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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5036 Posts

Posted - 03 Oct 2010 :  03:55:57  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Heh. Hi again, all. I sent the last few posts in this thread along to Ed, and got a lightning-swift reply for Markustay:


Well, I was JUST too young to successfully persuade my parents that I should be allowed to travel across the border to attend ANY sort of concert.
However, this is something that has been pondered before, by me and Jeff Grubb and Karen Boomgaarden over drinks at a long-ago GenCon, and a definitive answer was agreed upon: only three folk of the Realms briefly attended (parts of) Woodstock, and they were Storm Silverhand, Dove, and a masked lady they brought along: Queen Filfaeril of Cormyr.

So saith Ed. There. THAT was a surprise to some of you, wasn't it? (I said "some"...)
love,
THO
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
29730 Posts

Posted - 03 Oct 2010 :  04:54:35  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message
So what did they think of the music and goings-on?

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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31687 Posts

Posted - 03 Oct 2010 :  05:08:25  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
Actually, Markustay's latest query brings up something I've been thinking about recently.

I'm going to be as simple and direct as possible with this query, because it ties in to a lot of what I'm working on at the moment:- Is there a Woodstock-equivalent in the Realms? And if so, how does it work? Who attends? And where and when is it usually held?

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)

"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage
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Jorkens
Great Reader

Norway
2950 Posts

Posted - 03 Oct 2010 :  08:55:12  Show Profile Send Jorkens a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay


Is Danilo Than really the missing Iron Butterfly bassist Philip Taylor Kramer, who is hiding in the Realms as a political refugee?

Okay, I'll take my meds now...



I thought they found his remains years ago. Although having In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida transported into the bardic schools of the Realms is a scary thought.
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Jorkens
Great Reader

Norway
2950 Posts

Posted - 03 Oct 2010 :  08:59:18  Show Profile Send Jorkens a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

Heh. Hi again, all. I sent the last few posts in this thread along to Ed, and got a lightning-swift reply for Markustay:


Well, I was JUST too young to successfully persuade my parents that I should be allowed to travel across the border to attend ANY sort of concert.
However, this is something that has been pondered before, by me and Jeff Grubb and Karen Boomgaarden over drinks at a long-ago GenCon, and a definitive answer was agreed upon: only three folk of the Realms briefly attended (parts of) Woodstock, and they were Storm Silverhand, Dove, and a masked lady they brought along: Queen Filfaeril of Cormyr.

So saith Ed. There. THAT was a surprise to some of you, wasn't it? (I said "some"...)
love,
THO



If I remember correctly Frank Mentzer was at Woodstock, could it be that Dove foretold the creation of TSR and later suggested that he join the company?

Now, as for Fzoul and that early Allman Brothers concert...
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Lord of Bones
Learned Scribe

United Kingdom
77 Posts

Posted - 03 Oct 2010 :  09:24:00  Show Profile  Visit Lord of Bones's Homepage Send Lord of Bones a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens

quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

Heh. Hi again, all. I sent the last few posts in this thread along to Ed, and got a lightning-swift reply for Markustay:


Well, I was JUST too young to successfully persuade my parents that I should be allowed to travel across the border to attend ANY sort of concert.
However, this is something that has been pondered before, by me and Jeff Grubb and Karen Boomgaarden over drinks at a long-ago GenCon, and a definitive answer was agreed upon: only three folk of the Realms briefly attended (parts of) Woodstock, and they were Storm Silverhand, Dove, and a masked lady they brought along: Queen Filfaeril of Cormyr.

So saith Ed. There. THAT was a surprise to some of you, wasn't it? (I said "some"...)
love,
THO



If I remember correctly Frank Mentzer was at Woodstock, could it be that Dove foretold the creation of TSR and later suggested that he join the company?

Now, as for Fzoul and that early Allman Brothers concert...



Sorry to keep this off-topic, but Fzoul certainly has the beard for it...

And now back on-topic, what kinds of entertainment does a man like Fzoul enjoy? Or to be more precise, back when Zhentil Keep was at its height (pre-Cyric), was there a theatre, bardic hall or anything of the like where people could go to be entertained? What would be the difference between plays and music in a place like the Keep compared to city such as Athkatla?

Come watch the Gentleman's Guide to Gaming!
http://www.youtube.com/user/clackclickbang

On my channel I review and dissect role-playing games with great gusto. Please do take a look and let me know what you think.
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5036 Posts

Posted - 04 Oct 2010 :  04:02:28  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all.
As promised, Ed has unearthed that handout from GenCon back in 1991 in response to Thauramarth's query about the zulkirs of Thay. Here (Copyright © 1991 by TSR, Inc. but handed out to a seminar audience with verbal permission given by Ed and TSR staffers that it could be reproduced and disseminated freely for use in home Realms campaigns, and this post is precisely that sort of "reproduction") is the text of "what the public can see" (those were Jim Ward's words, I believe) about the rulers of Thay:


TIYARRA ZULKIRATE (= Of the History/Lore of the Zulkirs)
{Ed Greenwood, 1991}


The zulkirs began as Thayd’s inner circle of trusted “loyals” (in their hearts, most of them were anything but, but only one—Ilkrim Hlannadar, better known to Thayan folklore as “the Dragondevoured,” thanks to Thayd’s swift and ruthless reaction to his treachery—ever dared defy him openly). These “loyals” served the founder of Thay as his personal lieutenants, who led Thayan warbands, acted as his messengers, enforcers, and assassins, and helped keep Thayd the dominant wizard in the northern lands wrested from Mulhorand and Unther, and home to many independent mages of power, until the realm of Thay was consolidated.
Originally there were seven zulkirs, then six and five through battle losses. It was only after the death of Thayd that their numbers became set, and linked to specific “schools” of wizardry.
When Thayd fell, a bitter struggle for power followed, in which scores of ambitious wizards perished. Eventually the survivors, brought to reluctant obedience by threat of being trapped in the “Escalthar’s Everlasting Curse” spell that would shapechange them every few breaths, uncontrollably, for the rest of their lives, met with the wizard Escalthar (who had devised that spell, and cast it upon most of those survivors) atop Laltharr, a bare crag (later blasted to rubble in a spell-duel) in southwestern Thay.
This moot later became known as the Council of the Black Star (after the black star mage-sigil used by Escalthar). At the Council it was agreed that there would eight zulkirs, each of them a master of a school of wizardry: Abjuration, Conjuration, Enchantment, Evocation, Illusion, Necromancy, and Transmutation. (Over the years, the zulkirs of Thay have been almost exclusively Thayan, and male humans, but no zulkirate has any formal requirements of residency, race, or gender.)
Outsiders have been told different wild tales about this or that zulkir, or how the ruling structure of Thay came about, but this is—so far as Mystra has confirmed—the truth.
Elminster and Khelben believe they have uncovered evidence that Escalthar—who mysteriously vanished, shortly after the Council, and has never been seen since (though there are many rumors and fear-whispered tales, down the years since, of his being seen by dying Red Wizards or watching crucial events in the unfolding governance of Thay) was either the god Azuth in disguise, or a pawn of Azuth at the time of the Council, but neither Azuth nor Mystra will confirm this. According to the Old Mage, the two deities, whenever asked about such matters, “merely smile.”
Only Szass Tam has held office (formally, “zulkirate,” though this term has been rarely used in the last two centuries) among the zulkirs in any consistent manner since 1300.
The “First Zulkirate” or initial eight zulkirs, appointed at the Council in the autumn of 1030 DR, were:

Hahlomede Teeos (Abjuration): known as “Blackwyrm” for his everpresent tattered black robes and cloaks, that rendered him immune to dragon attacks and made dragons actively avoid him, Teeos loved to act mysterious and to track down lost treasures, old magics, and deceptions, this last sort of hunting quickly making him very unpopular with many Thayans; he became the feared, tireless, and increasingly hated “investigator” of the First Zulkirate

Tlantros Tulhoond (Conjuration): an aloof, private man who feared attack at all times, and was therefore always ready for battle, with schemes and “hanging” spells galore ready as both defenses and deterrents, in addition to the monsters he could magically whisk from elsewhere to his side; a sophisticated lover of music, wines, subtle behaviour, and “refinement” who opposed Thay’s ever-greater reliance on slavery and the plundering of its resources at the expense of rejuvenating the land (he hated mines and quarries, preferring that Thay take what it needed from other lands by conquest or magical seizure and transportation)

Zarhandro Laeluth (Enchantment): a fat, jovial man who deceived his fellow zulkirs—and everyone else he had any contact with, in life—as much as possible; made frequent use of doubles to make it appear that he was in one place while he was busy in another; often bubbled with gleeful laughter as he tricked or slew or took cruel revenges; trusted by very few, and feared by many, especially tharchions (whom he was known to have personally slain scores of, over the unfolding years, many by torture); a hedonist who loved exotic foods and long, gluttonous feasts

Dlueae Sharshyndree (Evocation): the first female zulkir, Dlueae [pronounced “Dul-LOO-ay”] was a curvaceous woman with a melodious voice and alluring walk—who also had a coarse-featured and mannish face; she “had to shave like a man” and had acquired several disfiguring facial scars in her youthful adventuring career, and as a result customarily hid her face behind full head masks, which she sometimes augmented with a warrior’s battle-helm; a bold and calm battle-leader and a good tactician, she served Thay well in warfare and built ever-increasing influence over her fellow zulkirs, both by taking them as lovers and befriending them with aid and assistance for their personal projects, and by often stating and refining successful policies for Thay that she got her fellow zulkirs to support (and that they therefore took pride in); a mediator and peacemaker among her fellow zulkirs

Yaerind Mahl (Illusion): an inscrutable man of few words and fewer direct answers, stances, or clear statements, who customarily cloaked his true appearance with magical disguises, and preferred to spend much time roaming Thay appearing as various creatures, to spy and learn (and sometimes strike down treachery—which he widely defined as “anything he disliked”—where and when he found it); was the first zulkir to force many apprentices and dupes to pretend to be him, so they perished in attacks meant to slay him, so he could strike down those who’d thought they’d killed the Zulkir of Illusion; possessed a pair of golden lions (figurines of wondrous power) that hunted and slew at his command

Tarabbas Mroound (Necromancy): a tall, sardonic, cadaver-thin man who “disappeared into bones” at will, and apparently did so permanently, soon after being named zulkir, apparently of his own volition and not due to any attack launched by a rival or would-be successor; many Thayan night-rumors insist he lives on, still, watching over Thay and covertly bringing misfortune to those he dislikes, whilst aiding those he favors

Kulvur Naraelond (Transmutation): a sly, witty, smart-mouthed trickster of a man, handsome and acrobatic, who was trusted by few; most men loathed him, and most women found him irresistible; a hedonist who seemingly cared more for enjoyment of food, drink, lovemaking, and diversions—even elaborate pranks—more than anything else in life; made many foes very quickly, and did not last long in office (or life)



The only complete roster of the zulkirate known to outlanders (non-Thayans) after the First Zulkirate but before the 1350s DR, comes from an anonymous slave’s account, TWELVE WINTERS UNDER THE LASH, that was smuggled out of Thay in late 1300 DR. It gives a partial roster of the zulkirate, as follows:

Eldryn Lammaraster (Abjuration): an old, bitter, grim pessimist who saw treachery and would-be successors around ever corner, in every shadow, and behind every door—and prepared himself accordingly, between manyfold layers of defensive magics; his specialty was spells—many of which died with him—that had nasty counter-attacks built into them, triggered by their defensive activation and not by the caster having to trigger them

Balineth Skroun (Conjuration): a toad-faced, forbidding man who used intimidation and prepared “stage tricks” of magic to cow many a rival or defiant underling, Skroun hid well his deep love of Thay and his real loyalty to his fellow zulkirs; over time, became as trusted by his fellow zulkirs as any holder of a zulkirate has ever been, and with good reason; a true “team player” who looked ahead and acted for the betterment of Thay, beneath a surly public mask

Iyrith Telgahlagar (Enchantment): described as a darkly handsome, bearded man who was urbane, soft-spoken, and a master strategist and diplomat, the most dominant of the zulkirs through his skilled forging of alliances with his fellow zulkirs and among the tharchions and tharchionesses; ruthless in slaying rivals who act against him, often through spells delivered by bats that fly under his direction; once described by a Red Wizard as “Asmodeus among us,” and probably the closest of any individual to being the true ruler of Thay, at the time

Uldreth Korroth (Evocation): a grossly fat, lewd, aggressive man known for having layer upon layer of backup spells and schemes, and for being a jovial friend to all zulkirs, and a cruel, ruthless trickster to tharchions, tharchionesses, and all Thayans of lower station whom he had contact with; enjoyed frequent personal slayings of the “spectacular butchery” sort

Mahlind Yarrr (Transmutation): a short, dark-haired, slender man of very few words, who always dressed in crimson robes and was very efficient and a master of foreseeing or anticipating events, treacheries against him, and likely outcomes, and preparing for them; almost always on the “winning side” in policy disputes among the zulkirs, who made few fierce foes and enriched himself greatly with trade outside Thay involving manipulated agents and dupes, in sales of drugs and gems, and prostitution


So saith Ed. His mention of the 1350s DR of course refers to all the published Realmslore (FR6/DREAMS OF THE RED WIZARDS, RED MAGIC, and everything since) that has made the identities, activities, aims, and roster changes of the zulkirs of that era clear to all interested scribes.
So here you are . . . enjoy!
love to all,
THO

Edited by - The Hooded One on 04 Oct 2010 04:03:29
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createvmind
Senior Scribe

490 Posts

Posted - 04 Oct 2010 :  05:06:03  Show Profile  Visit createvmind's Homepage Send createvmind a Private Message
Hello all,

Not sure if it's been asked before, vampiric weapons that damage an undead or negative energy creature do what to the wielder if they are not negative energy creature?
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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
2868 Posts

Posted - 04 Oct 2010 :  05:39:14  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

Hi again, all.
As promised, Ed has unearthed that handout from GenCon back in 1991 in response to Thauramarth's query about the zulkirs of Thay. Here (Copyright © 1991 by TSR, Inc. but handed out to a seminar audience with verbal permission given by Ed and TSR staffers that it could be reproduced and disseminated freely for use in home Realms campaigns, and this post is precisely that sort of "reproduction") is the text of "what the public can see" (those were Jim Ward's words, I believe) about the rulers of Thay:


TIYARRA ZULKIRATE (= Of the History/Lore of the Zulkirs)
{Ed Greenwood, 1991}


The zulkirs began as Thayd’s inner circle of trusted “loyals” (in their hearts, most of them were anything but, but only one—Ilkrim Hlannadar, better known to Thayan folklore as “the Dragondevoured,” thanks to Thayd’s swift and ruthless reaction to his treachery—ever dared defy him openly). These “loyals” served the founder of Thay as his personal lieutenants, who led Thayan warbands, acted as his messengers, enforcers, and assassins, and helped keep Thayd the dominant wizard in the northern lands wrested from Mulhorand and Unther, and home to many independent mages of power, until the realm of Thay was consolidated.
Originally there were seven zulkirs, then six and five through battle losses. It was only after the death of Thayd that their numbers became set, and linked to specific “schools” of wizardry.
When Thayd fell, a bitter struggle for power followed, in which scores of ambitious wizards perished. Eventually the survivors, brought to reluctant obedience by threat of being trapped in the “Escalthar’s Everlasting Curse” spell that would shapechange them every few breaths, uncontrollably, for the rest of their lives, met with the wizard Escalthar (who had devised that spell, and cast it upon most of those survivors) atop Laltharr, a bare crag (later blasted to rubble in a spell-duel) in southwestern Thay.
This moot later became known as the Council of the Black Star (after the black star mage-sigil used by Escalthar). At the Council it was agreed that there would eight zulkirs, each of them a master of a school of wizardry: Abjuration, Conjuration, Enchantment, Evocation, Illusion, Necromancy, and Transmutation. (Over the years, the zulkirs of Thay have been almost exclusively Thayan, and male humans, but no zulkirate has any formal requirements of residency, race, or gender.)
Outsiders have been told different wild tales about this or that zulkir, or how the ruling structure of Thay came about, but this is—so far as Mystra has confirmed—the truth.
Elminster and Khelben believe they have uncovered evidence that Escalthar—who mysteriously vanished, shortly after the Council, and has never been seen since (though there are many rumors and fear-whispered tales, down the years since, of his being seen by dying Red Wizards or watching crucial events in the unfolding governance of Thay) was either the god Azuth in disguise, or a pawn of Azuth at the time of the Council, but neither Azuth nor Mystra will confirm this. According to the Old Mage, the two deities, whenever asked about such matters, “merely smile.”
Only Szass Tam has held office (formally, “zulkirate,” though this term has been rarely used in the last two centuries) among the zulkirs in any consistent manner since 1300.
The “First Zulkirate” or initial eight zulkirs, appointed at the Council in the autumn of 1030 DR, were:

Hahlomede Teeos (Abjuration): known as “Blackwyrm” for his everpresent tattered black robes and cloaks, that rendered him immune to dragon attacks and made dragons actively avoid him, Teeos loved to act mysterious and to track down lost treasures, old magics, and deceptions, this last sort of hunting quickly making him very unpopular with many Thayans; he became the feared, tireless, and increasingly hated “investigator” of the First Zulkirate

Tlantros Tulhoond (Conjuration): an aloof, private man who feared attack at all times, and was therefore always ready for battle, with schemes and “hanging” spells galore ready as both defenses and deterrents, in addition to the monsters he could magically whisk from elsewhere to his side; a sophisticated lover of music, wines, subtle behaviour, and “refinement” who opposed Thay’s ever-greater reliance on slavery and the plundering of its resources at the expense of rejuvenating the land (he hated mines and quarries, preferring that Thay take what it needed from other lands by conquest or magical seizure and transportation)

Zarhandro Laeluth (Enchantment): a fat, jovial man who deceived his fellow zulkirs—and everyone else he had any contact with, in life—as much as possible; made frequent use of doubles to make it appear that he was in one place while he was busy in another; often bubbled with gleeful laughter as he tricked or slew or took cruel revenges; trusted by very few, and feared by many, especially tharchions (whom he was known to have personally slain scores of, over the unfolding years, many by torture); a hedonist who loved exotic foods and long, gluttonous feasts

Dlueae Sharshyndree (Evocation): the first female zulkir, Dlueae [pronounced “Dul-LOO-ay”] was a curvaceous woman with a melodious voice and alluring walk—who also had a coarse-featured and mannish face; she “had to shave like a man” and had acquired several disfiguring facial scars in her youthful adventuring career, and as a result customarily hid her face behind full head masks, which she sometimes augmented with a warrior’s battle-helm; a bold and calm battle-leader and a good tactician, she served Thay well in warfare and built ever-increasing influence over her fellow zulkirs, both by taking them as lovers and befriending them with aid and assistance for their personal projects, and by often stating and refining successful policies for Thay that she got her fellow zulkirs to support (and that they therefore took pride in); a mediator and peacemaker among her fellow zulkirs

Yaerind Mahl (Illusion): an inscrutable man of few words and fewer direct answers, stances, or clear statements, who customarily cloaked his true appearance with magical disguises, and preferred to spend much time roaming Thay appearing as various creatures, to spy and learn (and sometimes strike down treachery—which he widely defined as “anything he disliked”—where and when he found it); was the first zulkir to force many apprentices and dupes to pretend to be him, so they perished in attacks meant to slay him, so he could strike down those who’d thought they’d killed the Zulkir of Illusion; possessed a pair of golden lions (figurines of wondrous power) that hunted and slew at his command

Tarabbas Mroound (Necromancy): a tall, sardonic, cadaver-thin man who “disappeared into bones” at will, and apparently did so permanently, soon after being named zulkir, apparently of his own volition and not due to any attack launched by a rival or would-be successor; many Thayan night-rumors insist he lives on, still, watching over Thay and covertly bringing misfortune to those he dislikes, whilst aiding those he favors

Kulvur Naraelond (Transmutation): a sly, witty, smart-mouthed trickster of a man, handsome and acrobatic, who was trusted by few; most men loathed him, and most women found him irresistible; a hedonist who seemingly cared more for enjoyment of food, drink, lovemaking, and diversions—even elaborate pranks—more than anything else in life; made many foes very quickly, and did not last long in office (or life)



The only complete roster of the zulkirate known to outlanders (non-Thayans) after the First Zulkirate but before the 1350s DR, comes from an anonymous slave’s account, TWELVE WINTERS UNDER THE LASH, that was smuggled out of Thay in late 1300 DR. It gives a partial roster of the zulkirate, as follows:

Eldryn Lammaraster (Abjuration): an old, bitter, grim pessimist who saw treachery and would-be successors around ever corner, in every shadow, and behind every door—and prepared himself accordingly, between manyfold layers of defensive magics; his specialty was spells—many of which died with him—that had nasty counter-attacks built into them, triggered by their defensive activation and not by the caster having to trigger them

Balineth Skroun (Conjuration): a toad-faced, forbidding man who used intimidation and prepared “stage tricks” of magic to cow many a rival or defiant underling, Skroun hid well his deep love of Thay and his real loyalty to his fellow zulkirs; over time, became as trusted by his fellow zulkirs as any holder of a zulkirate has ever been, and with good reason; a true “team player” who looked ahead and acted for the betterment of Thay, beneath a surly public mask

Iyrith Telgahlagar (Enchantment): described as a darkly handsome, bearded man who was urbane, soft-spoken, and a master strategist and diplomat, the most dominant of the zulkirs through his skilled forging of alliances with his fellow zulkirs and among the tharchions and tharchionesses; ruthless in slaying rivals who act against him, often through spells delivered by bats that fly under his direction; once described by a Red Wizard as “Asmodeus among us,” and probably the closest of any individual to being the true ruler of Thay, at the time

Uldreth Korroth (Evocation): a grossly fat, lewd, aggressive man known for having layer upon layer of backup spells and schemes, and for being a jovial friend to all zulkirs, and a cruel, ruthless trickster to tharchions, tharchionesses, and all Thayans of lower station whom he had contact with; enjoyed frequent personal slayings of the “spectacular butchery” sort

Mahlind Yarrr (Transmutation): a short, dark-haired, slender man of very few words, who always dressed in crimson robes and was very efficient and a master of foreseeing or anticipating events, treacheries against him, and likely outcomes, and preparing for them; almost always on the “winning side” in policy disputes among the zulkirs, who made few fierce foes and enriched himself greatly with trade outside Thay involving manipulated agents and dupes, in sales of drugs and gems, and prostitution


So saith Ed. His mention of the 1350s DR of course refers to all the published Realmslore (FR6/DREAMS OF THE RED WIZARDS, RED MAGIC, and everything since) that has made the identities, activities, aims, and roster changes of the zulkirs of that era clear to all interested scribes.
So here you are . . . enjoy!
love to all,
THO



"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
4747 Posts

Posted - 04 Oct 2010 :  14:58:05  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message
Awesome stuff THO - give Ed a hearty thanks for this treasure trove.

I note that Ed has previously given us pre-zulkir lore on Thay and the founding of the Red Wizards which indicated that Szass Tam was a hidden power behind that organisation pretty much from its inception. Given that, what was Szass's role in the founding of the zulkirate (if any) and can he tell us more regarding Szass and Thayd and what dealings they had with one another (covertly or openly)- again, if any?

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
13284 Posts

Posted - 04 Oct 2010 :  17:20:09  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
Thank You so much for those last two replies, Ed and THO. Was only half-joking about my query, but that was an awesome (and unexpected) response.

Soooooo... Filfarel's been 'around the block', eh?

@Quale - That was only the remains that the CIA wanted us to find.
The mathematical formulas he was working on had certain dimensional implications (hence my wondering if he 'made it' elsewhere).

And although Elvis wasn't at Woodstock, we know from MIB that "Elvis isn't dead, son... he just went home"

Which is why my 'Old West meets the Realms' campaign had a Bard named Elvish Presley.

What can be cooler then sideburns with pointed ears?

@Brimstone - You quoted an entire huge post just for a smiley?

And this brings me back to a question I asked quite some time ago, that I believe I only got a 'yes' response to, IIRC, and would love to get at least one name.

Are there any 'Earthers' living in the Realms, either now or in the past, for any length of time?

In my old GH campaign I had the party meet an elderly (and rather melancholy) Amelia Earhart, although they never 'got it' (she only went by 'Amelia'). I hate those kinds of 'missing persons', and would like to think at least some of them are happily living somewhere else.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 04 Oct 2010 19:04:06
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Lord of Bones
Learned Scribe

United Kingdom
77 Posts

Posted - 04 Oct 2010 :  18:22:24  Show Profile  Visit Lord of Bones's Homepage Send Lord of Bones a Private Message
That lore on the zulkirs or Thay was quite frankly... superb. My thanks to you!

Come watch the Gentleman's Guide to Gaming!
http://www.youtube.com/user/clackclickbang

On my channel I review and dissect role-playing games with great gusto. Please do take a look and let me know what you think.
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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
2868 Posts

Posted - 05 Oct 2010 :  03:47:51  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message
Yes Markus!! That lore was outstanding!!





"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
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Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 05 Oct 2010 :  05:25:51  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message
Thanks Ed and THO for sharing that Zulkirate lore!

Of all the zulkirs mentioned, I find Balineth Skroun most commendable. Dmitra Flass seems to be his female counterpart. Iyrith Telgahlagar, on the other hand, is the most interesting. “Asmodeus among us”---had Szass Tam been around then, he would have been amazed with him, and would have undoubtedly done everything to gain an alliance with him.

I just notice that there's no Zulkir of Divination in the first Zulkirate. So who exactly is the first zulkir of that school and when did he/she occupy that office?

Every beginning has an end.
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createvmind
Senior Scribe

490 Posts

Posted - 05 Oct 2010 :  20:59:51  Show Profile  Visit createvmind's Homepage Send createvmind a Private Message
Follow up to my vampiric queation, can constant use of such a weapon on myriad of creatures begin to change it's wielder over time, mutate him?
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Karth
Learned Scribe

USA
81 Posts

Posted - 05 Oct 2010 :  21:04:46  Show Profile  Visit Karth's Homepage  Send Karth an AOL message Send Karth a Private Message
Lady Hooded, this is probably one you can answer quickly, yourself. Is entry through the main gates of Waterdeep shut down at night by the Guard, or is it 24/7 access? I can see arguments for them doing it either way, and I can find/remember nothing in published lore that makes note of it, either way.
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5036 Posts

Posted - 06 Oct 2010 :  02:36:37  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all.
Karth, I'm afraid the answer to your question is: it depends.
On when (era) your Realms campaign is set, and what time of year it is, and what the current situation is (wartime or peacetime for Waterdeep, orc horde expected or not, etc.)
Or to put matters another way:
Up through the 1380s, the gates were always closed at night. The HARBOUR remained open (unless storms or threat of attack caused its closing [[raising of the harbor chains]]) around the proverbial clock (meaning: even before there were clocks ;} ), but the gates closed at nightfall and were opened at "full dawn." Exceptions being: when City Guard commanders of certain high ranks, or the Open Lord of Waterdeep, ordered them opened during night hours for a specific purpose (usually just long enough to let someone specific in or out).
After the Spellplague effects and aftereffects settled down, Waterdeep tried keeping the gates open clock-round during the trading season (meaning: not during winter, but all the rest of any year UNLESS there was threat of war, raids, orc hordes, plague or disease epidemics, etc.) for several long periods (decades).
Then some trouble - -usually brigands - - would erupt that would cause them to close the gates at nightfall again, for a bit, until demands by local guilds, caravan companies, and independent outland traders caused them to try opening the gates again.
(This lore comes from Ed, who discussed this topic with Susan Morris as part of editing the ED GREENWOOD PRESENTS WATERDEEP series. I know about it because he discussed it with me, too.)
love,
THO
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5036 Posts

Posted - 06 Oct 2010 :  02:44:34  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again.
Lord of Bones, this excellent query: "And now back on-topic, what kinds of entertainment does a man like Fzoul enjoy? Or to be more precise, back when Zhentil Keep was at its height (pre-Cyric), was there a theatre, bardic hall or anything of the like where people could go to be entertained? What would be the difference between plays and music in a place like the Keep compared to city such as Athkatla?" deserves a proper answer from Ed, but I know Fzoul enjoys plays that involve deceptions ("comedy of manners" of the Noel Coward and Oscar Wilde sorts) from Realmsplay with Ed as DM, and (same source for my knowledge) Zhentil Keep at the time you've mentioned had both strip shows ("pleasure queen revels") and about a dozen theatres of various sorts, which were all popular/packed (by various sorts, I mean venues that customarily offered the same SORT of play each night, specializing in either variety of the sort that Americans might term vaudeville and British might call music hall, or what we could call opera (serious plays involving tragedy, love [usually doomed], and high adventure, that had songs), or what we might term snide comedy/satire of current politics and life "protest plays." Manshoon loved these latter entertainments, and let them continue even when they became highly critical of his growing power and the tightening Zhentarim grip on the city.
Ed will, of course, provide more details when he has time for proper Realmslore replies (he's VERY busy right now, and low on funds and therefore needing to stay busy)...
love,
THO
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5036 Posts

Posted - 06 Oct 2010 :  02:49:18  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
. . . and hello again, everyone.
George, you're very welcome. Ed was delighted that he could FIND that handout so quickly, after all these years.
Adn to you and to dennis, I have to regretfully say: I've passed your specific questions (re. Szass Tam, the first Zulkir of Divination, etc.) on to Ed for eventual replies, but I have to warn you that I think NDAs are going to rise up here, because I KNOW there's an "untold tale" regarding Szass Tam's early life and career in the Realmslore TSR/Wizards is sitting on - - by this I don't mean Ed-penned fiction, but Ed-penned game lore, that someone at TSR seized upon eagerly for some project or other . . . and hasn't yet relinquished, despite the project not (yet) seeing print.
So, we'll just have to hope, but it's not a bright and strong hope, I fear...
love,
THO
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Karth
Learned Scribe

USA
81 Posts

Posted - 06 Oct 2010 :  03:58:23  Show Profile  Visit Karth's Homepage  Send Karth an AOL message Send Karth a Private Message
quote:
(This lore comes from Ed, who discussed this topic with Susan Morris as part of editing the ED GREENWOOD PRESENTS WATERDEEP series. I know about it because he discussed it with me, too.)
love,
THO


Perfect, Hooded Lady. Thank you again. To paraphrase Dune: 'The Realmslore must flow...' ;)
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Jorkens
Great Reader

Norway
2950 Posts

Posted - 06 Oct 2010 :  10:12:27  Show Profile Send Jorkens a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
I know Fzoul enjoys plays that involve deceptions ("comedy of manners" of the Noel Coward and Oscar Wilde sorts)



Thats not what I would have guessed, but I love the idea. How does the farcical elements where society and morals are concerned, so important for these writers, play itself out? I am asking as the Realms (and Zenthil Keep) naturally has quite different views and societies from the early 20th century. Especialy where sex and relationships are conserned. I can see a Sembian or Cormyrean play that describes the newly rich and the vain of the upper classes, but how would the Moonsea versions play this out? And are the plays locally written or preferably imported pieces ridiculing the adversaries in other countries?
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 06 Oct 2010 :  16:52:50  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

. . . and hello again, everyone.
George, you're very welcome. Ed was delighted that he could FIND that handout so quickly, after all these years.
Adn to you and to dennis, I have to regretfully say: I've passed your specific questions (re. Szass Tam, the first Zulkir of Divination, etc.) on to Ed for eventual replies, but I have to warn you that I think NDAs are going to rise up here, because I KNOW there's an "untold tale" regarding Szass Tam's early life and career in the Realmslore TSR/Wizards is sitting on - - by this I don't mean Ed-penned fiction, but Ed-penned game lore, that someone at TSR seized upon eagerly for some project or other . . . and hasn't yet relinquished, despite the project not (yet) seeing print.
So, we'll just have to hope, but it's not a bright and strong hope, I fear...
love,
THO



No real surprise... we had "points of light" long before the Spellplague, in the form of pinholes in the NDA-shrouds such as Brian James' excellent article on Ironfang Keep... that's what the phrase "points of light" means to me.

Hrm... someone who was at TSR then, and is still with Wizbro now... there aren't many of those. Unless this someone is now or always was a freelancer. Either way, I won't speculate on names. Nor will I ask about my favourite piece of must-be-released lore; I know Ed and Brian C. are doing all they can to drag it kicking and screaming into the light... what little of that there is these days.

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 06 Oct 2010 :  16:58:25  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

Hi again, all.
sfdragon, re. your questions, above, about The Simbul devouring magic items...Ed says this:

The short answer to your question is: Yes to your first question, so of course "No" to your second.
The long answer: NDA. I can't say more until some future books have been published. Ahem: hint, hint.


Heh. So saith Ed.
Who often aches to say more than he can.
love,
THO



Hrm... I had already suspected the short answer, but the long answer intrigues me by its wording... "books" plural... more than just Bury Elminster Deep, then?

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 06 Oct 2010 16:59:22
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Thauramarth
Senior Scribe

United Kingdom
652 Posts

Posted - 06 Oct 2010 :  18:29:24  Show Profile Send Thauramarth a Private Message
Ed & THO,

Thanks for the great, great Zulkir lore, which is making its way straight to my files on Thay. A follow-on question (likely to hit NDA, but that's never stopped anyone from asking the question).

quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One


The zulkirs began as Thayd’s inner circle of trusted “loyals” (in their hearts, most of them were anything but, but only one—Ilkrim Hlannadar, better known to Thayan folklore as “the Dragondevoured,” thanks to Thayd’s swift and ruthless reaction to his treachery—ever dared defy him openly). These “loyals” served the founder of Thay as his personal lieutenants, who led Thayan warbands, acted as his messengers, enforcers, and assassins, and helped keep Thayd the dominant wizard in the northern lands wrested from Mulhorand and Unther, and home to many independent mages of power, until the realm of Thay was consolidated.


When reading this, I get the impression that Thayd was around at the time of the first zulkirate, which seems to coincide with the foundation of Thay as an independent nation. Published realmslore puts Thayd as being executed around -1087, which is almost two millenia prior to the "official" founding of Thay (922).

So, I was wondering - was Thayd around as late as 922? perhaps in a form that allowed him to survive being executed by the God-Kings of Mulhorand, such as a clone, or as a lich?

Club Secretary of the Dragons on the Hill RPG Club of London, UK: http://dragonsonthehill.co.uk/.
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5036 Posts

Posted - 06 Oct 2010 :  18:53:26  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all.
Thauramarth, Thayd survived as an undead sentience (perhaps unique; Ed hasn't said) that could possess living bodies (mammals of all sorts), but "burned them out" rapidly (a matter of two tendays at most). He clung to the company of his lieutenants . . . but eventually vanished, either destroyed by one of them or "lost" when a body burned out "under him" when he couldn't reach another to attack it...or for some other reason or cause, that PERHAPS has him lurking to this day, awaiting a chance to rise again...

So saith Ed, paraphrased by me.
love,
THO
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