about something else entirely (partially retire Drizzt and company). A trilogy by Ed and Elaine, some one-hits by a few select other authors (sprinkle-in Erik and Rich Baker at this point).

Hire George Krashos as Realms traffic-cop (an absolute MUST). I guess the official title would be Lead Editor, but it would be for the entire Realms franchise, NOT just the novels. Allow George to write a short story in the Aftershock anthology (short stories featuring the changes wrought by the ToT), establishing him as more then a designer.

Go to China and and work with factories to produce a set of low-cost miniatures that will be both a toy-line (including dioramas, along the lines that Micro-Machines did for SW), and include stat-cards to be use as with the FR game. First set to be produced will be one featuring Drizzt and the companions of the Hall. Make sure big chains stores carry them as toy lines around Christmas time (you want the younger kids playing with the toys, and get them interested in the IP).

If he is so inclined, use Ed (with help from Monty Cook and dozens of other top-designers) to create a Realms-specific rules set (based loosely on the OGL so there is no fan-backlash). Use fan-input for this project, as paizo did. Re-release the realms a 3rd time (3e era), updating the Realms once again, but this time with its own game system. I figure this for 5 years out. During this entire stage build a strong and loyal online community by encouraging fan-projects (contests) and and discourse about what the fans would like to see product-wise. This can be accomplished by giving away a lot of high-quality (no headless Zhents!) freebies throughout this period (you need to spend money to make money). Also WE's for novels, with stats for NPCs and items.

If things are still going well, produce a bi-monthly Realms-specific magazine, very similar to the old Dragon Magazine. For that publication and any others always include at least one Web-Enhancement (Large-size map files, and things like town-maps and stats for lesser NPCs.) Produce a yearly Almanac that updates the setting by about four months (so that we get a 1:3 ratio on time passing).

Usher-in the NEW 3rd-edition Forgotten Realms (with its world-specific ruleset) with much fanfare, free give-aways, big cardboard cut-outs at the bookstores, etc....

No splats except for regional ones, and any new rules (kept to a minimum) would be linked to the lore. Avoid rules-creep at all costs!

Assume no profits for the first five years: After that, its all gravy. Think like a drug dealer - you want people to buy your crack, you need to give some away and get 'em hooked.

With Ed as Captain and George as navigator the Realms will avoid all the rough patches other editions had, and novels that don't even seem like they are part of FR (like that Giants trilogy) will not be published. We must retain the integrity of the Realms flavor in every product produced.

Continue to license video-game products to quality companies. Encourage a few genre-crossing titles such as Realms Risk (with greatly reduced licensing fees for such experimental titles). Continuing to engender an online presence, and with the release of the Realms ruleset open a 'Realms Online' site, with avatars and interactive stuff fans can do. Basically a forum with graphics. This stage only moves forward if every stage before it is proceeding as planned. Adjust goals as necessary dependent upon fan-feedback.

Eventually take the place of things like Facebook, Google, Myspace, AOL.... then world domination. Cure cancer and enforce world peace, and bring in a 'Golden Age'. Build a presence in space and conquer other planets.

You didn't think I would do all that 'cause I'm a nice guy, did you?

But I really haven't given this much thought... nope...not at all...

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 19 Oct 2010 20:06:45
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore

Netherlands
1280 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  19:39:48  Show Profile Send Bladewind a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'd sign for that!

I love the toyz and magazine ideas!

My campaign sketches

Druidic Groves

Creature Feature: Giant Spiders
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Tyrant
Senior Scribe

USA
586 Posts

Posted - 19 Oct 2010 :  20:07:48  Show Profile  Visit Tyrant's Homepage Send Tyrant a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I would go with a variant of "The past is the past". I would keep what we have now, but I would start filling in the gaps. I'm approaching this mainly from the novel side of things. I would keep the writers we have and maybe try to bring in some who have left. Things like the Manshoon Wars or something centering on Netheril or Karsus in particular would be written. Those are just examples, but the idea is that we would start to see novels from all over the timeline, and not just post Spellplague. I would also try to have the authors fill in the blanks of the 100 year gap. This would hopefully explain some of the changes and provide some closure for any characters that end up biting it in the 100 year gap.

On the RPG front, I would try to reinstate support for at least 3.x. If that worked, work our way backwards through the editions. If it's reasonably possible, publish the material with two sets of stats for everything (3.x/4.0). This would save from having to guess which will sell better and is convenient for anyone who plays both editions. I would apply this across the brand and not just FR. I would also start publishing suppliments for the various worlds again to provide lore for those that want it. In the case of the FR this would cover any time frame (Netheril, The Crown Wars, During and after the Spellplague, whatever).

If it has been ditched in 4.0 (I really don't know if it has), I would make it so the various worlds are connected (though not necessarily easy to cross between on a whim).

If Ed had the interest, I would try to employ him to have greater oversight from this point forward. I like what we have and I don't see a reason to throw out the post-Spellplague setting or the transition materials, but it would be nice to keep Ed more in the loop from here on out. It would be nice to have him write down as many ideas and scenarios as he has so that when the inevitable happens and he passes we have some ideas as to where he thought things should go.

Finally, I would lift a number of the NDAs. I understand why they are in place (sometimes), but I'm sure some of them could be removed without harming anything.

I would also try to stay out of the creative process. I am not a writer or a game designer and I wouldn't want to drag things down by trying to be one. The only areas I would try to truly assert myself would be with the miniatures game and with the other media. I would try to fine a way for the miniatures game to go back to being supported as a game (the skirmish game) being better advertised. I would also try to get the D&D name (which would include the FR name) out there in the public with more (and hopefully better) video games and some decent movies or TV shows. If it's the latter, animated may work better and I'm partial to the more detailed animation of anime. If a series won't work, then parhaps a set of animated movies (similar to what DC is doing with their animated movies of specific comic events) based on some of the novels. This would have to be of much higher quality than the Dragonlance animated movie.

On the non FR front, I would bring Weis and Hickman further into the fold to try to revive Dragonlance and to oversee future DL projects (if they are so inclined). I think DL has a better chance of seeing big screen success since it centers around a handful of contained, epic stories and having it succeed will strangthen the overall brand and hopefully translate to greater exposure for all of the settings. I would also try to give a major push to Dark Sun. I think it fill the grim and gritty niche that the other parts of the brand won't fill as well and that too will help maximize exposure. I think these things will end up strengthening the FR as a brand (which will increase it's longevity and allow for more ambitious projects).

Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me.
-The Sith Code

Teenage Sith zombies, Tulkh thought-how in the moons of Bogden had it all started? Every so often, the universe must just get bored and decide to really cut loose. -Star Wars: Red Harvest
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GRYPHON
Senior Scribe

USA
527 Posts

Posted - 20 Oct 2010 :  04:46:25  Show Profile Send GRYPHON a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Reboot...
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader

USA
3750 Posts

Posted - 20 Oct 2010 :  05:06:54  Show Profile Send Alystra Illianniis a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Tyrant, I like your ideas. A Dragonlance movie(s) would be a great idea. So would the edition-crossing stats. Novels to fill in gaps, and others set in the distant past would also be great. However, I think I'd want to help contribute to the lore, since I enjoy world-building and coming up with stories, so I might actually get in on the design and lore aspects. But control would, of course, still lie with Ed.

The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.

"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491

"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs

Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469

My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188

Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u
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Tyrant
Senior Scribe

USA
586 Posts

Posted - 20 Oct 2010 :  06:01:28  Show Profile  Visit Tyrant's Homepage Send Tyrant a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis

Tyrant, I like your ideas. A Dragonlance movie(s) would be a great idea. So would the edition-crossing stats. Novels to fill in gaps, and others set in the distant past would also be great.

I like the post Spellplague novels I have read. I also like the pre-Spellplague novels. I'm sure I'm not the only one, so I would like to see an approach to bridge the gap instead of potentially creating another divide.*

As for Dragonlance, I think if you help one setting gain greater exposure and make it known they are interlinked, that you help them all. Dragonlance, in my opinion, would be the easiest to make into a set of movies since it centers around a few major events. The FR could be made into movies, but what you make into movies becomes a far less obvious choice. Do you go with Drizzt and the RSEs because they are the big selling books? Do you create a new character to act as the movie goers intro into the Realms and to help prompt the exposition needed? I know there is a term for that but I can't think of it at the moment. Think Wolverine in the first XMen movie. I think that's why stand alone animated movies based on specific storylines might be a better approach. You could have a full range to show a spectrum of FR characters and settings. Everything from House of Serpents to The Haunted Lands. Maybe have some maps and RPG stats of the major players inside each DVD case.

*The point of the thread was to get people's opinions and I consider others as valid as my own. So please, don't anyone use my comments to start another edition war. I'm just saying that I don't want to alienate any 4th Ed. Realms fans the same way the fans of older editions have been driven away. To be clear, I am aware that the older fans who have left likely outnumber the new fans by a considerable margin. However, I think a mutually beneficial solution is possible.
quote:
However, I think I'd want to help contribute to the lore, since I enjoy world-building and coming up with stories, so I might actually get in on the design and lore aspects. But control would, of course, still lie with Ed.


I would like to contribute. I would be concerned that my contributions would be less than stellar and help to drag things down. I would contribute on the condition that someone else (like Ed) could over ride any of my less than great ideas. That would probably only be after a few (maybe more than a few) very lengthy discussions with Ed and whoever else is in the inner circle to hammer out a lot of details and backstory and get it all in writing so we would all be on the same page.

Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me.
-The Sith Code

Teenage Sith zombies, Tulkh thought-how in the moons of Bogden had it all started? Every so often, the universe must just get bored and decide to really cut loose. -Star Wars: Red Harvest
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Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 20 Oct 2010 :  06:56:15  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The Realms is a shared world. So it's crucial to have someone oversee and connect all the dots to provide consistency. That task belongs to none other than the creator himself, Ed. And of course, with the help of his lackeys or trusted friends.

I wouldn't want a reset. Why reset when Ed can simply *fix* what the SP horrendously destroyed?! Besides, there are interesting lore in the current edition that would just go to waste if reset be the resort.

Every beginning has an end.
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Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
7966 Posts

Posted - 20 Oct 2010 :  16:42:41  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I withhold my vote as well.

Ed's genesis of the Realms is legend. But regardless whether the Spellplague is agreeable or offensive, much of the subsequent writing has been fantastic. I'm talking about the characters, the stories, the "little" plots and events ... there are too many talented authors to list here, although it should be noted that Ed himself stands among them.

Simply rebooting or branching the Realms at this point so that the Spellplague "didn't really happen" would be committing exactly the same sort of cataclymic/controversial/heavyhanded "break the moon" epic/error/crime that critics accuse WotC of having done in the first place.
As much as I personally mislike much of the Spellplague - or perhaps at least the disagreeably clumsy and urgent way it was all unfolded - I still genuinely enjoy reading much of the fiction of the Realms which has subsequently appeared. Whilst I eagerly await more.

I respect Ed's contributions and accomplishments immensely, true. But I won't seat him like a tyrant upon a throne made of the skulls of his fellow creators. (It might be revealing to scry his idle thoughts on this idea, though ...)

[/Ayrik]

Edited by - Ayrik on 20 Oct 2010 16:54:26
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Gambit
Learned Scribe

110 Posts

Posted - 20 Oct 2010 :  22:09:20  Show Profile Send Gambit a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Im glad this topic has elicited such passionate (and creative!) ideas, I have thoroughly enjoyed reading everyones responses.

And Markus...why do I get the feeling that you just copied and pasted your response from a file on your computer labled "contingency plan"
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froglegg
Learned Scribe

317 Posts

Posted - 20 Oct 2010 :  22:41:14  Show Profile Send froglegg a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Reboot then see ED.

John

Long live Alias and Dragonbait! Kate Novak and Jeff Grubb the Realms need you more then ever!

On my word as a sage nothing within these pages is false, but not all of it may prove to be true. - Elminster of Shadowdale

The Old Grey Box gets better with age!
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 20 Oct 2010 :  23:30:28  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I would be afraid of a movie.

They are either fantastic (rarely) or just gawd-awful (usually). How many wretched Marvel movies had to come out before they started getting good? And they are still hit-or-miss, like ST movies.

However, the wider audience generated by film would help build the IP back up - I think a WELL-MADE cartoon would work for this. If I had control, I would give a 3-year FREE IP usage (Drizzt, specifically) to people who make the Full Metal Alchemist anime'. The old D&D cartoon was too Scooby-Dooish (which was understandable considering the 'climate' that cartoon was released into) - we need something gritty and serious to attract the new, younger audience the Forgotten Realms so desperately needs.

Why would I give them 3 years free usage? its called 'incentive' - you want folks to jump through hoops you got to give out some Scooby snacks.

quote:
Originally posted by Gambit

And Markus...why do I get the feeling that you just copied and pasted your response from a file on your computer labled "contingency plan"
Nope, all of that was written at the time.

Except that last bit - that comes from a plan for world-domination I wrote when I was 16 - still working on that.

I think my problem was working with The Brain and Plankton.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

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Tyrant
Senior Scribe

USA
586 Posts

Posted - 21 Oct 2010 :  01:09:35  Show Profile  Visit Tyrant's Homepage Send Tyrant a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

I would be afraid of a movie.

They are either fantastic (rarely) or just gawd-awful (usually).

I agree that it is a risk. That would be where patience for the right deal and the right people would help. Don't just let them slap the name on any old piece of crap they throw together (like the first D&D movie and arguably the Dragonlance animated movie that used animation that is best described as a refined 80s style depite being released in the last couple of years). I think that would be an advantage of using Dragonlance. You have a plot already hammered out. All you need is an adapted screenplay and people who know what they are doing. Work the deal so you have some level of control (script/casting approval, a written agreement on minimum budgets, etc) and keep (in this case) Weis and Hickman in the loop as well. Don't just sell the rights for quick cash. I believe the success of LotR and the Harry Potter movies will motivate an interest in these types of movies from Hollywood and show that they can make a lot of money if done right (though everyone needs to accept that changes must be made for running time and for using a different medium).
quote:
How many wretched Marvel movies had to come out before they started getting good? And they are still hit-or-miss, like ST movies.


When do we start keeping track? I don't bother with anything made before Blade. Those movies were mostly crap and obviously so. Blade was the starting point to a more serious approach to Marvel properties. Shortly after that we had XMen, which more or less ushered in the current era of decent superhero movies. Yes, there have been some misses in that time (like Elektra), but at least to me, they've been overcoming the bad name superhero movies earned in the 90s. Could some of them have been better, yes. Could all of them have been much, much worse, definitely.

Having said that, there are some important differences in the Marvel situation. Marvel sold off the film rights to avoid going bankrupt (if I recall correctly). They also sold the rights to different studios, leading to different levels of commitment by the studios. Now that they are consolidating again and not acting out of desperation, their movies (Iron Man 1 and 2, the newest Hulk, and Thor and Captain America look promising) have been getting better and better in my opinion. Were I in charge of such things, I would only let the rights go to a studio that was willing to make a good product and put their money where their mouth is (in writing). There would be no Uwe Boll wanna be anywhere near the movie. I'd let the franchise die before I let that happen.
quote:
However, the wider audience generated by film would help build the IP back up - I think a WELL-MADE cartoon would work for this. If I had control, I would give a 3-year FREE IP usage (Drizzt, specifically) to people who make the Full Metal Alchemist anime'. The old D&D cartoon was too Scooby-Dooish (which was understandable considering the 'climate' that cartoon was released into) - we need something gritty and serious to attract the new, younger audience the Forgotten Realms so desperately needs.

Why would I give them 3 years free usage? its called 'incentive' - you want folks to jump through hoops you got to give out some Scooby snacks.

I don't think I would allow free usage. I understand the reasoning, I just don't think it's necessary. A very favorable deal, sure, I can see that to get things moving. In my opinion, a better approach would be a favorable deal that could lead to an exclusive deal if both parties were satisfied with the first few products. Otherwise I think you risk a problem when you finally decide to start making money directly off the animated series. The company you give the free deal to can decide they don't want to pay for it, and any future partner will want you to replicate the very sweet deal you gave the original animator.

As a possible side concern (which I am not qualified to completely address), does doing that actually damage your control over the IP? I know that if certain parts of IP (can't recall if it's trademark or copyright, or some other third option I am forgetting) aren't actively defended then they can be ruled public property (probably not the right term). It's one reason why IP holders more or less have to sue anyone that might be infringing on their IP if they have any desire to maintain control. I don't think it would be a concern because there would no doubt be a legal agreement in place, but I am not positive and I wouldn't take the chance with the legal system if I didn't have to. All of that is of course assuming I have understood conversations I have read in various places across the internet.

As an aside, my preference would be the folks who did the animation for Vampire Hunter D: Bloodlust, or possibly X:1999. They look fairly similar (may even be the same group for all I know).

Again, these are my opinions and concerns and not meant to sound negative. Also, I may be way off base on the IP part of that.


Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me.
-The Sith Code

Teenage Sith zombies, Tulkh thought-how in the moons of Bogden had it all started? Every so often, the universe must just get bored and decide to really cut loose. -Star Wars: Red Harvest
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 21 Oct 2010 :  01:50:55  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
No, you are correct about IP. Thats why the deal would be for a limited run of Drizzt-specific stories which would be produced within a defined period of time.

The problem is if we approach a really good anime house, they might not be interested (after all, they have their own projects and IPs). The deal would have to be pretty damn sweet to get them on board. The idea isn't to make money off them, but to make money off of other products their buzz would generate (Don't give away the toy rights).

On the other side of the fence, I'm sure half a hundred craptastic animation studios would jump at the chance - but those are exactly the kinds of people we DON'T want to maker an FR cartoon.

I would also consider cutting a deal with Todd McFarlane for the toy line - the stuff he produces is both amazing (and disturbing) and also fairly inexpensive. His dragon line puts to shame the D&D minis, IMHO. I think if he did a line of collectible figures for the Companions of the Hall they would be off the hook. Just look at what he did with Santa's elves and Jack Frost

Drizzt meets Spawn.

If we keep control of the toy franchise that would be the pay-off for the cartoon deal. If the cartoon is a hit, the toys alone would support the whole rest of the FR line.

I'm not a huge Anime' guy - I only know about the stuff on Cartoon Network: Adult Swim, so I will have to look into those two you mentioned.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 21 Oct 2010 01:58:21
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Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
7966 Posts

Posted - 21 Oct 2010 :  02:22:43  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Drizzt meets Dr. Girlfriend, a much more worrisome combination if you're gonna go with Adult Swim.

[/Ayrik]
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
36779 Posts

Posted - 21 Oct 2010 :  02:25:14  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ooh, McFarlane doing FR figures... There's some serious potential there. Even more potential with having him do action figures for all of the settings! I'd love to have a warforged figure and a draconian standing side by side on my desk at work, with an Elaith Craulnober figure looking at them with disdain!

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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31701 Posts

Posted - 21 Oct 2010 :  02:51:01  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

Ooh, McFarlane doing FR figures... There's some serious potential there. Even more potential with having him do action figures for all of the settings! I'd love to have a warforged figure and a draconian standing side by side on my desk at work, with an Elaith Craulnober figure looking at them with disdain!

I'd be keen on a McFarlane warforged. I'm not sure about the draconians though. I've yet to see any draconian figures that I've actually liked.

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