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Snowblood
Senior Scribe

Australia
388 Posts

Posted - 23 Apr 2010 :  08:33:48  Show Profile Send Snowblood a Private Message
Dear Ed was the founding of Braceldaur about this time????
"-8210 DR The non-gold elf clans of Ilodhar abandon that realm due to constant harassment by orcs and ogres. Several clans travel north to Rystall Wood, while others travel east to western Arcorar.".....???? and was this about the time that it fell???
"-2475 DR The Great Glacier continues to expand, covering the lands that will eventually be known as Vaasa and Damara.".....?????


Aryvandaar, Ilythiir, Arnothoi, Orva, Sarphil, Anauria/Asram/Hlondath, Uvaeren, Braceldaur, Ilodhar, Lisenaar, Imaskar, Miyeritar, Orishaar, Shantel Othrieir, Keltormir, Eaerlann, Ammarindar, Siluvanede, Sharrven, Illefarn, Ardeep, Rystal Wood, Evereska are all available here for download:http://phasai.deviantart.com/gallery/
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Menelvagor
Senior Scribe

Israel
352 Posts

Posted - 23 Apr 2010 :  12:37:28  Show Profile  Visit Menelvagor's Homepage Send Menelvagor a Private Message
Oh, another question regarding the Seven: Do the Seven Sisters ever tease each other or argue about their age? That is 'I'm older', 'you're little - you were born 5 years later', etc. type of arguements/teasing?

"Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker?
Behold, he put no trust in his servants; and his angels he charged with folly.
How much less them that dwell in houses of clay, whose foundation in the dust, are crushed before the moth?" - Eliphaz the Temanite, Job IV, 17-19.

"Yea, though he live a thousand years twice, yet hath he seen no good: do not all go to one place?" - Ecclesiastes VI, 6.

"There are no stupid questions just a bunch of inquisitive idiots."

"Let's not call it 'hijacking'. Let's call it 'Thread Drift'."
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 23 Apr 2010 :  22:37:07  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Menelvagor

Oh, another question regarding the Seven: Do the Seven Sisters ever tease each other or argue about their age? That is 'I'm older', 'you're little - you were born 5 years later', etc. type of arguements/teasing?



I'm not Ed, but I'd suspect that, given that there's only a year between each of them and they're all over 600 years old as of 1375 DR, such a minute difference just might be something that some of the Sisters might find amusing to jest about.

Of course, as usual, I will defer to THO and Ed; just my 2 cents.

Edit: Sigh... another question for Ed. I was unable to find anything in the Candlekeep archives, so I'm hoping that the question hasn't been asked and answered... and for all I know, the answer may still be NDA... but anyway: we know from the Old Grey Box that Sylune was killed in battle with an ancient red dragon attacking Shadowdale in the Year of the Prince (1357 DR); my question is, has the story of this battle been told in detail anywhere?

Thank you again, Ed and THO! [/edit]

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 23 Apr 2010 23:03:47
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Zandilar
Learned Scribe

Australia
313 Posts

Posted - 24 Apr 2010 :  02:24:38  Show Profile  Visit Zandilar's Homepage Send Zandilar a Private Message
Heya,

The previous question about the Seven reminded me of something I was going to ask Ed regarding (*shock horror gasp*) 4th Edition!

Was the Servant of the Seven paragon path for the Bard class inspired or influenced by the Seven Sisters of Abeir-Toril? I ask because I got that distinct sense when I was reading the description in PHB2. :) (I'm also playing a 4th Edition Bard in a game set in Eberron, and was considering taking that paragon path. :))

Zandilar
~amor vincit omnia~
~audaces fortuna iuvat~

As the spell ends, you look up into the sky to see the sun blazing overhead like noon in a desert. Then something else in the sky catches your attention. Turning your gaze, you see a tawny furred kitten bounding across the sky towards the new sun. Her eyes glint a mischevious green as she pounces on it as if it were nothing but a colossal ball of golden yarn. With quick strokes of her paws, it is batted across the sky, back and forth. Then with a wink the kitten and the sun disappear, leaving the citizens of Elversult gazing up with amazed expressions that quickly turn into chortles and mirth.

The Sunlord left Elversult the same day in humilitation, and was never heard from again.
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Menelvagor
Senior Scribe

Israel
352 Posts

Posted - 24 Apr 2010 :  18:50:25  Show Profile  Visit Menelvagor's Homepage Send Menelvagor a Private Message
Jakk, I'm quite aware of that. Which is why I specified 'teasing', although on consideration, I probably should have said 'mock-arguements', not arguements. I simply wanted not to be limited to simple teasing, but (perhaps) to something that might be more serious. Whatever. As long as I get a full answer that isn't NDA, I'm happy.

"Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker?
Behold, he put no trust in his servants; and his angels he charged with folly.
How much less them that dwell in houses of clay, whose foundation in the dust, are crushed before the moth?" - Eliphaz the Temanite, Job IV, 17-19.

"Yea, though he live a thousand years twice, yet hath he seen no good: do not all go to one place?" - Ecclesiastes VI, 6.

"There are no stupid questions just a bunch of inquisitive idiots."

"Let's not call it 'hijacking'. Let's call it 'Thread Drift'."
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
29641 Posts

Posted - 24 Apr 2010 :  19:10:33  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Menelvagor

Jakk, I'm quite aware of that. Which is why I specified 'teasing', although on consideration, I probably should have said 'mock-arguements', not arguements. I simply wanted not to be limited to simple teasing, but (perhaps) to something that might be more serious. Whatever. As long as I get a full answer that isn't NDA, I'm happy.



"Storm, dear, you're looking so well! You don't look a day over 500!"

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Editor and scribe for The Candlekeep Compendium

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31683 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2010 :  00:49:52  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Menelvagor

Jakk, I'm quite aware of that. Which is why I specified 'teasing', although on consideration, I probably should have said 'mock-arguements', not arguements. I simply wanted not to be limited to simple teasing, but (perhaps) to something that might be more serious. Whatever. As long as I get a full answer that isn't NDA, I'm happy.



"Storm, dear, you're looking so well! You don't look a day over 500!"

Heh. I'm sure Ed could script an appropriate response from Storm in reply.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)

"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage
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sfdragon
Master of Realmslore

1960 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2010 :  02:27:22  Show Profile Send sfdragon a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Menelvagor

Jakk, I'm quite aware of that. Which is why I specified 'teasing', although on consideration, I probably should have said 'mock-arguements', not arguements. I simply wanted not to be limited to simple teasing, but (perhaps) to something that might be more serious. Whatever. As long as I get a full answer that isn't NDA, I'm happy.



"Storm, dear, you're looking so well! You don't look a day over 500!"

Heh. I'm sure Ed could script an appropriate response from Storm in reply.

only if all she is wearing is a pair of boots.....

why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power


My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234
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Hoondatha
Great Reader

USA
2376 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2010 :  03:19:53  Show Profile  Visit Hoondatha's Homepage Send Hoondatha a Private Message
Hey Ed, a quick question for you. Hopefully a bit easier than some of the ones we lob at you regularly.

We've been having an extended debate about Waterdeep's army and navy, some of which you and THO have chimed in about, and it made me realize that I didn't know how deep Waterdeep's harbor actually is. I've searched through the various Waterdeep books, but all they say is it's a "deep water" harbor that doesn't taper as it reaches the shore. That's not exceedingly helpful.

Can you shed any light on what the average depth (excluding Umberlee's trench) of the harbor is? Also, are there any interesting facets about it you can share? ie: how it came into being? Is it natural, or did the elves who lived there before the humans arrived have something to do with it? Or something else? Many thanks, as usual.

Doggedly converting 3e back to what D&D should be...
Sigh... And now 4e as well.

Edited by - Hoondatha on 25 Apr 2010 03:21:12
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5036 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2010 :  20:16:30  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi, Hoondatha! Ed is busy offline at the moment, but I hope for a reply from him by end of day, or early tomorrow.
My notes record a depth of eighty feet right off one of the docks in southern Dock Ward (a coffer of gems plunged off the dock when the man carrying it was slain in a swordfight, and one of the Knights sent someone down on a line to recover it), but I KNOW the harbor bottom is both silty (constantly being bathed in sewer-muck) and NOT flat, so obviously depth will vary from place to place.
My memory is that it slopes away from Mount Waterdeep, getting deeper as one moves south across the harbor.
Funny how some topics ignite a lot of responses, and others don't...
love,
THO

Edited by - The Hooded One on 25 Apr 2010 20:17:43
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5036 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2010 :  20:19:39  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Heh. And the moment I send the above post, a message from Ed arrives in my inbox.
Menelvagor, re. this: "Oh, another question regarding the Seven: Do the Seven Sisters ever tease each other or argue about their age? That is 'I'm older', 'you're little - you were born 5 years later', etc. type of arguements/teasing?"
Ed replies:


No. :}


So saith Ed. And there you have it.
love,
THO
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5036 Posts

Posted - 25 Apr 2010 :  20:29:05  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Oooh, and ANOTHER from Ed.
Jakk, I'm afraid there isn't a detailed overall map of Karse in existence, so far as Ed knows.
Sorry!
love,
THO
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 26 Apr 2010 :  01:26:08  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message
Cool! That means I can make up my own! Er... or perhaps find a fellow scribe who is better with computer map-making tools than myself and interested in throwing one together... I'll see what I can come up with on paper.

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 26 Apr 2010 01:27:15
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Foxhelm
Senior Scribe

Canada
592 Posts

Posted - 26 Apr 2010 :  21:06:35  Show Profile  Click to see Foxhelm's MSN Messenger address  Send Foxhelm a Yahoo! Message Send Foxhelm a Private Message
Ed,

Is there anything you can tell me about Finder Wyvernspur in Fourth Edition, even if it's just non-canon ideas you might want to play with? Or is it just NDA which is going to cause me headaches. Really all I want to have is either closure of his death/life might bring.

Thanks,

Foxhelm

Ed Greenwood! The Solution... and Cause of all the Realms Problems!
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5036 Posts

Posted - 27 Apr 2010 :  00:26:59  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all. Just got this, from Ed:


Foxhelm, I would tell you about Finder if I could, but there's a bright, shiny recent NDA sdpecifically covering him.
Which of course should in itself tell you something (wink, wink, nudge, nudge).
Ahem. Nothing to see here, these aren't the droids you're looking for, move along, move along....


So saith Ed. Heh.
Letting nothing slip out about the Realms, no sir, since 1979...
love to all,
THO
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sfdragon
Master of Realmslore

1960 Posts

Posted - 27 Apr 2010 :  00:44:16  Show Profile Send sfdragon a Private Message
I'd kinda like to know what the oldest still in effect NDA covers but alas, that too is likely NDAd.

Does Ed Know if there will be any new novels set in Myth Drannor, everska or involving the Elfeater in the near distant future??

and for that matter, the elf eater, I assume they eat Eladrin to the same affect as elves now in 4e??

why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power


My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 27 Apr 2010 :  00:50:29  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message
Hrm... shiny new NDAs on Finder, Halaster, Larloch, and (maybe not so new?) Symrustar... can we make it 5 for 5 and presume that Aumvor also has some brand-new NDAmantine armour?

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.
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Foxhelm
Senior Scribe

Canada
592 Posts

Posted - 27 Apr 2010 :  01:59:02  Show Profile  Click to see Foxhelm's MSN Messenger address  Send Foxhelm a Yahoo! Message Send Foxhelm a Private Message
Here's a question...

Do you know of anything the fans can do to convince Wizards to remove the NDA on topics like these? Letter writing campaigns and such?

Ed Greenwood! The Solution... and Cause of all the Realms Problems!
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 27 Apr 2010 :  03:35:12  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Foxhelm

Here's a question...

Do you know of anything the fans can do to convince Wizards to remove the NDA on topics like these? Letter writing campaigns and such?



Foxhelm, I'm not Ed, but I've asked this question several times... and here's what I know (and Ed and THO can correct/augment this response as necessary):

The newer NDAs are good, because it means that work is being done on a topic for material for publication. The NDA is there to prevent fellow designers from stepping on each other's toes.

The older NDAs are from projects that never got completed (like those pyramids in Ascore and Karse that I love so much, among numerous others), and I have been advocating a "limited-lifespan" system for NDAs for most of the two years (and then some) that I have been a scribe here at CK. (I can't believe it's been that long already.)

At this point, I defer to the wisdom of Ed and the lovely Hooded One, both of whom have far more experience in the writing/publishing industry than I possess.

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 27 Apr 2010 03:36:10
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Foxhelm
Senior Scribe

Canada
592 Posts

Posted - 27 Apr 2010 :  03:53:41  Show Profile  Click to see Foxhelm's MSN Messenger address  Send Foxhelm a Yahoo! Message Send Foxhelm a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Jakk

quote:
Originally posted by Foxhelm

Here's a question...

Do you know of anything the fans can do to convince Wizards to remove the NDA on topics like these? Letter writing campaigns and such?



Foxhelm, I'm not Ed, but I've asked this question several times... and here's what I know (and Ed and THO can correct/augment this response as necessary):

The newer NDAs are good, because it means that work is being done on a topic for material for publication. The NDA is there to prevent fellow designers from stepping on each other's toes.

The older NDAs are from projects that never got completed (like those pyramids in Ascore and Karse that I love so much, among numerous others), and I have been advocating a "limited-lifespan" system for NDAs for most of the two years (and then some) that I have been a scribe here at CK. (I can't believe it's been that long already.)

At this point, I defer to the wisdom of Ed and the lovely Hooded One, both of whom have far more experience in the writing/publishing industry than I possess.



Yes, but it's a win/not lose answer.

If we can effect the NDA with letter writing or inquiries or Etc, then we would have gained something. Hope, a push for articles and notes we want, and so forth.

If we can't, we wouldn't have lost anything since we don't have control now. Even as we didn't gain the lore we want.

So Win/Not Lose in my opinion (You could argue Win/Lose, but I tend to be positive when I can).

Ed Greenwood! The Solution... and Cause of all the Realms Problems!
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
29641 Posts

Posted - 27 Apr 2010 :  05:22:27  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Foxhelm

Here's a question...

Do you know of anything the fans can do to convince Wizards to remove the NDA on topics like these? Letter writing campaigns and such?



Honestly, I think the only way to get some of the old NDAs lifted would be for us to pay the associated legal fees and such for them to go back and review them, and decide whether or not they were still applicable. It costs money to have people go over NDAs, but it doesn't cost a penny to leave them in place.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Editor and scribe for The Candlekeep Compendium

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31683 Posts

Posted - 27 Apr 2010 :  06:08:33  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Foxhelm

Here's a question...

Do you know of anything the fans can do to convince Wizards to remove the NDA on topics like these? Letter writing campaigns and such?



Honestly, I think the only way to get some of the old NDAs lifted would be for us to pay the associated legal fees and such for them to go back and review them, and decide whether or not they were still applicable. It costs money to have people go over NDAs, but it doesn't cost a penny to leave them in place.

Not only that, but it's somewhat problematic for Wizards to know when and which NDAs could be lifted. With the state of most Realmslore almost always in some degree of flux, circumstances which warrant NDAs, are, at best, a form of preventation against unwittingly revealed events or lore that *might* still be needed later.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)

"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage
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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
2856 Posts

Posted - 27 Apr 2010 :  17:03:48  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

Hi again, all. Just got this, from Ed:


Foxhelm, I would tell you about Finder if I could, but there's a bright, shiny recent NDA sdpecifically covering him.
Which of course should in itself tell you something (wink, wink, nudge, nudge).
Ahem. Nothing to see here, these aren't the droids you're looking for, move along, move along....


So saith Ed. Heh.
Letting nothing slip out about the Realms, no sir, since 1979...
love to all,
THO


Interesting...





"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
4715 Posts

Posted - 27 Apr 2010 :  23:49:24  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Foxhelm

Here's a question...

Do you know of anything the fans can do to convince Wizards to remove the NDA on topics like these? Letter writing campaigns and such?



Honestly, I think the only way to get some of the old NDAs lifted would be for us to pay the associated legal fees and such for them to go back and review them, and decide whether or not they were still applicable. It costs money to have people go over NDAs, but it doesn't cost a penny to leave them in place.

Not only that, but it's somewhat problematic for Wizards to know when and which NDAs could be lifted. With the state of most Realmslore almost always in some degree of flux, circumstances which warrant NDAs, are, at best, a form of preventation against unwittingly revealed events or lore that *might* still be needed later.




My totally baseless view is that Ed is not only the keeper of all things Realmsian, but also the keeper of NDAs. Given that he's been part of Realms planning since the inception of the game setting, I think he'd have a better understanding of what NDAs exist than WotC do. Given that he tracks them, when he pings the powers that be about whether he can now write/talk about "lemmings in the Moonsea which Joe Wizard included in a novel outline in 2001 but never ended up writing about", methinks the WotC knee jerk reaction is to decline to give up that particular NDA - not on any solid, product planning basis, but "just in case".

The Cormyr Lineage is a case in point. It's a historical document and would solidify the history of that kingdom. It would also hamstring author/game designers who a) can't be bothered to research before writing or b) are loathe to give up their "awesome idea" because the realmslore says otherwise: "What do you mean, I can't build my novel premise on the assertion that King Draxius was a lich?"

There's devil in the detail, kids. There always is.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5036 Posts

Posted - 28 Apr 2010 :  02:24:27  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Bingo!
Krash has stated it perfectly: NDAs tend to get kept in place "just in case" doing so affords greater freedom for as-yet-unplanned/nebulous future projects.
Ed always has to err on the side of caution, in part to be able to keep doing lore-giving at Candlekeep, and to keep Wizards from ever deciding Candlekeep is more of a hindrance than a help to the Realms brand, and doing anything in light of such a perception.
love to all,
THO
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