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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
13557 Posts

Posted - 28 Mar 2009 :  15:11:45  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
Thanks for the info... but I still don't know WHERE it appeared.

I'm thinking it looks a bit 'early' to have been on the Net, so I'm thinking it either came in a box, or was given out at a con.

And I'v also just checked it against mine, and there is one locale missing as far as I can tell - a small setlement that looks like "Assunzmim" on the coast to the east.... but I'm sure that can't be right.

So my question now is, what the heck is it supposed to be?

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
29992 Posts

Posted - 28 Mar 2009 :  16:21:30  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

Thanks for the info... but I still don't know WHERE it appeared.

I'm thinking it looks a bit 'early' to have been on the Net, so I'm thinking it either came in a box, or was given out at a con.


It was a mailed-out newsletter. The tale (and another link to the file) are here:
Secrets of the Sages: The Long-Lost 1988 Forgotten Realms Newsletter

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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
13557 Posts

Posted - 28 Mar 2009 :  20:10:52  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
Wow... they actually went as far as mailing stuff to their customers to keep them well-informed about Faerūn?

DAMN... how times have changed.

Anyway, I'm picking my way through SotM ATM, so I'm sure I'll have a slew of Geographic questions again by Monday.

Actually, come to think of it, I have one now (that others here are more then welcome to answer to save Ed some time) - Where is Greentree Haven?

I had assumed it was in the High Forest, but I'm not seeing it - do we have any lore on this site?

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

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Penknight
Senior Scribe

USA
536 Posts

Posted - 28 Mar 2009 :  21:53:50  Show Profile Send Penknight a Private Message
Yeah, I really miss TSR. *sigh*

Telethian Phoenix
Pathfinder Reference Document
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khorne
Master of Realmslore

Finland
1071 Posts

Posted - 28 Mar 2009 :  22:21:57  Show Profile  Visit khorne's Homepage  Click to see khorne's MSN Messenger address Send khorne a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Penknight

Yeah, I really miss TSR. *sigh*

Too bad they did themselves in. Wasn't it mainly the fault of a female version of Voldemort? O'course, I could be completely wrong here (wouldn't be the first time).

If I were a ranger, I would pick NDA for my favorite enemy
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31688 Posts

Posted - 28 Mar 2009 :  23:16:47  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

Thanks for the info... but I still don't know WHERE it appeared.

I'm thinking it looks a bit 'early' to have been on the Net, so I'm thinking it either came in a box, or was given out at a con.


It was a mailed-out newsletter. The tale (and another link to the file) are here:
Secrets of the Sages: The Long-Lost 1988 Forgotten Realms Newsletter

Indeed. And I was lucky enough to receive one all the way here in Australia. But that was largely thanks to a US relative who had two copies of the newsletter.

Heh. Halruaa then became a featured adventuring location in my Realms of '89.

Wow. It's almost hard to believe that was nearly 20 years ago.

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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31688 Posts

Posted - 28 Mar 2009 :  23:34:51  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

Actually, come to think of it, I have one now (that others here are more then welcome to answer to save Ed some time) - Where is Greentree Haven?
Hmmm... I don't immediately recall it's location being referenced anywhere else other than in Krash's "the North" timeline:- '... Greentree Haven, an enchanted grove in the wilderlands of the Sword Coast North.' Though I think that comes from the Secrets of the Magister tome itself.

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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
13557 Posts

Posted - 29 Mar 2009 :  02:48:57  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
That tome mentioned it being in a 'Vast Wood', and although several forests in The North could be described that way, the High Forest certainly jumps to mind first. That bit in SotM also mentioned it makes an 'appearance' in Silverfall (which I haven't read, unfortunately) - Dove goes there to dance (aren't there any good clubs on HER side of the Anauroch?!)

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 29 Mar 2009 16:48:26
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31688 Posts

Posted - 29 Mar 2009 :  04:24:54  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
Hmmm... It's been a while since I've read it, so I'll flick through Silverfall later tonight. Maybe Ed, or another FR designer, could elaborate on this in the meantime.

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GoCeraf
Learned Scribe

147 Posts

Posted - 29 Mar 2009 :  04:54:46  Show Profile  Visit GoCeraf's Homepage Send GoCeraf a Private Message
Heh heh heh.

...Vast Wood.

THO, back when he was starting out, who did Mr. Greenwood count among his influences? Now that he's a veteran in his field(s), from what does he draw inspiration and to whom does he hope to act as a role model?

All the best,
Wolfram

Being sarcastic can be more telling than simply telling.
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gomez
Learned Scribe

Netherlands
254 Posts

Posted - 29 Mar 2009 :  14:19:10  Show Profile  Visit gomez's Homepage Send gomez a Private Message
There is no real location or name given for the place where Dove dances, but Mirt walked there on foot (when in poor health), so it can't be too far from Waterdeep.
Depending on what you define as 'Vast', alternatives for the High Forest could be Kryptgarden or Ardeep.
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
13557 Posts

Posted - 29 Mar 2009 :  16:54:17  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
Actually, ANY forest appearing on the continental map could be considered vast, so yeah... it could be anywhere...

As for the name of the place where Dove dances - Silverfall is referenced in the Greentree Haven entry in Secrets of the Magister as being that place. Unfortunately, aside form saying the woods "grew around the enchanted grove", it does't say much else (which leads me to believe it couldn't be the High Forest or Kryptgarden - probably someplace much newer and smaller).

Ed- ignore my last query about that city in Halruaa - its called Assundath (it was on the map that came with Hordes of Dragonspear, weirdly enough).

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 30 Mar 2009 15:17:59
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Blueblade
Senior Scribe

USA
804 Posts

Posted - 30 Mar 2009 :  01:11:16  Show Profile  Visit Blueblade's Homepage Send Blueblade a Private Message
Hi. I've been at the Ad Astra convention, sitting in on some delightful panels (all of which had Ed as a panelist, as well as some delightful sf and fantasy pros and fans). Must correct something in this thread:
Bryon Wischstadt wanted to do his own FR newsletter, tentatively entitled REALMSPEAK, that TSR nixed.
Well before that, the SECRETS OF THE SAGES newsletter was edited for TSR by David Martin (who lined up some other issues, all of "cutting room floor" Realmslore that we later saw snuck into various FR products). The newsletter was indeed killed after the first issue for lack of funds and printing press time (this was in the days before TSR briefly owned its own means of printing).
This info comes from Ed and others in various GenCon seminars, from years gone by. I know this is right because Mr. Martin was on one of those panels with various TSR staffers and Ed, who would surely have corrected him if the info was wrong.
BB
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5037 Posts

Posted - 30 Mar 2009 :  19:25:52  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hello again, all.
Markustay, Ed confirms that Greentree Haven is JUST inside the outermost trees on the western verges of northwesternmost Ardeepforest (or, if you prefer the later name, "Ardeep Forest").
love,
THO
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Aerik DeVallo
Learned Scribe

USA
87 Posts

Posted - 31 Mar 2009 :  01:18:19  Show Profile Send Aerik DeVallo a Private Message
Ed, is it true that The Simbul was raised and apprentaced by the Wychlaran before she became an apprentice to the former ruler of Aglarond (or was she the ruler's apprentice?)? If so, how long did that go on and is there any lore written on that subject? Is there ANYTHING, like a biography of the Simbul's early life, childhood and rise to power, or anything like that? I'd appreciate any clarification that any one could give me.

Thinking about it deeper, it would explain her battlerages she fell into before she and Elminster became involved, being raised by witches that rule a land of berserker's. I know that when Elminster first encountered her, he didn't know she was one of the Seven and almost killed her. But, what was the circumstances that led to her herritage being unknown. The Simbul has always been my second favorite Realms character and I know less about her than I'd like to.

Thanks in advance!
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Kuje
Great Reader

USA
7915 Posts

Posted - 31 Mar 2009 :  02:07:28  Show Profile  Send Kuje an AOL message  Click to see Kuje's MSN Messenger address  Send Kuje a Yahoo! Message Send Kuje a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Archmagus Brandon

Ed, is it true that The Simbul was raised and apprentaced by the Wychlaran before she became an apprentice to the former ruler of Aglarond (or was she the ruler's apprentice?)? If so, how long did that go on and is there any lore written on that subject? Is there ANYTHING, like a biography of the Simbul's early life, childhood and rise to power, or anything like that? I'd appreciate any clarification that any one could give me.

Thinking about it deeper, it would explain her battlerages she fell into before she and Elminster became involved, being raised by witches that rule a land of berserker's. I know that when Elminster first encountered her, he didn't know she was one of the Seven and almost killed her. But, what was the circumstances that led to her herritage being unknown. The Simbul has always been my second favorite Realms character and I know less about her than I'd like to.

Thanks in advance!



The Seven Sisters sourcebook has a lot of info on all of the histories of the... well.. the Seven Sisters. :) But you could also find info on some of their backgrounds in Heroes Lorebook. Or, for the Simbul, you could look in the Spellbound box set and or Unapproachable East.

For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird

My Goodreads page: http://www.goodreads.com/kuje

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31688 Posts

Posted - 31 Mar 2009 :  02:18:47  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje

quote:
Originally posted by Archmagus Brandon

Ed, is it true that The Simbul was raised and apprentaced by the Wychlaran before she became an apprentice to the former ruler of Aglarond (or was she the ruler's apprentice?)? If so, how long did that go on and is there any lore written on that subject? Is there ANYTHING, like a biography of the Simbul's early life, childhood and rise to power, or anything like that? I'd appreciate any clarification that any one could give me.

Thinking about it deeper, it would explain her battlerages she fell into before she and Elminster became involved, being raised by witches that rule a land of berserker's. I know that when Elminster first encountered her, he didn't know she was one of the Seven and almost killed her. But, what was the circumstances that led to her herritage being unknown. The Simbul has always been my second favorite Realms character and I know less about her than I'd like to.

Thanks in advance!



The Seven Sisters sourcebook has a lot of info on all of the histories of the... well.. the Seven Sisters. :) But you could also find info on some of their backgrounds in Heroes Lorebook. Or, for the Simbul, you could look in the Spellbound box set and or Unapproachable East.

The Seven Sisters does indeed cover this aspect of Alassra's early life, and her rearing by Oraumae, a witch of Rashemen.

And along with the other sources Kuje mentioned, you might also want to check out the chapter on the Simbul in Ed's Silverfall novel -- as it appropriately captures much of her mindset and a little about her history too.

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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5037 Posts

Posted - 31 Mar 2009 :  02:31:43  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hello again, all. I bring you this, from Ed of the Greenwood, to Erik Scott de Bie (after I conveyed Erik's "heart-felt thanks for Ed's introduction to my novel Downshadow? I just received my author's copies and read his kind and extremely flattering words. He is truly a prince. Cheers."):


Erik, I mean every word of it, and more. My chief personal delight in the published Realms is when I get to read great new stories set in "my" world (now, of course, really "our" world) that I didn't write. I LOVED Downshadow.
(Actually, I've loved all of the books I've read thus far in this series, though all in quite different ways. Jaleigh's City of the Dead is magnificent and great fun, too, but it's very different from Downshadow.)
So you EARNED all that praise, my friend, and I hope you get many more chances, in the Realms and in your own fantasy settings, from other publishers, to earn a lot more. If you write something that I can walk into a bookstore and order or pluck off the shelf a copy of, I'll be buying and hurrying home to read. Just as I always hurry home to read Elaine's stuff, Realms or not, and - -
No, I'm NOT going to start in on the long, long list. This is about you; this is your moment, and deservedly so.
Scribes of the Realms, if you turn your back on this book, because it's 4e Realms or for any other reason, you're missing out on a darned good read (and re-read!) yarn.
Heck, when it comes right down to it, you can enjoy this book whilst pretending it isn't 4e at all, but instead only about ten years ahead of the LAST time you nosed around Waterdeep, whenever in your 3e campaign or fiction reading that was. Or you can read it and enjoy it and not care about when it's set, or even look up and say, "So this is 4e Realms? Okay, fine, if it's all like this book, bring it on!"
I have 80,000 books crammed into my home, and I work in a public library and am board chair of a (different) library system, and have toiled in public libraries for pay for 35 years-plus, now; I have read a LOT of fantasy books. In one recent year I judged the World Fantasy Award, and literally read thousands (yes, no exaggeration: thousands, plural) of fantasy tales published that year. Right now, I'm judging the Sunbursts, Canada's sf and fantasy awards, and reading another year's truckload of works. So I get to read, ah, much fantasy.
And there's never enough GOOD fun "cracking good read" fantasy. For me, this is one such book, so it's a "must-have" for my library. An eternal literary classic? No. A darned good read, that I'm proud to have set in the Realms? YES.
Erik, if *I * owned Wizards and ran the book publishing program, I'd already be hounding you for another book. In hardcover, just as soon as you could get it done. You and Paul Kemp and Jaleigh and one or two others are the bright lights who should be leading the charge onto the general fantasy bestseller lists, not just "oh, that gaming fantasy stuff" subgenre recognition.
I wish, oh Watching Gods above how I wish, that Brian Thomsen hadn't died when he did. SO much stopped with him. You getting a Tor Book fantasy debut was one of those things, and in these current economic hard times for the publishing industry, getting that back on track is going to take some time. I laid some groundwork at Ad Astra this weekend . . . but in the meantime, we all have DOWNSHADOW to enjoy.
Scribes, get out there and enjoy it!

So saith Ed. Who means every word, believe me.
love to all, and (heh, wink) a pull-open-my-gown salute to Erik!
THO



Edited by - The Hooded One on 31 Mar 2009 02:34:37
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Zandilar
Learned Scribe

Australia
313 Posts

Posted - 31 Mar 2009 :  03:23:16  Show Profile  Visit Zandilar's Homepage Send Zandilar a Private Message
Heya,

Well, Ed (and Erik), I'll certainly keep an eye out for that book. I am not holding my breath though (most of the bookshops local to where I live tend to have Salvatore fairly quickly, but they're very spotty on Realms authors who are not Salvatore - even (especially) you, Ed. )

Here is a website that you must never ever go to, because you'll end up lost for hours and hours and hours... But I'm linking to a page on it anyway, since it has some relevance... TvTropes Forgotten Realms Page... If you ever get some spare time (and you haven't already seen it before), it might be worth a scan. (Authors should pay special attention to some of them! Lets see how many tropes can be averted/inverted/subverted in the next round of novels, hey? )

Zandilar
~amor vincit omnia~
~audaces fortuna iuvat~

As the spell ends, you look up into the sky to see the sun blazing overhead like noon in a desert. Then something else in the sky catches your attention. Turning your gaze, you see a tawny furred kitten bounding across the sky towards the new sun. Her eyes glint a mischevious green as she pounces on it as if it were nothing but a colossal ball of golden yarn. With quick strokes of her paws, it is batted across the sky, back and forth. Then with a wink the kitten and the sun disappear, leaving the citizens of Elversult gazing up with amazed expressions that quickly turn into chortles and mirth.

The Sunlord left Elversult the same day in humilitation, and was never heard from again.
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author

USA
4586 Posts

Posted - 31 Mar 2009 :  05:42:29  Show Profile  Visit Erik Scott de Bie's Homepage  Send Erik Scott de Bie an AOL message Send Erik Scott de Bie a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

Erik, I mean every word of it, and more. My chief personal delight in the published Realms is when I get to read great new stories set in "my" world (now, of course, really "our" world) that I didn't write. I LOVED Downshadow . . .

So saith Ed. Who means every word, believe me.
love to all, and (heh, wink) a pull-open-my-gown salute to Erik!
THO

Wow, just . . . wow.

(Oh, and thanks to Ed too, lady. )

Well, I certainly hope Shadowbane can rise to the challenge.

quote:
Originally posted by Zandilar

But I'm linking to a page on it anyway, since it has some relevance... TvTropes Forgotten Realms Page... If you ever get some spare time (and you haven't already seen it before), it might be worth a scan. (Authors should pay special attention to some of them! Lets see how many tropes can be averted/inverted/subverted in the next round of novels, hey? )


That's pretty hilarious, Lady Z.

Cheers

Erik Scott de Bie

'Tis easier to destroy than to create.

Signature of Shameless Self-Promotion +6: Order my sixth novel, Shadow of the Winter King (Amazon, e-signing, Dragonmoon Press)

Also check out my Realms work, most recently Shadowbane: Eye of Justice, out now on e-readers everywhere! (Kindle, Nook)
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31688 Posts

Posted - 31 Mar 2009 :  05:45:27  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
Ed, this question comes from something the Lady Hooded One brought up in the "FR Trivia" scroll here at Candlekeep:-
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

I'd just like to pipe up here and note that Furjur the Flippant (in Portella's answer, above) is ANOTHER of Ed's unjustly neglected original Realms NPCs.
I'm curious about Furjur. Is there anything more about him that you can share with us?

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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5037 Posts

Posted - 31 Mar 2009 :  15:49:51  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Ahhh, Furjur. Where to begin?
Um, ask Ed, and get back this update on my scanty old notes:


Okay, take the character portrayed by Ricky Gervais in the movie STARDUST, for the fast sales-patter speech combined with the brightly optimistic manner ("I can get you one of those!"). Boundless energy, cheerfully dishonest without ever ACTING sly, always with three or four good ideas for turning a profit (perhaps far in the future) being worked on in advance. Put these into the steretypical stage Fagin: filthy hat and long coat, "fingerless mittens"/gloves, fairly thin. Once fat, but now retains only a fattish face and broad shoulders, with folds of loose skin hanging off a now thin and supple, even bony in place, body. Huge nose, broken many times in fights, so is a very battered beak. Always smiling, very bright green eyes, the "fattish" of the face comes from plump cheeks and a very large jaw, and there's a long, wagging "spike tuft" goatee beard JUST on the point of the chin (rest of jaw and cheeks clean-shaven), daggerboard sideburns, and untrimmed, very busy eyebrows. Hair is brown shot through with steel gray.
Furjur CAN'T stop making jokes and smartass remarks; his speech is endlessly peppered with them, even when inappropriate (quips about the deceased at a funeral, for example). For years he was a panderer who provided pretty lasses of particular builds and hair hues to wealthy clients, and was so kindly and fatherly that he was actually beloved by most of the women he worked with (though his days of traveling the Realms with a dozen of them are in his past). Almost twenty of them are now his "de facto" (unmarried) wives, all over the Realms, in taverns and inns and shops he "set them up in" (and they form a network of warm waiting beds, contraband refuges, and message-drops for him). His onetime work as a panderer left him a skilled hairstylist, perfumer, cosmetician, midwife, garment alterer, and applier-of-disguises.
Furjur wears many gaudy rings, most of them set with colored glass rather than gems, but worth a few gp for the gold in them (and he won't hesitate to use them as currency). He wears and bears a few defensive and protective magic items, always has a few potions of healing in steel vials somewhere in his effects or shoved down his boots, and always wears an earring of regeneration. He pretends to know nothing about magic and never to trade in it, so careless and casual foes won't expect him to be harboring any. He also regularly uses at least one magical means of spider climbing, of providing the equivalent of a flashlight (small, aimable beam of light), and of suddenly producing thick, billowing smoke in a small area, to aid him in escaping or "throw off" hostile missile weapon aiming.
Most of Furjur's life story is NDA because it's linked to planned FR projects that may or may not ever happen, so I'll leak it only as such revelations become possible.


So saith Ed. Who is still scrambling to finish something, scribes, but is always interested in imparting more lore.
love to all,
THO
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31688 Posts

Posted - 31 Mar 2009 :  16:12:28  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
Awesome stuff, Ed. Thanks.

As it is, I can definitely see Furjur featuring at some point in the next stage of my current Realms campaign.

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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore

Netherlands
1144 Posts

Posted - 31 Mar 2009 :  18:57:04  Show Profile Send Bladewind a Private Message
Dear Ed and our Lady the Hooded One.

First I want to give thanks for your reply to my question about sages and seers and their obstruction with laws and rulership. Well thought out and surprising aswell. I loved the hint that most seers get fame (very) early in their youth and struggle to maintain a good track record of correct visions. Made me chuckle. That's a maddening prospect for most leaders in monasteries of Savras, Sehanine and other visionairy dieties, as they would constantly compete with the younger generations of oracles. Visiting a girl or boy oracle must make for some powerful roleplaying scenes.

Another new question goes to the origin of lycanthropy in the Realms. Who devised this curse/blessing first? Does it have a mortal origin or was it a divine curse? Did Selune somehow cause this to happen and somewhere down the road she lost control of the Beast-side of the blessing?

My campaign sketches

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Creature Feature: Giant Spiders
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

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Posted - 31 Mar 2009 :  21:29:50  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Bladewind


Another new question goes to the origin of lycanthropy in the Realms. Who devised this curse/blessing first? Does it have a mortal origin or was it a divine curse? Did Selune somehow cause this to happen and somewhere down the road she lost control of the Beast-side of the blessing?



That's an interesting question... I've come up with my own tale for the origin of lycanthropy, so I'd really love to see what Ed has to say about it.

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