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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader

USA
3747 Posts

Posted - 30 Apr 2010 :  23:28:00  Show Profile  Click to see Alystra Illianniis's MSN Messenger address Send Alystra Illianniis a Private Message
Thank you for the answer. Any chance we can ever see that lore?

The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.

"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491

"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs

Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469

My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188

Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader

USA
3074 Posts

Posted - 01 May 2010 :  00:01:16  Show Profile Send Ashe Ravenheart a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Foxhelm

Also when will we see Elminster goes Hawaiian? With all of the Seven sisters in coconut bras, grass skirts and nothing else?





You forgot the lovely THO!

And get out of my dreams!

I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.

Ashe's Character Sheet

Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 01 May 2010 :  16:39:19  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all.
Alystra Illianniis, it's doubtful we'll see that lore in any sort of comprehensive manner (though details about this or that particular NPC might well leak out, over time). Once it was submitted to TSR and they'd paid for it (and this lore was part of the massive, umpteen-part original Realms turnover, sent throughout 1986), it became their property and they (now WotC, and part of Hasbro) retain full control over it.
When it comes to the Chosen, at the time setting of the Realms upthrough D&D 3.5, they no longer need familiars - - because they can call on Mystra's other servitors if need be, and use the Weave.

And Foxhelm and Ashe Ravenheart, I'm not sure Elminster likes that much sun. Exposure, yes . . .
love,
THO
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 01 May 2010 :  16:45:27  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all.
Joran Nobleheart, this just arrived, from Ed:


Yes, the order does have a modest chapterhouse in Waterdeep. It's a small but impressive three-floors-above-the-street, one-cellar-below stone building (with stout stone pillars supporting a "porch roof" over the double-doors entrance) in North Ward.
Specifically, it's located on the east side of Whaelgond Way, two doors south of the Jardeth noble family villa.

So saith Ed. Creator of Waterdeep, and (still) most of the people and places in it.
love to all,
THO
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
4906 Posts

Posted - 01 May 2010 :  17:03:33  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by crazedventurers

quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
"What do you mean, I can't build my novel premise on the assertion that King Draxius was a lich?"

There's devil in the detail, kids. There always is.

-- George Krashos




Is there in this case George?

Inquiring minds etc



Cheers

Damian



I could tell you, but then I'd have to kill you.

Seriously, King Draxius was many things. AS for whether he was one of the undead, well ... I guess we'll all have to wait and see. When is that Lineage gonna hit the light of day?

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 01 May 2010 :  17:22:50  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Sigh. Ed's still working on that, George. Really.
Alystra, for more on Mystra's servitors, see SECRETS OF THE MAGISTER.
sfdragon, re. your three questions: I'm sure Ed has no idea why the Unicorn Run was left off the map, or when/if the LeShay are going to get 4e treatment. Those are questions better posed to Wizards of the Coast (Ed's never been an employee at TSR or WotC, and has no say over those sort of purely publishing decisions).
Menelvagor, there's nothing that disturbs Ed (or me, for that matter) about the topic you raised regarding El's relationship with Storm and Alassra. These sorts of controversies and problems (if they grow into that) arise when readers/gamers apply real-world contemporary moral codes and viewpoints to the Realms. (For example, Riverwind in the Waterdeep's army thread seeing Waterdhavian authorities bursting into a citizen's home as an invasion of privacy or over the legal line or something of the sort. Quite so, in the modern real-world United States. Not so at all, in Waterdeep in the Realms.)
There was nothing against Waterdhavian law in Mirt marrying his ward, once she was an adult (and as it happens, SHE seduced him and decided she wanted to spend her life with him and no other partner).
In the case of El and the Seven, he was not their father, but was a "courtesy uncle" who raised some of them (at Mystra's command) when they were toddlers to teens. They were Chosen, and all VERY independent . . . and literally centuries later, after almost all the people they knew when they were young are long dead, and kingdoms have risen and fallen (including places they ruled and they determined or influenced or altered the laws of), their friendships and working relationships with El (as fellow Chosen) briefly become romantic.
They are all human, and desperately trying to remain so, they are all less than sane, and they are all LONELY. Yes, they have Mystra and each other, but they lose everyone else to the cold hand of time . . . so they seek refuge in each other.
It's hardly surprising that they end up having affairs (and in a few instances, such as Khelben and Laeral, formally marrying each other).
I find it surprising that rather than just accepting that this is what these fictional characters have done or are doing, so many gamers try to judge them according to modern real-world mores.
The Realms is a medieval-cum-Renaissance FANTASY world, in which magic works, intelligent dragons and elves and dwarves interact with humans on a daily basis, gods can be talked to directly (and those multiple deities issue multiple, often-conflicting decrees and codes) . . . and, yes, people make love to each other. Sometimes one guy with women who are sisters. [sarcasm on] Gosh!

love to all,
THO
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Menelvagor
Senior Scribe

Israel
352 Posts

Posted - 01 May 2010 :  18:51:37  Show Profile  Visit Menelvagor's Homepage Send Menelvagor a Private Message
Indeed, I completely agree. But are these Ed's words, or your interpretation of his views, along with your own? Not that I don't greatly appreciate your views (or my view of you) or interpretations (especially to some of my vaguely worded offers), but I'm wondering whether I can relay this to others as Ed's take, or should wait for more.
EDIT: also, brought on by a thread I just read: Will we see or hear about that awesome 'raw wizardly casting power stronger than Larloch', The Srinshee and how the Spellplague affected her in Elminster Must Die or any planned/forthcoming books/lore?

"Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker?
Behold, he put no trust in his servants; and his angels he charged with folly.
How much less them that dwell in houses of clay, whose foundation in the dust, are crushed before the moth?" - Eliphaz the Temanite, Job IV, 17-19.

"Yea, though he live a thousand years twice, yet hath he seen no good: do not all go to one place?" - Ecclesiastes VI, 6.

"There are no stupid questions just a bunch of inquisitive idiots."

"Let's not call it 'hijacking'. Let's call it 'Thread Drift'."

Edited by - Menelvagor on 01 May 2010 19:07:00
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
30283 Posts

Posted - 01 May 2010 :  19:10:59  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

They are all human, and desperately trying to remain so, they are all less than sane, and they are all LONELY. Yes, they have Mystra and each other, but they lose everyone else to the cold hand of time . . . so they seek refuge in each other.


It brings to mind the relationship between Crowley and Aziraphale, in Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman's Good Omens. Crowley was a demon, and Aziraphale was an angel... But they'd both been on Earth since the time of Adam and Eve, and even though they were technically enemies, they were also the only consistent contacts thru 6000 years -- so they were almost friends, because they were so familiar with each other.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Editor and scribe for The Candlekeep Compendium

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 01 May 2010 :  20:18:33  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all.
Menelvagor, this from Ed, just received (I forwarded him this page of the thread earlier today):


Hi. Menelvagor, THO in her answer to you paraphrased my words (written to TSR designers in the past and WotC staffers more recently) very closely, so you can, yes, take her reply to be my views on this, too.
And regarding the Srinshee: I'd love to answer you, but what you ask about is very much NDA'd, right now. Sorry.
As a general rule, answering just about any clear and specific question about the contents of future Realms novels is going to be a no-no, except when asked of Wizards staff people.


So saith Ed. Who will be sending me more Realmslore replies when he can, he promises.
love to all,
THO
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Joran Nobleheart
Senior Scribe

USA
489 Posts

Posted - 01 May 2010 :  20:42:56  Show Profile  Visit Joran Nobleheart's Homepage Send Joran Nobleheart a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

Hi again, all.
Joran Nobleheart, this just arrived, from Ed:


Yes, the order does have a modest chapterhouse in Waterdeep. It's a small but impressive three-floors-above-the-street, one-cellar-below stone building (with stout stone pillars supporting a "porch roof" over the double-doors entrance) in North Ward.
Specifically, it's located on the east side of Whaelgond Way, two doors south of the Jardeth noble family villa.

So saith Ed. Creator of Waterdeep, and (still) most of the people and places in it.
love to all,
THO



Oh, thank you so very much! I suppose it would be a small thing for Joran and his daughter to have their lady wizard friend teleport them to Waterdeep for their meetings, right? Now I have a place for them to go in my campaigns when the order calls. It'll be nice too, since he tends to visit Waterdeep quite a bit to visit the orphanages and read to them as well as deliver toys that he carves for the children there, and making notes on requests from the children there on others that they'd like.

Paladinic Ethos
Saint Joran Nobleheart
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Brace Cormaeril
Learned Scribe

294 Posts

Posted - 01 May 2010 :  21:24:59  Show Profile  Visit Brace Cormaeril's Homepage Send Brace Cormaeril a Private Message
Hi, I have a question for Mr. Greenwood. Have any strange sexual couplings or absurd mixing of genetic material occurred in dead magic zones prior to the Time of Troubles?

Thanks a lot for your time and consideration!

The Silver Fire's Blade: A Novella in Nine Parts, Available Soon, in the Adventuring Forum!
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31690 Posts

Posted - 02 May 2010 :  01:33:20  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

They are all human, and desperately trying to remain so, they are all less than sane, and they are all LONELY. Yes, they have Mystra and each other, but they lose everyone else to the cold hand of time . . . so they seek refuge in each other.


It brings to mind the relationship between Crowley and Aziraphale, in Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman's Good Omens. Crowley was a demon, and Aziraphale was an angel... But they'd both been on Earth since the time of Adam and Eve, and even though they were technically enemies, they were also the only consistent contacts thru 6000 years -- so they were almost friends, because they were so familiar with each other.

Oh, yeah. I remember that. And it's a good excuse to read the book once again.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)

"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 02 May 2010 :  17:43:39  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all. I bring you once more the words of Ed of the Greenwood, this time in response to Brace Cormaeril: "Hi, I have a question for Mr. Greenwood. Have any strange sexual couplings or absurd mixing of genetic material occurred in dead magic zones prior to the Time of Troubles?"
Ed replies:

Yes.


Oh, : } you'd like specifics? All right. Let me just say this: certain mages (and priests, too) covertly used dead magic zones deliberately for various spellcasting and beast/monster-breeding purposes. So unusual couplings did indeed occur in dead magic zones. There are also lore instances of persons who know or suspect they are being magically traced or watched, having romantic liaisons in dead-magic zones free of spying or repercussions (often with members of families or nationalities or races that are sworn foes; the Romeo & Juliet situation).


So saith Ed. Being as mysterious and lore-enriching as ever.
love,
THO
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader

USA
3747 Posts

Posted - 02 May 2010 :  21:19:54  Show Profile  Click to see Alystra Illianniis's MSN Messenger address Send Alystra Illianniis a Private Message
Ooh, that sounds juicy. Any chance we'll be reading about any of these little trysts and/or their results in the future?

The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.

"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491

"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs

Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469

My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188

Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u
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Penknight
Senior Scribe

USA
536 Posts

Posted - 02 May 2010 :  22:30:26  Show Profile Send Penknight a Private Message
Is there any chance we could learn a little bit more about House Ealoeth, please? My fey'ri PC would love to know a little bit more about his House and some of its members. I'd dearly love to know more bout what the House did inside of Myth Drannor before its fall, and if any fey'ri members of the House were present inside the city. Also, something just came to me... did any fey'ri fight to protect the city during the fall, or even fight in the Army of Darkness? Thank you!

Telethian Phoenix
Pathfinder Reference Document

Edited by - Penknight on 02 May 2010 22:41:44
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5043 Posts

Posted - 03 May 2010 :  02:32:59  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all.
Verghityax, back on page 13 of this thread, you asked for details of heraldry of the Realms, in particular the "crests" of independent cities. Ed gave you some answers, and has just added some more:


A long-ago merchant fleet banner of Tantras was a steel-gray four-bar-by-four-bar portcullis (points at bottom ends of all vertical bars) on a scarlet field. This was a mast-top pennant. The fleet that popularized it is long gone, but the same device has recently been adopted by other ships based in Tantras, that have various owners. So it's becoming an unofficial but widely recognized recognition symbol for Tantran ownership.


So saith Ed. Adding tidbits of Realmslore whenever he can.
love,
THO
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
14138 Posts

Posted - 03 May 2010 :  04:19:26  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
Hmmmm.... someone must be asleep... several someones me thinks...

Strange couplings in DEAD magic zones?

And here I thought WILD magic zones would be just the place for such trysts

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
2905 Posts

Posted - 03 May 2010 :  07:21:22  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message
"Gettin Jiggy with it"...

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 03 May 2010 :  08:07:45  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

Hi again, all.
<snip>
And regarding the Srinshee: I'd love to answer you, but what you ask about is very much NDA'd, right now. Sorry.
As a general rule, answering just about any clear and specific question about the contents of future Realms novels is going to be a no-no, except when asked of Wizards staff people.


So saith Ed. Who will be sending me more Realmslore replies when he can, he promises.
love to all,
THO



But vague and general questions on such matters are still okay, yes? I'm just curious (after several recent posts elsewhere in the 'Keep regarding her) as to whether or not we will be learning more about the Srinshee in soon-to-be-released novels or other Realmslore...

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 03 May 2010 :  08:27:28  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

<chop>
The Cormyr Lineage is a case in point. It's a historical document and would solidify the history of that kingdom. It would also hamstring author/game designers who a) can't be bothered to research before writing or b) are loathe to give up their "awesome idea" because the realmslore says otherwise: "What do you mean, I can't build my novel premise on the assertion that King Draxius was a lich?"

There's devil in the detail, kids. There always is.

-- George Krashos



I hope you (Ed, THO, and the moderators in particular) will forgive my bluntness on this point (and I'm sure that Ed and other writers, if not all of them, will agree with me on this), but if you don't like research, you shouldn't be writing. Even if it is fiction; this is what a shared world is all about, imho. (I would have loved to attend that shared-world discussion mentioned in this scroll a few pages back, and not just for the chance to meet Ed.) If you have a specific character concept in mind that doesn't fit established characters in the setting, then create a new character! If that new character can't have the title you want him/her to have as a result of an established character already holding said title (like King of Cormyr, to pick one entirely not randomly), then find a different title that isn't already claimed.

Having the lore (specifically the Cormyr Lineage, in this case) published does not prevent writers from creating new characters (like additional bastards of Azoun IV, to pick an obvious example), but it does allow readers of that lore to inject more life and realism into their campaigns, thereby having more fun with them, and gaming in the Realms is all about having fun, right? The fact that writers essentially have a free hand in changing unpublished lore doesn't sit right with me in any case, but we're back to the intricacies of managing a shared world again. Now that I've come full-circle with this post, it seems like a good place to stop, before I start to rant.

Ed: Feel free to use this argument (assuming that you haven't thought of it already) when presenting your case to the appropriate authorities.

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 03 May 2010 08:29:39
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gomez
Learned Scribe

Netherlands
254 Posts

Posted - 03 May 2010 :  10:00:43  Show Profile  Visit gomez's Homepage Send gomez a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

I find it surprising that rather than just accepting that this is what these fictional characters have done or are doing, so many gamers try to judge them according to modern real-world mores.


Well, that's likely since most people live and follow those mores, and thus expect others to do so too... It's in people's nature.

Note that some of these mores also can be found in novels. For instance, in quite a few novels, women have to struggle to be accepted as adventurers (or even as capable people). They often eventually manage to prove themselves, but oddly, men hardly ever seem to have a need to do so. There are not a lot of novels where women who pick up a sword do not get odd looks. Even Ed occasionally depicts swordwomen as if they are an amazing act. At least, people seem to often underestimate a fighter if it is a woman.
Islif is among the exceptions, but even she was originally suspected by her friends to have slept herself into sword studies (in Swords of Eveningstar, before she put them right), which implies that women being taught swordfighting is a bit of an anomaly.

Btw, is Spellfire the 'sequel' to the Sword Never Sleeps? (I haven't managed to find that novel yet, it sold out)

Gomez
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Jorkens
Great Reader

Norway
2950 Posts

Posted - 03 May 2010 :  10:09:20  Show Profile Send Jorkens a Private Message
I never felt it was a problem for women to become fighters or such in the Realms. There are of course always some looks I would think, but the novels and gaming products generally show little signs of this. The Harpers series have many female characters, and mostly they seem to have little problem being taken seriously. A couple of them are nervous about being a Harper, but not of being warriors.

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Elfinblade
Senior Scribe

Norway
377 Posts

Posted - 03 May 2010 :  10:23:05  Show Profile Send Elfinblade a Private Message
quote:
Btw, is Spellfire the 'sequel' to the Sword Never Sleeps? (I haven't managed to find that novel yet, it sold out)


Spellfire is the first book in a trilogy called Shandril's Saga. It certainly has some tie-ins, but is otherwise not connected to the Sword Never Sleeps, which is the third book in The Knights of Myth Drannor trilogy.
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
30283 Posts

Posted - 03 May 2010 :  11:15:24  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by gomez


Btw, is Spellfire the 'sequel' to the Sword Never Sleeps? (I haven't managed to find that novel yet, it sold out)


Spellfire was one of the very first published Realms novels.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Editor and scribe for The Candlekeep Compendium

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
2905 Posts

Posted - 03 May 2010 :  11:46:41  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by gomez


Btw, is Spellfire the 'sequel' to the Sword Never Sleeps? (I haven't managed to find that novel yet, it sold out)


Spellfire was one of the very first published Realms novels.


And It's a very good novel.

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
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