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arry
Learned Scribe

United Kingdom
313 Posts

Posted - 18 Mar 2009 :  17:05:54  Show Profile Send arry a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by gomez

quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

We’d better (she purred, and winked once, slowly and languidly) switch to more non-verbal communication . . .


I'll get the whipped cream!



And the honey!?

Ahem . . . I'd like to ask Ed if there is a season in the North corresponding to the Russian 'raspuzitsa', the 'season of mud' when the winter snows have melted and ground travel is almost impossible? If there is one, approximately how long does it last?
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader

USA
3074 Posts

Posted - 18 Mar 2009 :  17:41:15  Show Profile Send Ashe Ravenheart a Private Message
Ooo... BEAST where are you? I know that RAS mentioned this in a few of his novels. But I can't remember the details (and I'm currently at work).

I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.

Ashe's Character Sheet

Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs
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althen artren
Senior Scribe

USA
778 Posts

Posted - 18 Mar 2009 :  22:22:53  Show Profile Send althen artren a Private Message
Magic items shunned, scribes:

Alas the only Rod of Lordly Might I will be touching will be my newborn son when he
gets here in early May, and only in diaper changes and bath-time. Boy, talk about
getting submarined.

Ed, could you describe some of the other elven ruins left in the dales, similar to the
one in Tasseldale in VGtTD.
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Jamallo Kreen
Master of Realmslore

USA
1537 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  02:21:30  Show Profile  Visit Jamallo Kreen's Homepage Send Jamallo Kreen a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

Hi again, all.
maransreth, the contest isn't over; no one has correctly guessed who got that infamous chapbook into print, yet. Yes, Ed is indeed willing to provide a clue, perhaps even more than one; he promises me he'll get back to me with one soon.
love,
THO


Dear Lady,

For those of us 50 pages or so behind in our scroll reading, do please remind us of the subject and/or title of the "infamous chapbook." Those of us who did without the InterScroll for a few months want to play along with evryone else.





I have a mouth, but I am in a library and must not scream.


Feed the poor and stroke your ego, too: http://www.freerice.com/index.php.

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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  03:53:22  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

<chop>
What I can say is that there are obviously future plans (that may even come to pass) to say more about this dark shadow, somewhere and somewhen to come, and that the NDA and my own coy evasiveness center on desires not to ruin that future chance to say more.
Watching Gods above and below, I sound like a weaseling politician. Ale for all, this St. Patrick’s Day, and let’s hope you all forget what I haven’t said! :}

Er, so saith Ed. Who I know is BURSTING to say more, but certainly doesn’t want to ruin the chances of a certain someone telling a specific tale about a particular dark shadow at work (at some time or times unspecified) in the Forest Kingdom of Cormyr.
Gads, this cryptospeak is contagious, isn’t it?
We’d better (she purred, and winked once, slowly and languidly) switch to more non-verbal communication . . .
love to all,
THO




Has this specific tale by a certain someone about a particular dark shadow been written and just awaiting a publication window, or is there composition yet to be completed? (he asked, possibly not cryptically enough) THO, I do like your suggestion... words create more questions than they answer... particularly when those attempting to answer the questions have been bound, gagged, and what-have-you by those Naughty Dominatrix Aliens. Hrm... on that note... perhaps if I were one of those *receiving* the questions, I'd be better disposed to resist their answers...

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 19 Mar 2009 04:12:45
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Thauramarth
Senior Scribe

United Kingdom
653 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  08:20:07  Show Profile Send Thauramarth a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Jamallo Kreen


Dear Lady,

For those of us 50 pages or so behind in our scroll reading, do please remind us of the subject and/or title of the "infamous chapbook." Those of us who did without the InterScroll for a few months want to play along with evryone else.






Chapbook's title: "Filfaeril, Bound and Willing". Please draw your own conclusions as to the likely subject .

Club Secretary of the Dragons on the Hill RPG Club of London, UK: http://dragonsonthehill.co.uk/.
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5041 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  14:48:18  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Jamallo Kreen, it is indeed time for a recap. This “who wrote the naughty chapbook” contest arose from posts early in this year’s thread, from Ed, which I’ll quote in part.
The first one is a reply to part of a question from Asgetrion about Heralds in the Thunderstone area of eastern Cormyr, and the second is a reply to Menelvagor’s query about the work itself.
Heeeere’s Ed:


There is a local herald, Bannermere, but this is a new office held by a novice, a young, slender, brown-haired man originally from Berdusk, who is polite and rather shy, and derives most of his income by designing and limning signs and writing letters for locals (he is not a Crown herald). He keeps to Thunderstone, and interested clients come to see him; it’s recently come to light (much to his embarrassment) that he secretly writes salacious chapbooks for sale in Scornubel and Waterdeep, including the popular “Rorel the Conquering Blade” series (in which the debonair, swirling-cloaked Rorel beds an endless series of willing women, often after dueling their craven and cruel wife-beating husbands). Interestingly, there’s long been a rumour that the Rorel books were penned by the same anonymous hand that once presented the now-banned chapbook “Filfaeril Bound And Willing” to a receptive Suzail and even more eager Purple Dragon posts up and down the Realm, but a blushing and stammering Bannermere denies ever even dreaming of portraying the Dragon Queen in such a light. (Another rumour whispers that Filfaeril, who has been officially silent on the work, secretly enjoyed it very much and cajoled her royal husband into acting out the events of several of the encounters therein - - but rumour, like a barking dog, oft makes much more noise and arouses more ire than it in truth should.)


I have mentioned it in the drafts of several Cormyr-set novels, as one of those “in jokes” that the editors used to enjoy reading privately, and then prune before publication. By which I mean: they and I both knew such snippets were never going to see print, but I wrote them for fun (back in the dear dawn days of TSR, and up until quite recently at Wizards, one of the editors would discover such a screed, have a laugh over it, then print it out, stand on her chair in cubicle-land, clear her throat loudly, and then read the said steamy scene out loud for everyone.
It provided a few moments of amusement for most of the Books Department folks, and those who needed to concentrate hard whilst editing and didn’t want to hear it were already hooked up to iPods or similar headphone and earbud devices that walled them away from such distractions.
In those unpublished (“suppressed” if you will, but with my agreement and expectation that they would be edited out), I mentioned this specific fictitious salacious work as one in which Purple Dragons would laugh over, and then get very red-faced when Queen Filfaeril strolled past them as they stood guard together, AND as something court ladies or noblewomen would gossip and titter about - - and then subside into shocked silence when Queen Fee came upon them quickly and joined their conversation about it.
Publicly and officially, the Crown ignored the work, except to ban its possession by any Purple and Blue Dragon (something deliberately not enforced in private dwellings, only within guardposts, armories, barracks, naval bases, and fortresses such as High Horn) and to send undercover courtiers around the cities of Suzail, Marsember, and Arabel to quietly buy up all the copies they could find, and “disappear” them. The Court Wizard (Vangerdahast) then issued a decree that the said work contained “dangerous hidden magics that would enact a curse upon the reader,” and banned its printing or copying out by hand, within the realm of Cormyr.
Publicly (aside from face to face meetings with individual nobles, as described above) Filfaeril ignored the existence of the work. It would be considered a grave breach of Court etiquette to mention its title to any Obarskyr, though personal friends of various royals know when they can ignore Court etiquette and when they should follow it. Filfaeril herself told some (shocked) noblewomen that she’d “quite enjoyed it,” and “hoped to read a sequel, and see what further fancies the clever, clever author could IMAGINE.” Tanalasta was too embarrassed to ever mention it to any of her fellow Obarskyrs (though a War Wizard reported to Vangerdahast that he found a copy under her mattress during his usual secret “checking for dangers” inspection, as well as finding copies in the possession of several personal maids and ladies-in-waiting to all three female Obarskyrs), Alusair discussed it frankly with both her mother and father (separately), Filfaeril and Azoun do indeed share a copy and have read it separately and together - - and have tried some of the scenes described therein together. Neither of them is inhibited, and as the ruling royals, THEY decide and set the morals of the realm, not the other way round (unlike in our real world, there aren’t sole dominant clergies in Cormyr, and therefore the royal family isn’ beholden to the opinion of this or that priest as to what’s “good” or “proper” or “appropriate” behaviour, because the many differing views of the many differing priesthoods offset each other, as it were.
In other words, the rumours that Filfaeril enjoyed the work are true.
The rumor that Bannermere wrote “Filfaeril Bound And Willing” is not true. The author IS someone long known at Court in Cormyr, but I think it’s time for some fun; I’ll leave it to scribes to guess the identity of the author, here in this thread, and give no hints - - but I WILL confirm when someone guesses right (and say so when a guess is wrong). To avoid repetitive “carpet bombing” guessing, let’s limit it to three guesses per scribe. So, stare at all those Cormyrean faces, and ask yourself: who’s secretly naughty, with pen in hand?


So saith Ed, and here we are, many guesses later (but not the correct one, yet). As you know, Ed has very recently begun to provide some clues, and will continue to do so. Of which the next one is this: please bear in mind that the writer of the chapbook, and the person or persons responsible for printing multiple copies of it and beginning to circulate them, may well not be the same person at all.
Let the fun continue . . .
love to all,
THO
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BEAST
Master of Realmslore

USA
1714 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  15:04:57  Show Profile  Visit BEAST's Homepage Send BEAST a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart

Ooo... BEAST where are you? I know that RAS mentioned this in a few of his novels. But I can't remember the details (and I'm currently at work).

Dude, I'm purty sure I'd remember if RAS had ever written about purring, whip cream, and honey in any of his books.

But I definitely do not.

Best left to those who know the subject matter more intimately.

If you were referring to this:
quote:
Originally posted by arry

Ahem . . . I'd like to ask Ed if there is a season in the North corresponding to the Russian 'raspuzitsa', the 'season of mud' when the winter snows have melted and ground travel is almost impossible? If there is one, approximately how long does it last?

RAS mentioned the muddy summer of the Bloodstone Lands in the novel Promise of the Witch-King and in the old accessory sourcebook The Bloodstone Lands. Per TBL, p.2, this muddy summer season in the northern region of Vaasa lasts "only for a few short weeks".

The 1E FRCS said the same thing, referring to "an impenetrable bog during the few weeks of High Summer" ("Cyclopedia of the Realms": "Vaasa": p.86).

"'You don't know my history,' he said dryly."
--Drizzt Do'Urden (The Pirate King, Part 1: Chapter 2)

<"Comprehensive Chronology of R.A. Salvatore Forgotten Realms Works">

Edited by - BEAST on 19 Mar 2009 15:43:34
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khorne
Master of Realmslore

Finland
1071 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  16:02:08  Show Profile  Visit khorne's Homepage  Click to see khorne's MSN Messenger address Send khorne a Private Message
Ed, I would like to ask why so many people in the Realms (such as Elminster or Khelben) seem to consider Volo a fool. If he was an idiot, he would not have survived gathering the information contained in his guides.

If I were a ranger, I would pick NDA for my favorite enemy
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore

USA
1081 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  16:27:47  Show Profile  Visit Garen Thal's Homepage Send Garen Thal a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by khorne

Ed, I would like to ask why so many people in the Realms (such as Elminster or Khelben) seem to consider Volo a fool. If he was an idiot, he would not have survived gathering the information contained in his guides.
Ahem. The only reason Volo has survived, as has been suggested elsewhere (though hidden), is that Elminster has been instructed to keep the nosey fool alive long enough to do... something. Why, and what, we've not been told, but it's an interesting little subtext to the relationship the two have.

Now, "alive" can mean all sorts of things, as certain toadstools know, but...
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
14014 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  16:28:13  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
Volo was not so much a fool as Khelben and Elminster would lead people to believe... which is exactly why they lead people to believe that.

Far easier - and better - to discredit his work, and still keep it around: Volo did seem to have a penchant for finding trouble, and thats something groups like the Harpers or Lord's Alliance found useful from time to time.

As for the chapbook - I've used but one guess, and now Ed's hint has me thinking it was never meant to be published, which has me thinking of possible suspects I wouldn't have considered earlier...

Can we get a date on that chapbook? The title actually sounds like a real event I can think of...

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

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Foxhelm
Senior Scribe

Canada
592 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  19:27:51  Show Profile  Click to see Foxhelm's MSN Messenger address  Send Foxhelm a Yahoo! Message Send Foxhelm a Private Message
Here's a question or two in regard to translating 4th edition core to the realms. Not sure if you can answer this, but it is important to see if we can make it work.

Primordial and Primal Spirits...

Certain gods like Kossuth are now Primordials instead of gods, Barbarians/Druids/Shaman/Wardens gain their powers from Primal spirits. Yet previous realms lore state the power of druids and clerics of Kossuth all come from gods, and could not gain them from another source.

My question is what would you suggest to adapt 4th core lore with previous realms lore to make effective 4th realms lore?

My two best ideas is either a link between the gods and these other great powers... or cases of Hybred powers like Silvanus and Chauntea being both gods and Primal spirits and Kossuth as well as his fellows being both primordials and gods.

I know a couple of people asking these questions, so any answer would be welcomed which can solve this.

Thanks,

Foxhelm

Ed Greenwood! The Solution... and Cause of all the Realms Problems!
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Menelvagor
Senior Scribe

Israel
352 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  19:39:07  Show Profile  Visit Menelvagor's Homepage Send Menelvagor a Private Message
I've finally gotten around to properly re-reading Silverfall (tests, tests!) and already racked up a few questions:
Even before the Copyright, there are a few words in some language I do not know. "tantaene animis caelestibus irae?" Transalation, anyone?
Also, in the title of each part, there is a different font. I do not understand a letter there. In Dove's part it appears thus: "No ?lore in Armor for ?ly Sake" What is this letter?
Last (for now) I still don't understand what Dove was doing with that sword dance. How exactly does that empower magic swords?

"Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker?
Behold, he put no trust in his servants; and his angels he charged with folly.
How much less them that dwell in houses of clay, whose foundation in the dust, are crushed before the moth?" - Eliphaz the Temanite, Job IV, 17-19.

"Yea, though he live a thousand years twice, yet hath he seen no good: do not all go to one place?" - Ecclesiastes VI, 6.

"There are no stupid questions – just a bunch of inquisitive idiots."

"Let's not call it 'hijacking'. Let's call it 'Thread Drift'."
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gomez
Learned Scribe

Netherlands
254 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  20:24:01  Show Profile  Visit gomez's Homepage Send gomez a Private Message
quote:
Why, and what, we've not been told, but it's an interesting little subtext to the relationship the two have.



If the answer is 'procreate', that would be... interesting. :P
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Thauramarth
Senior Scribe

United Kingdom
653 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  21:55:07  Show Profile Send Thauramarth a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Menelvagor

I've finally gotten around to properly re-reading Silverfall (tests, tests!) and already racked up a few questions:
Even before the Copyright, there are a few words in some language I do not know. "tantaene animis caelestibus irae?" Transalation, anyone?


It's Latin - "Can such anger dwell in heavenly minds?"

Club Secretary of the Dragons on the Hill RPG Club of London, UK: http://dragonsonthehill.co.uk/.
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Blueblade
Senior Scribe

USA
804 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  22:10:32  Show Profile  Visit Blueblade's Homepage Send Blueblade a Private Message
And the Dove quotation is "No More In Armor For My Sake," though I seem to recall THO saying someone at TSR screwed it up in editing, and it should have been: No More In Armor For THY Sake.
Unlike the Latin epigram, I don't think Ed's quoting anyone, known or anonymous, there. (That line is his invention.)
BB
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Baleful Avatar
Learned Scribe

Canada
161 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  22:16:39  Show Profile  Visit Baleful Avatar's Homepage Send Baleful Avatar a Private Message
Dear Ed and THO,
I have a Cormyr, just-pre-Spellplague lore question. If a noble or anyone else either a visitor to Cormyr unknown to the War Wizards or a native Cormyrean who's never before done anything suspicious went on a "normal" trip outside the Realm, obtained magical means of protecting their thoughts from scrying by the War Wizards or a house wizard dwelling in a noble mansion, and returned with this protection operating, how soon in the usual course of events would this be noticed by anyone?
And how suspicious would it (usually) seem, when detected?
I'm assuming the thought-protected person isn't doing anything suspicious, just going about their usual daily activities and tasks in life.
Thanks!
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Malcolm
Learned Scribe

242 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  22:23:34  Show Profile  Visit Malcolm's Homepage Send Malcolm a Private Message
By the Mysteries of Mystra, * I * have a just-pre-Spellplague Cormyr lore question, too! Mine is a little more mundane.
If a visitor to Suzail starts a new fashion in garments or headgear or undergarments for women, that "catches on" in the city, how soon does it usually take for such a fashion (however brief a fad it later turns out to be) to spread across the realm? A. Word of it, and B. Being taken up by Cormyrean women who never visit Suzail. (I'm assuming there's no impediment to it spreading, such as a law or a shortage of supply of whatever's new, that traders could carry.) How slavishly do social climbers watch and copy the fashions at Court? Of the royals? Of nobles? (And if it varies within one of those categories, such as "some nobles but not others," why?)
Thanks. No hurry on this one, as my campaign is galloping in another direction at the moment.
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
14014 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  22:51:38  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
@Foxhelm - This came-up over at the WotC boards, and since I seem to be the only FR 'Sage' (over there) that is willing to create 4e lore, I usually field these lore conundrums (I prefer calling them that rather then retcons - that's such a 'dirty word'). Besides, I like puzzles...

It is canon that the gods used the Weave as an interface to supply their followers with spells. Now, we know that on other worlds without a Weave gods grant their spells to their followers directly, or perhaps some other interface is in-place. The reason why I say it is canon is because Mystra can deny followers of a god spells - she basiclly 'breaks' their connection.

Since we know that this situation does not exist on other worlds, and that gods cannot be stopped so easily by the god of Magic there, then Toril is a unique case (AFAWK).

Taking that into consideration, and knowing already that the Weave merely acts as a user-interface, enabling mortals easier access to magic (supposedly, 'Pure Magic' is too potent in Realmspace, so the interface is required), we can see how the gods could have come to use this plug-&-play interface to just put their religion on 'auto-pilot'.

Its quite simple - Mystra made their jobs simpler, and even gods like ease-of-use, so they began to use the Weave as a spell-delivery system, so they could spend more time playing Golf or whatever gods do. This happened over the course of many millenia, until it became the standard way of doing things in Faerűn (although not necessarily elsewhere on Toril). The gods gave Mystra a bit of their power, and she used her distribution infra-structure to get the job done.

They got an easy way of doing things, and Mystra was able to get a big boost to her portfolio (all that power running through her Weave). I even believe that Mystra's church spread 'un-truths' around about how the Weave was the only way to do magic - which we now know in hindsight is patently false.

Some gods never chose to use Mystra's Weave - most notably Shar. Some may have had alternate power-sources to aid their clergy with easy spell use and retrieval (for instnace, the nature gods may have been tapping into fey magic for quite some time). Others were so 'new' that they didn't even realize they had other options (such as Cyric).

What that means is that when the Weave came down, all those gods that had been using Mystra's Weave - which is nearly all of the Faerűnian Pantheon, had to start doing things the 'old-fashioned way', and send spells to their clergy directly. Although this means more work on their part, it also means they can keep closer tabs on their priests now - we had quite a few priests behaving in very odd ways before the Spellplague, and one had to wonder why they were still receiving spells from their deity.

Now, to FINALLY address your question - The Weave was such a handy thing to have around that other beings of immense power - namely primordials and Arch-Fiends - were also able to use it to give their followers spells (with the requisite power 'donation' to Mystra).

With the Weave gone, all of those non-gods are now completely out-of luck! With the change in magic, even demi-powers can't grant spells without the help of a god. Things are back to the way it is supposed to be, before Mystra's Weave changed all the rules of Magic in Realmspace. Just as mortals were never meant to cast 12th level spells, neither were non-gods ever supposed to grant spells.

All is as it should be with Mystra and her Weave gone.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 19 Mar 2009 23:00:18
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Moderator

Australia
31690 Posts

Posted - 19 Mar 2009 :  23:12:12  Show Profile  Send The Sage an AOL message  Click to see The Sage's MSN Messenger address  Send The Sage a Yahoo! Message Send The Sage a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by khorne

Ed, I would like to ask why so many people in the Realms (such as Elminster or Khelben) seem to consider Volo a fool. If he was an idiot, he would not have survived gathering the information contained in his guides.

Ed has touched on this before, as I recall, when I asked him about Volo's status some years ago.

Though, Volo as a Realms character is pretty well summed up in the introduction to any of the Volo's Guides.

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)

"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5041 Posts

Posted - 20 Mar 2009 :  00:24:29  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hello again, all. This, from Ed, commenting on Markustay's Weave explanation post, above:


Nicely put, Markustay. VERY nicely put.
You "think Realms" with the best of us. :}


So saith Ed. And I (of course) concur.
love,
THO
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Foxhelm
Senior Scribe

Canada
592 Posts

Posted - 20 Mar 2009 :  00:58:20  Show Profile  Click to see Foxhelm's MSN Messenger address  Send Foxhelm a Yahoo! Message Send Foxhelm a Private Message
It still doesn't explain where Primals get their powers from or future elemental source powers. Druids have to get powers somewhere, or else you might as well exclude Druids and the rest from the realms.

Primal classes get their power from the spirits of the mortal world, or Toril in this case. If the weave was supplying the power before, non-god characters can not give power, and all druids get their powers form the gods... where do the modern druids gain their powers? Wouldn't that exclude all Primal, all non Martial/Psionic/Arcane/Divine power sources?

By your example, all druids have no power.

Can I get an explanation of where the power, whom the power comes from? Has the realms followed the core and now spirits provide the power for druids or is it something else.

Basically the explanation is incomplete when trying to include the new classes of the PH2 and further expansions.

You have explained why Spirits and Primordials can not grant Prayers (Divine source powers), not where Evocations come from (Primal sourced powers).

Ed Greenwood! The Solution... and Cause of all the Realms Problems!

Edited by - Foxhelm on 20 Mar 2009 01:05:41
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 20 Mar 2009 :  02:09:33  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

Hello again, all. This, from Ed, commenting on Markustay's Weave explanation post, above:


Nicely put, Markustay. VERY nicely put.
You "think Realms" with the best of us. :}


So saith Ed. And I (of course) concur.
love,
THO



Markustay has just accomplished what I heretofore thought impossible... making the demise of Mystra and the Weave seem like a Good Thing(TM). I'm shocked, to say the least, but not at all surprised that he was the one to make sense of it. Of course, what this all means is that there need be no barrier to the ascension of new powers of magic in the Realms; Ao (and/or His superiors) need only prevent the re-creation of the Weave. After all, as far as we know, Oerth gets along fine in 4E with Boccob, Wee Jas, and no Weave, so why should Toril not be allowed to have deities of magic just because the guiding principle of 4E is that magic shouldn't be any more powerful than any non-magical discipline? Just phrasing it that way makes it sound patently ridiculous; why would magic exist at all if this were the case? Anyway, this is turning into something between a rant and an essay; I'm not sure which, and either way, I'm threadjacking Ed, which is not my intent. I'll shut up now, but I'm interested in Ed's thoughts on my views. Essay finished / rant over.

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 20 Mar 2009 02:10:07
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
14014 Posts

Posted - 20 Mar 2009 :  02:32:25  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Foxhelm

By your example, all druids have no power. <major snippage>
Which is why I left an 'out'.

Notice I metioned how some 'nature gods' may have already been tapping Fey magic, or even another source. 4e's 'power-sources' all amount to the same - ways in which to manipulate the universe around you to do your bidding. Arcane Power became the dominant force on Toril because Mystra made it so. People forgot 'the old ways' because she made it so easy - you impress a mystic formula into your brain, mumble a few eldritch words, sprinkle some powder and 'POOF', instant effect.

Now arcane formulas are no longer the short-cut they once were, and people have to rely on their own inner understanding of magic itself. This means that they can't learn as many different effects as they did before, but they are able to master the ones they do learn, and cast them repeatedly now.

Without the Weave and its easy connection to the Arcane source, folks are exploring forgotten paths to power, not just Arcane. This is nothing new - Shadoweavers have been doing it for years, and on other parts of Toril other magical traditions have kept-on despite the Weave, such as the Pluma magic of Maztica, or the Zakharan Elemental Sorcerors.

I didn't say all those other beings aside from Gods couldn't ever grant spells - I merely pointed out that they were no longer able to use the easy method employed before.

Some will discover new ways, or rather, 're-discover' old ways. Others will not, and be forced to be beholden to Higher Powers to supply their followers - in the case of Arch-Devils, Asmodeus would suit this purpose now.

Heck, I can even back some of this up with canon - it is a fact that the Sarrukh had recorded strange magical traditions in the Nether Scrolls - just because the majority of Archwizards chose to follow the arcane path (because of Mystryl's Weave) doesn't mean they all did, and I know that Telemont and the Chronomancer certainly went their own way, and even Ioulaum eventually sought an alternate source (psionics). In fact, probably most of the ones who walked a different Path then Arcane Magic are the ones who survived the fall.

'Strange Ancient Magics' have always been a staple of the Realms - its just rising to the forefront again. The wheel of time turns, and a new age has dawned.

Its just my take, so you can use it or throw it out if you hate it, but explaining away inconsistencies helps me sleep at night. With the Weave and Mystra out of the picture, and the Spellplague rolling over the cosmos, its really not that hard to figure out why everything works differently now.

quote:
Originally posted by Jakk

Markustay has just accomplished what I heretofore thought impossible... making the demise of Mystra and the Weave seem like a Good Thing(TM).
You should here my take on the changes to the Elves some time... change... what change?

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 20 Mar 2009 02:35:12
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Daviot
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USA
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Posted - 20 Mar 2009 :  02:45:22  Show Profile  Visit Daviot's Homepage  Send Daviot an AOL message Send Daviot a Private Message
With the recent reply on Bannermere of Thunderstone, it reminded me...how deep in Ed's queue are the travails of Cormyr's Sorndrake family?

One usually has far more to fear from the soft-spoken wizard with a blade and well-worn boots than from the boisterous one in the ivory tower.
Want more adventure? Into the Dark (PF Beginner Box 2nd level) | The Red Leaves Enigma (3.x/PF 3rd/4th level) | In Iron Clad (TBD, 3.x/PF 14th lvl)
Want an 'Ecology of the Kitsune'? Races Revised: The Kitsune Clans
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