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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
3286 Posts

Posted - 14 Jun 2010 :  23:11:09  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
Changes are coming to the Living Realms

I saw this over at loremaster. Interesting...

quote:
As you have seen over the last few weeks, the Living Forgotten Realms campaign is changing. We have had our first battle interactive, the Global Administrators have been much more active on the Community site, and we have seen changes to retraining and making new characters. These changes have only been the beginning, those few things the Globals could work on with the authority we had. Now that an even greater level of the campaign’s control has been turned over to the Globals, more changes will quickly follow. I am going to do my best to fill you in on some of the HUGE changes happening over the next few months, but I want to stress that this is only the tip of the iceberg.

Change of Power: WotC is turning the campaign over to the community, but in a structured fashion. LFR will still have contractors (the Globals) supervising the campaign by shepherding the plot, setting release dates and approving adventures. WoTC will still offer guidance or be involved as needed. For example, Chris Tulach is still the Organized Play Content Developer, but he will no longer have any day to day management of LFR. Everything else is now a community/volunteer effort, including adventure creation. If this works, there is hope is that this new LFR model can serve as a template for any future community-driven campaigns, whatever they might be. The Globals are now in charge of almost 100% of the campaign in almost every way. Most of these changes will be behind the scenes and the player base will likely not notice them. One particular change is of note: WOTC is 100% removing itself from approving adventures. This means that LFR will no longer be canon with the exception of certain special events that we work out with them, if any. While this may initially seem unfortunate, it is really for the best as well will no longer have to work on their timeline. We should be able to make things move much faster now.

Adventure Changes: These structural changes will affect adventures and their distribution. The campaign is now entirely driven by the community as guided by the Globals. This means we no longer have a budget and so that means we cannot afford to pay for adventures. Authors will be paid for adventures up to and including Q3 2010. Starting in Q4 2010 and beyond, authors will not be paid for adventures. Instead, the new content distribution model revolves around the Community site. In the future we hope adventures will be posted there for anyone to download. Home play will no longer be tracked/reported at all and convention/public play ordering/reporting will be greatly simplified. Certain content (such as Battle Interactives) will still only be available to conventions. This makes it especially important to be a member of this community group. In the coming weeks we will be telling you more about how this will work.
After Q3, adventure questions will no longer be used. We are looking at other methods such as polls on the Community site or critical events submissions from convention/game days during certain weeks of the adventures release. More information on this will be coming in the future.

Future Organizational Structure: Next year we will be changing a lot of things and I would like to preview a few of these with you. First, we will be drastically scaling back the number of adventures next year. This will allow us to focus more on putting out an even better product than we have in the past, and to be able to put out the adventures on time; something we have been struggling with for various reasons. LFR will have a much heavier focus on story, character investment, and player driven events in the plotline. Convention content could come from anywhere and will likely be themed/linked short series, much as it is today (ADCP, SPEC, QUES, MINI). b. An example of our total releases MIGHT look like 24 adventures for 2011 + start of Epic play + DDXP content (including a BI) + Origins content (Quest) + Gen Con Indy content (including a mini-campaign) + possible other content TBD (such as adaptations from Dungeon). This is not guaranteed… just a possible example.
Further, at the end of this year, we will be retiring all of the current regions. As of 2011 we will have "Story areas" instead of regions (their actual name remains TBD at this time), including a home base area where the PCs will start off, and many later adventures will return to as the PCs drive the story. In some ways, these Story Areas/regions will be similar to meta-regions from LG. The will include large areas enclosed by a single story theme, such as the fight against Netheril or the danger of the Abolithic Sovereignty (These are just examples, and are not meant to be thought of as two of the new regions). The home base region might have roughly 8 adventures with there being 4 other areas with approximately 4 adventures each. Story areas MAY vary from year to year depending on what we are interested in and how the story matures. Some of the most popular story lines and NPCs that you have met and interacted with in your current regional plots will likely appear in these the new story areas, as appropriate. We hope all of the quest lines currently in progress will finish by the end of Q4 of this year (with the exception of the epic plotline that is teased at Gen Con and truly begins in Q1 of 2011). Our goal is to have each area involve a detailed story over one or possibly two level bands, but we will also be tying these story areas to other community content as we develop them further. We want to really involve and invest the players much more then we have been.
To met our new needs, the organizational structure of the campaign will be changing as of next year. Please note, some of the titles for these volunteer positions I am using might change. We will retain three of the four current Global Administrator positions. There will be six Writing Directors (two for the home base and one for each of the regions). Each Writing Director will be responsible for 4 adventures per year. We will also have three Community Managers who will be responsible for maintaining parts of the community site, acting as PoCs and working as playtest leads for new adventures. I encourage all of the players to thank all of the Regional Administrators for their hard work getting LFR up and running. We couldn't have done it without them. With these changes, we are currently assessing which of the Regional Admins are interested in staying on in one of these new positions. After we determine which of the Regionals are interested in staying on, we MAY consider applicants from outside the current Regional Admin pool to fill some positions with people who are not on the current staff. We will announce to the players if, and when, this opportunity opens up and how you might take advantage of it.

This is just the beginning and we have many more details coming. You can discuss these new directions in the forums here: community.wizards.com/lfr/go/thread/view...

Again, I want to thank everyone for all the terrific help and support over these last two years. I hope you are as excited as we are about the changes coming to improve LFR.


Please no THREADCRAPPING!

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep

Edited by - Brimstone on 14 Jun 2010 23:33:28

Mr_Miscellany
Senior Scribe

545 Posts

Posted - 14 Jun 2010 :  23:54:41  Show Profile Send Mr_Miscellany a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks for the update!

I wonder if we'll see any of the older adventures (that WotC paid for) republished for use by non LFR fans? Or perhaps included as filler for DDI/Dungeon Magazine?

It'd be great to see this canon information finally.
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader

USA
3240 Posts

Posted - 15 Jun 2010 :  00:07:43  Show Profile Send Ashe Ravenheart a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone

<snip>Please no THREADCRAPPING!



AWWWWWWW! And I had everything ready to go!

Seriously though, I do like the idea of LFR being turned over to the community. I think there are great opportunities here for LFR (and, by extension, other 'Living' campaigns). I *am* disappointed that they are not going to make the material canon, but I can understand why they are doing so (to prevent an adventure from a fan mucking about their novel releases & DDi articles...).

I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.

Ashe's Character Sheet

Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs
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Kentinal
Great Reader

4685 Posts

Posted - 15 Jun 2010 :  01:06:06  Show Profile Send Kentinal a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I do not like the idea of no compensation of work it appears WotC appears no longer willing to do, without giving up copyright claim.

The no canon though at least makes some sense, paid people in the past have messed with canon more then once.

"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 15 Jun 2010 :  01:35:52  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
So basically, what we have here is a huge, 'mega-campaign' with hundreds of people involved, with smaller groups running their own seperate games and campaigns, which all have no bearing on each-other and no bearing on the canon campaign world?


Hmmmmm... me thinks I have seen this before....

We used to call it.... D&D

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

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Dark Wizard
Senior Scribe

USA
830 Posts

Posted - 15 Jun 2010 :  04:24:15  Show Profile Send Dark Wizard a Private Message  Reply with Quote
This will have positive and negative effects on the LFR community. The obvious negative is the lack of budget and compensation. There will probably be some delays as volunteer efforts are oft to encounter.

The obvious positive is that the fans have control of this now, I don't underestimate the fans and what they can offer, for this setting especially. Not being tethered to WotC's approval process and canon also opens up the possibilities of more far reaching and unconventional adventures.

This is definitely easier for their in-house development, especially the novel department. Another reason is probably that overseeing the LFR has become too large an effort to sustain both in designer (time and attention) and monetary (compensation and promotion) resources. I don't think we can discount the trimming of operations at WotC, this might just be part of it. I think they figure these things work best if they just let the fans be, the fans will continue gaming regardless.

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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
3286 Posts

Posted - 15 Jun 2010 :  05:02:54  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Further, at the end of this year, we will be retiring all of the current regions. As of 2011 we will have "Story areas" instead of regions (their actual name remains TBD at this time), including a home base area where the PCs will start off, and many later adventures will return to as the PCs drive the story. In some ways, these Story Areas/regions will be similar to meta-regions from LG.

This part makes me think they will be updating the 4E Books. They were made with the Living Realms in mind...

Thanks for the useful posts.

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore

USA
1105 Posts

Posted - 16 Jun 2010 :  16:20:20  Show Profile  Visit Garen Thal's Homepage Send Garen Thal a Private Message  Reply with Quote
This seems to me to be a combination of a number of factors:

1) WotC don't want to have to keep track of (and control traffic for) so much material. The idea, at the beginning, was that WotC would consider LFR adventures canon, but that means that they, fiction authors, and freelance writers, need to consider that material when writing their own articles. WotC doesn't have the time to aggregate all that data, authors and writers don't have access to all of those adventures (which are distributed to DMs only), and no one--not in or out of WotC--wants to have to comb through dozens of adventures to make sure someone didn't drop a hidden reference to some event that will be contradicted by a published source.

2) D&D Encounters has replaced LFR as WotC's gateway game of choice. LFR was intended to draw players in, and now that Encounters has started--with broader appeal, easier drop-in, drop-out access, and weekly, regular play, LFR simply doesn't stand up as the sort of thing that it was meant to be in relation to the core D&D experience.

3) Constriction of funds means that WotC has to pick and choose which projects, endeavors, and programs it will continue to support.

Since D&D Encounters is out-LFRing LFR (at least, according to the criteria they set for that program in the beginning), and since WotC doesn't want to deal with the headaches conflicting canon having a third channel for Forgotten Realms material brings, I'm wholly unsurprised by this move.
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 19 Jun 2010 :  08:40:21  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Just wondering - is this retroactive?

Does that mean everything the LFR has created in the past year or so is no longer considered canon?

While I love the idea that Hasbro is backing away from running the game, it makes me wonder if this isn't just 4e all over again - deciding there is 'too much lore' and people can't be bothered with all that research. Simpler for them to just keep resetting the canon to 'Zero' then to have to read anything, eh?

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

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Diffan
Great Reader

USA
4429 Posts

Posted - 23 Aug 2010 :  17:47:40  Show Profile Send Diffan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

Just wondering - is this retroactive?

Does that mean everything the LFR has created in the past year or so is no longer considered canon?

While I love the idea that Hasbro is backing away from running the game, it makes me wonder if this isn't just 4e all over again - deciding there is 'too much lore' and people can't be bothered with all that research. Simpler for them to just keep resetting the canon to 'Zero' then to have to read anything, eh?



I sure hope so. Not that I mind Canon material, but having LFR being canon and only accessable through the RPGA makes it really hard for the rest of us who can't be apart of that association to be up to speed as to what's going on in the Realms. It would be like FR publishing their novels (which are Canon) in a language no one can read and the only way to access it is to learn the language. Better to keep it separated from Canon if you ask me.
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Bakra
Senior Scribe

628 Posts

Posted - 24 Aug 2010 :  12:43:50  Show Profile Send Bakra a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

Just wondering - is this retroactive?

Does that mean everything the LFR has created in the past year or so is no longer considered canon?

While I love the idea that Hasbro is backing away from running the game, it makes me wonder if this isn't just 4e all over again - deciding there is 'too much lore' and people can't be bothered with all that research. Simpler for them to just keep resetting the canon to 'Zero' then to have to read anything, eh?



The simple answer is no. Any adventures created and released under the new LFR rules is non-canon.

I hope Candlekeep continues to be the friendly forum of fellow Realms-lovers that it has always been, as we all go through this together. If you don’t want to move to the “new” Realms, that doesn’t mean there’s anything wrong with either you or the “old” Realms. Goodness knows Candlekeep, and the hearts of its scribes, are both big enough to accommodate both. If we want them to be.
(Strikes dramatic pose, raises sword to gleam in the sunset, and hopes breeches won’t fall down.)
Enough for now. The Realms lives! I have spoken! Ale and light wines half price, served by a smiling Storm Silverhand fetchingly clad in thigh-high boots and naught else! Ahem . .
So saith Ed. <snip>
love to all,
THO
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Bakra
Senior Scribe

628 Posts

Posted - 24 Aug 2010 :  12:48:57  Show Profile Send Bakra a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan

quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

Just wondering - is this retroactive?

Does that mean everything the LFR has created in the past year or so is no longer considered canon?

While I love the idea that Hasbro is backing away from running the game, it makes me wonder if this isn't just 4e all over again - deciding there is 'too much lore' and people can't be bothered with all that research. Simpler for them to just keep resetting the canon to 'Zero' then to have to read anything, eh?



I sure hope so. Not that I mind Canon material, but having LFR being canon and only accessable through the RPGA makes it really hard for the rest of us who can't be apart of that association to be up to speed as to what's going on in the Realms. It would be like FR publishing their novels (which are Canon) in a language no one can read and the only way to access it is to learn the language. Better to keep it separated from Canon if you ask me.



What was keeping you from being part of the association? Signing up is free, getting a RPGA number is free, downloading the adventures and running them for your friends...is for free. I don't think they have charged anyone money since the Living City campaign.

I hope Candlekeep continues to be the friendly forum of fellow Realms-lovers that it has always been, as we all go through this together. If you don’t want to move to the “new” Realms, that doesn’t mean there’s anything wrong with either you or the “old” Realms. Goodness knows Candlekeep, and the hearts of its scribes, are both big enough to accommodate both. If we want them to be.
(Strikes dramatic pose, raises sword to gleam in the sunset, and hopes breeches won’t fall down.)
Enough for now. The Realms lives! I have spoken! Ale and light wines half price, served by a smiling Storm Silverhand fetchingly clad in thigh-high boots and naught else! Ahem . .
So saith Ed. <snip>
love to all,
THO
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Diffan
Great Reader

USA
4429 Posts

Posted - 24 Aug 2010 :  13:37:36  Show Profile Send Diffan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Bakra


What was keeping you from being part of the association? Signing up is free, getting a RPGA number is free, downloading the adventures and running them for your friends...is for free. I don't think they have charged anyone money since the Living City campaign.



I was under the impression that the only time you could run LFR adventures was when you signed up at your local gaming store and participated in their specific sessions. And only DMs who owned or were affilated with WotC could gain access to those adventures.

But if I can sign up (for free) and just download all the adventures on their site and run them at my house with my buds then I'm all for that.

And usually when I asked on the WotC site how someone can gain these adventures, I got no reply so I just assumed that I couldn't.
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader

USA
3240 Posts

Posted - 24 Aug 2010 :  13:44:26  Show Profile Send Ashe Ravenheart a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The only caveat is that if you run it, all the players have to join RPGA (for free) and you have to report the event back to LFR for tracking.

I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.

Ashe's Character Sheet

Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs
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Diffan
Great Reader

USA
4429 Posts

Posted - 24 Aug 2010 :  14:05:45  Show Profile Send Diffan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart

The only caveat is that if you run it, all the players have to join RPGA (for free) and you have to report the event back to LFR for tracking.



Wow, had I known it was that easy I woudl've signed up everyone from the get-go. And the tracking stuff isn't all that hard. Though it does rule out anything homebrew right?
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader

USA
3240 Posts

Posted - 24 Aug 2010 :  15:17:37  Show Profile Send Ashe Ravenheart a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yes, they have to follow the RPGA rules exactly.

I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.

Ashe's Character Sheet

Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs
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Diffan
Great Reader

USA
4429 Posts

Posted - 24 Aug 2010 :  15:41:32  Show Profile Send Diffan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart

Yes, they have to follow the RPGA rules exactly.



Hmmm...minorly disappointing as I use homebrew stuff quite often but I think the the boons far out that slight aspect. Thanks for all the info guys.
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