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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2008 :  19:09:52  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Another lineage question... this one about the Wyvernspurs. I have a JPEG (whose origin was a link from this site, which I now cannot locate) of the complete (up to Dimswart's granddaughter) Wyvernspur lineage, which I have integrated into my mapping of the royal lineage through the marriage of Azoun II and Linnese, daughter of Lord Gerrin Wyvernspur.

My questions to you are threefold:
First, are the various Winters in the lineage (Amalee, Shara, Lamala) related to Lord Tessaril Winter of Eveningstar?
Second, if so, how does Tessaril fit in? Is she Lamala's niece, or a more distant relation?
Third, should I be asking Kate Novak and/or Jeff Grubb these questions, or are they covered by NDA altogether?

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 14 Nov 2008 19:11:32
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore

USA
1081 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2008 :  19:37:10  Show Profile  Visit Garen Thal's Homepage Send Garen Thal a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jakk

Another lineage question... this one about the Wyvernspurs. I have a JPEG (whose origin was a link from this site, which I now cannot locate) of the complete (up to Dimswart's granddaughter) Wyvernspur lineage, which I have integrated into my mapping of the royal lineage through the marriage of Azoun II and Linnese, daughter of Lord Gerrin Wyvernspur.

My questions to you are threefold:
First, are the various Winters in the lineage (Amalee, Shara, Lamala) related to Lord Tessaril Winter of Eveningstar?
Second, if so, how does Tessaril fit in? Is she Lamala's niece, or a more distant relation?
Third, should I be asking Kate Novak and/or Jeff Grubb these questions, or are they covered by NDA altogether?
The JPEG in question (available hereis something I concocted, updated from the one in The Wyvern's Spur to account for a dating error and to add some information.

As for your questions I believe I addressed them over on the first page of the thread: they Wyvernspurs are entirely the Grubb-Novaks' to deal with.

Edited by - Garen Thal on 14 Nov 2008 19:58:19
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2008 :  23:25:00  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks Garen. I'm trying to find projects that don't inspire so many NDA-prone questions; it's healthier for me that way. I'd rather not blow a gasket before the Cormyr lineage actually does see the light of day, whenever that may be.

Edit: Of course, in my search for questions you are allowed to answer, I seem to be prone to repeating myself, now that I've reread the first page... my apologies. Of all the things I've lost, I miss my mind the most.

Later Edit: Changed wording of first edit.

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 17 Nov 2008 07:40:34
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 27 Nov 2008 :  04:50:18  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Wow... I disappear for two weeks and this scroll goes dead. Maybe I've asked all the questions about Cormyr that Candlekeep wants answers to, which means we need to wait for some NDAs to be fulfilled or expire. I'm suspecting that this is NDA territory too, but... what can you tell me about Vangerdahast and Jorunhast post-Spellplague? Last I heard, both were still around... and if this is NDA'd for the benefit of novel writers, that's good. If the novel(s) has (have) already been written and published, that's even better. I'm still getting around to catching up on my pre-Spellplague novels.

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 27 Nov 2008 04:51:20
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
4944 Posts

Posted - 28 Nov 2008 :  04:54:13  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yes, it appears that people only want to ask Brian about things "Cormyr" and myself about things "Impiltur". I'm pretty sure both of us could field questions on a range of topics ... why not test our expertise?

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus
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Uzzy
Senior Scribe

United Kingdom
618 Posts

Posted - 28 Nov 2008 :  05:52:39  Show Profile  Visit Uzzy's Homepage Send Uzzy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
What's the extent of the Lliiran faith in Cormyr? Any large and notable temples/priests/famous Lliiran bards?
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 19 Dec 2008 :  06:21:43  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I've found a non-Cormyr question for you, Brian; following George's suggestion, I thought I'd ask you and give Ed one less question to deal with... yeah, I know it's a drop in the bucket... anyway:

132 (The Year of Thirteen Prides Lost)
(It seemed appropriate to place the following event in this year, and it fits with the timeline we have for Azuth's ascension) The following is a paraphrase of the published description of the event from Faiths and Pantheons:
quote:
The Shadevari return to Toril (or perhaps never left) in search of a recently-spawned realm of Shadows. As the Shadevari enter this mysterious realm, located in an unknown part of Toril, they are imprisoned within it by the new wizard-deity Azuth, who encases the realm in the Key of Shadows (created by Gond) and hurls the Key of Shadows into the cosmos.

Speculation, by myself and others, is that the Key of Shadows becomes the Plane of Shadow... but if this were the case, then the Plane of Shadow would not have existed for the Netherese city of Thultanthar to flee to during the Fall of Netheril in the Year of Sundered Webs (-339 DR). My guess would be that the Key of Shadows was drawn into the Plane of Shadows by the mutually-attractive nature of shadowstuff. Still, it would be nice as an origin story, but it would require Azuth to have been a god at least 500 years before canon lore says he ascended.

Can you tell us anything more about the Key of Shadows and the Shadevari, or would doing so eNDAnger you and those to whom you speak? (Not that I'm saying that WotC is anything like a Ministry of Truth... I now understand the role of NDAs in enabling the designers... but that doesn't mean I'm happy about them.

Thanks in advance for any light you can shed on these shadowy issues.

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.

Edited by - Jakk on 19 Dec 2008 06:22:29
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Asgetrion
Master of Realmslore

Finland
1564 Posts

Posted - 21 Dec 2008 :  21:44:56  Show Profile  Visit Asgetrion's Homepage Send Asgetrion a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Brian,

I posted these questions to Ed before I realized that as the resident "Sage on all Matters Cormyrean" you might know the answers or offer some advice on some (if not all) of them.

So here it is, re-posted:

I have been running a Pathfinder Beta playtest campaign, which is set in Thunderstone, in Cormyr. I have written a lot of material for it, but since a lot of the events in the campaign have taken place outside the town, the players have not interacted a lot with NPCs outside their "inner" circle (i.e. families and shopkeepers and prominent allies, such as tutors). I'm still fleshing out details, and filling in stuff as the campaign progresses and the PCs are drawn deeper into local intrigue, and here are some questions for you:

1) Which noble families have holdings in or around Thunderstone?

2) Are there any "extinct" local noble families, who might have dabbled into necromancy and/or demon worship, and were either exiled or executed or imprisoned?

3) Which sort of presence do the Heralds and Harper and Zhentarim agents have in Thunderstone -- i.e. do stay just "stay put" and observe, or have an active presence in the area?

4) Are there any notable castles or keeps in or near Thunderstone?

5) Which religions have shrines (or even temples) in or around Thunderstone? I've already included shrines to Tymora, Tempus, Chauntea, Silvanus (outside the town) and Torm -- some of these due to PC backgrounds -- but I'd like to hear from you if I have forgotten an "obvious" deity from that list.

6) Which demihuman races have any "presence" in Thunderstone? Is it alright to assume that whole families of gnomes, halflings and dwarves live and work there? Any lost (i.e. forgotten) dwarven or gnome clan holds/strongholds nearby?

7) Can you give any details about the Realm of Wailing Fog?

8) Does Stag's Skull Bridge have any sort of barracks/buildings for the Dragons stationed there, or do they just march to guard the bridge in shifts? Does it have any other buildings, or perhaps even fortifications (such as a barbican)?

"What am I doing today? Ask me tomorrow - I can be sure of giving you the right answer then."
-- Askarran of Selgaunt, Master Sage, speaking to a curious merchant, Year of the Helm
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore

USA
1081 Posts

Posted - 29 Dec 2008 :  14:25:10  Show Profile  Visit Garen Thal's Homepage Send Garen Thal a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Sorry for the very long wait for my replies, but the holidays are a busy time around here. Living in New York, any time between Thanksgiving and New Years is eaten up between working, writing, and commuting to and from work (which takes twice as long).

Getting back to work now. Once these projects are out the door (Jan 15 or so), expect a more regular response time.
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore

USA
1081 Posts

Posted - 29 Dec 2008 :  14:26:16  Show Profile  Visit Garen Thal's Homepage Send Garen Thal a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jakk

Wow... I disappear for two weeks and this scroll goes dead. Maybe I've asked all the questions about Cormyr that Candlekeep wants answers to, which means we need to wait for some NDAs to be fulfilled or expire. I'm suspecting that this is NDA territory too, but... what can you tell me about Vangerdahast and Jorunhast post-Spellplague? Last I heard, both were still around... and if this is NDA'd for the benefit of novel writers, that's good. If the novel(s) has (have) already been written and published, that's even better. I'm still getting around to catching up on my pre-Spellplague novels.
Vangerdahast and Jorunhast are Royal Magicians, and are thus covered by my generic "Sorry, going to have to wait for the Lineage" response.

So, Sorry... &c
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore

USA
1081 Posts

Posted - 29 Dec 2008 :  14:29:25  Show Profile  Visit Garen Thal's Homepage Send Garen Thal a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Uzzy

What's the extent of the Lliiran faith in Cormyr? Any large and notable temples/priests/famous Lliiran bards?
Lliirans are a traveling lot within Cormyr, and show up at all manner of happy occasions. They are well-received by Cormyreans, and can often be seen traveling in Triplets (one of Lliira, one of Sharess, one of Sune) in Suzail trying to cheer folks up. Such Triplets are often all beautiful women of different looks (and, sometimes, species), akin to flower children or other wandering folk.

I'll try and have some temples and priests for you after the New Year, and will leave myself a note so I don't forget.
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore

USA
1081 Posts

Posted - 29 Dec 2008 :  14:49:47  Show Profile  Visit Garen Thal's Homepage Send Garen Thal a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jakk

I've found a non-Cormyr question for you, Brian; following George's suggestion, I thought I'd ask you and give Ed one less question to deal with... yeah, I know it's a drop in the bucket... anyway:

132 (The Year of Thirteen Prides Lost)
(It seemed appropriate to place the following event in this year, and it fits with the timeline we have for Azuth's ascension) The following is a paraphrase of the published description of the event from Faiths and Pantheons:
quote:
The Shadevari return to Toril (or perhaps never left) in search of a recently-spawned realm of Shadows. As the Shadevari enter this mysterious realm, located in an unknown part of Toril, they are imprisoned within it by the new wizard-deity Azuth, who encases the realm in the Key of Shadows (created by Gond) and hurls the Key of Shadows into the cosmos.

Speculation, by myself and others, is that the Key of Shadows becomes the Plane of Shadow... but if this were the case, then the Plane of Shadow would not have existed for the Netherese city of Thultanthar to flee to during the Fall of Netheril in the Year of Sundered Webs (-339 DR). My guess would be that the Key of Shadows was drawn into the Plane of Shadows by the mutually-attractive nature of shadowstuff. Still, it would be nice as an origin story, but it would require Azuth to have been a god at least 500 years before canon lore says he ascended.

Can you tell us anything more about the Key of Shadows and the Shadevari, or would doing so eNDAnger you and those to whom you speak? (Not that I'm saying that WotC is anything like a Ministry of Truth... I now understand the role of NDAs in enabling the designers... but that doesn't mean I'm happy about them.

Thanks in advance for any light you can shed on these shadowy issues.
I'm going to answer this one a little more generally than you'll probably like, Jakk, but that's for necessity's sake.

Issues regarding Shadow (and the Demiplane of Shadow, Plane of Shadow, Shadowfell, and so forth) should be seen as more nebulous than you're approaching the issue. Shadow is the wispy, ephemeral not-stuff of the cosmos, moldable and shapable and, at its essence, capable of redefinition.

As I see things, the Key of Shadows that Gond forges is not the (Demi)Plane of Shadows. As the nature of that plane is ever-changing, it is not inconceivable that the key was drawn there, added to the plane and altered it somewhat, but they did not begin as one in the same.
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader

USA
7106 Posts

Posted - 30 Dec 2008 :  19:15:13  Show Profile  Visit Rinonalyrna Fathomlin's Homepage Send Rinonalyrna Fathomlin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I like that triplet concept, it's cute.

"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time)
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore

USA
1081 Posts

Posted - 30 Dec 2008 :  21:21:06  Show Profile  Visit Garen Thal's Homepage Send Garen Thal a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

I like that triplet concept, it's cute.
Oh, they're positively adorable, even if the Lliiran of the three is often caught trying to temper (read: censor) the efforts of her "sisters."

Now, when Triplets of Shar, Loviatar and Beshaba go walking, it's a far less amusing sight.
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader

USA
7106 Posts

Posted - 31 Dec 2008 :  02:51:52  Show Profile  Visit Rinonalyrna Fathomlin's Homepage Send Rinonalyrna Fathomlin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Garen Thal

quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

I like that triplet concept, it's cute.
Oh, they're positively adorable, even if the Lliiran of the three is often caught trying to temper (read: censor) the efforts of her "sisters."

Now, when Triplets of Shar, Loviatar and Beshaba go walking, it's a far less amusing sight.



In fact, it's probably downright scary!

"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time)
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Asgetrion
Master of Realmslore

Finland
1564 Posts

Posted - 01 Jan 2009 :  14:14:56  Show Profile  Visit Asgetrion's Homepage Send Asgetrion a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Happy New Year, Brian! And let me tell you that I'm eagerly waiting for your module, 'Descent Into Midnight' -- I hope you'll get to write more for Paizo in the future!

"What am I doing today? Ask me tomorrow - I can be sure of giving you the right answer then."
-- Askarran of Selgaunt, Master Sage, speaking to a curious merchant, Year of the Helm
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore

USA
1081 Posts

Posted - 02 Jan 2009 :  16:15:12  Show Profile  Visit Garen Thal's Homepage Send Garen Thal a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

quote:
Originally posted by Garen Thal

quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

I like that triplet concept, it's cute.
Oh, they're positively adorable, even if the Lliiran of the three is often caught trying to temper (read: censor) the efforts of her "sisters."

Now, when Triplets of Shar, Loviatar and Beshaba go walking, it's a far less amusing sight.



In fact, it's probably downright scary!
Scary, alluring, or downright intoxicating. All depends on your pain tolerance, I suppose...
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore

USA
1081 Posts

Posted - 02 Jan 2009 :  16:21:15  Show Profile  Visit Garen Thal's Homepage Send Garen Thal a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Asgetrion

Happy New Year, Brian! And let me tell you that I'm eagerly waiting for your module, 'Descent Into Midnight' -- I hope you'll get to write more for Paizo in the future!
Thank you, Asgetrion, and a happy New Year to you (and all denizens of the 'Keep) as well.

While the Realms are and always will be my first love, and I would gladly move all Seven Heavens and the Elemental Plane of Earth to write in FR for the rest of my days, Golarion is a deep, compelling world that I'm enjoying the chance to explore, and the folks at Paizo are a great group to work with.

So, expect me to write more of something in the future. For which company, well, that's up to them, isn't it? ;)
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 08 Jan 2009 :  05:16:43  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Garen Thal


I'm going to answer this one a little more generally than you'll probably like, Jakk, but that's for necessity's sake.

Issues regarding Shadow (and the Demiplane of Shadow, Plane of Shadow, Shadowfell, and so forth) should be seen as more nebulous than you're approaching the issue. Shadow is the wispy, ephemeral not-stuff of the cosmos, moldable and shapable and, at its essence, capable of redefinition.

As I see things, the Key of Shadows that Gond forges is not the (Demi)Plane of Shadows. As the nature of that plane is ever-changing, it is not inconceivable that the key was drawn there, added to the plane and altered it somewhat, but they did not begin as one in the same.



Thanks for that clarification, Garen... that actually makes more sense, seeing as we have that timeline snafu otherwise (Thultanthar retreating into the Plane of Shadows before the Year of Sundered Webs, and Azuth ascending to divinity approximately five centuries later, by my calculations, and imprisoning the Shadevari after that). I'd love to know more about the Shadevari, and those suspiciously-similar-in-number pyramids under Ascore, but I know the latter are firmly entrenched in NDA-land (as I heard from Ed quite recently, anyway, right where they've been for 20 years since the original Savage Frontier supplement was published) and I suspect the same about the former. I'd think that a 20-year automatic expiry on all NDA's isn't too much to ask for... heck, even ten years seems more than reasonable to me... but methinks I doth protest too much again...

A belated Happy New Year to you and other contributors to your scroll!

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.
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Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore

Canada
1796 Posts

Posted - 12 Feb 2009 :  09:11:44  Show Profile  Click to see Purple Dragon Knight's MSN Messenger address Send Purple Dragon Knight a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Brian: good job on the last instalment of Second Darkness!!! the comments about it look fantastic. It appears that you flew into Paizo and literally saved the day!!!

It annoys me to no end that I cannot read it: I bought it, of course, with my ongoing subscription to Pathfinder Adventure Paths, but I just turned over future DMing duties to one of my players, and loaned him all SD instalments (I had been trying to DM my group through Cormyr: Tearing of the Weave, but the weekly exercise became so tedious that I was, over time, hit with a bad case of DM burnout... and have therefore declared that this Realms campaign was at an end; any takers for my now useless Cormyr/Shadowdale/Anauroc hardcovers? actually, any takers for most of my 3.0/3.5 Realms stuff? any offer will be entertained, and I own most books...)

Sorry Brian...
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crazedventurers
Master of Realmslore

United Kingdom
1073 Posts

Posted - 03 Mar 2009 :  19:35:19  Show Profile  Visit crazedventurers's Homepage Send crazedventurers a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Brian a sucession question for you.

We have been chatting elsewhere about what would happen if Foril (Azoun IV and Fee's son) wasn't killed by the fire knives when a babe but was kidnapped instead, raised in Westgate/Vilhon Reach oblivious to his parentage until many years later and so he returns to Cormyr just before (say a week or two) Azoun V is to be crowned King at the end of the Steel Regency. Let us assume that the various wishes/communes/blood magic spells/swords of state etc all confirm him to be the true Foril, would he ascend to the Dragon Thrne instead of Azoun?

What would happen if Foril arrived a few days/weeks after Azoun's crowning - do the rules change?

More interested in the protocol of the issue, not the reprecussions of potential civil war etc.

Thanks

Damian

So saith Ed. I've never said he was sane, have I?
Gods, all this writing and he's running a constant fantasy version of Coronation Street in his head, too. .
shudder,
love to all,
THO
Candlekeep Forum 7 May 2005
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 04 Mar 2009 :  00:47:32  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Purple Dragon Knight

<chop>(I had been trying to DM my group through Cormyr: Tearing of the Weave, but the weekly exercise became so tedious that I was, over time, hit with a bad case of DM burnout... and have therefore declared that this Realms campaign was at an end; any takers for my now useless Cormyr/Shadowdale/Anauroc hardcovers? actually, any takers for most of my 3.0/3.5 Realms stuff? any offer will be entertained, and I own most books...)



Since you ask... I'm trying to get my hands on "Sons of Gruumsh" and "The Twilight Tomb". "Expedition to Undermountain" was on my list, but I know what happens in the adventure, and none of it's happening in my Realms. The Realms without Halaster is like the Realms without Mystra: not the Realms. Anyway, no more ranting. Those are about the only two titles I'm looking for Realms-wise; core-rules-wise, I'm looking for "Elder Evils" and the "Rules Compendium"; once I have those four books, I may never buy another D&D title, depending on what I see with 5E. On a related note, if you know anyone who is looking for a deal on the 4E core books, I have a set in mint condition.

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.
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Jakk
Great Reader

Canada
2165 Posts

Posted - 04 Mar 2009 :  00:50:07  Show Profile Send Jakk a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Back on topic (sorry, Garen): I'm interested in Damian's question as well. Certainly food for thought. Hopefully such hypotheticals don't constitute "lineage talk" and hence invoke the mighty and dreaded NDA...

Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.

If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic.
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore

USA
1081 Posts

Posted - 04 Mar 2009 :  03:19:04  Show Profile  Visit Garen Thal's Homepage Send Garen Thal a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by crazedventurers
We have been chatting elsewhere about what would happen if Foril (Azoun IV and Fee's son) wasn't killed by the fire knives when a babe but was kidnapped instead, raised in Westgate/Vilhon Reach oblivious to his parentage until many years later and so he returns to Cormyr just before (say a week or two) Azoun V is to be crowned King at the end of the Steel Regency. Let us assume that the various wishes/communes/blood magic spells/swords of state etc all confirm him to be the true Foril, would he ascend to the Dragon Thrne instead of Azoun?

What would happen if Foril arrived a few days/weeks after Azoun's crowning - do the rules change?

More interested in the protocol of the issue, not the reprecussions of potential civil war etc.
Okay, this is going to assume a lot of ifs, but the protocol requires that certain facts be established. I'm answering with the following assumptions:

-The same assassination attempt on Foril as currently appears in canon happened, but successfully convinced all Cormyr that the boy was dead while simultaneously kidnapping the child. [This is because it is entirely implausible for an heir to Cormyr to be kidnapped and not have all Faerūn brought down on the kidnapper's head.]

-Events proceeded pretty much as they did in the novels and sourcebooks (the Cormyr saga, FRCS3E, Dragon Annual 5, etc.)

-Foril returns to Cormyr just before the coronation of Azoun V and asserts his claim to the Dragon Throne. [Once Azoun is crowned, that's absolutely it. You cannot pop up with a 'stronger' claim and unseat a crowned monarch.]

-All reliable magic declares Foril to be the natural son of Azoun IV and Filfaeril, in the same body to which he was born, unmolested and never killed-and-ressurected.

Assuming all these factors are in place, the laws of the regency provide that Azoun V is still king. He was king throughout the entire regency, regardless of who ruled in his name.

Now, if Foril still insisted, and was--as I can only assume from his upbringing--a charming rake more than capable of swaying individual nobles to his cause, a few things might happen, depending on his success:

a) He would rally enough nobles to his side to have him proclaimed heir to the throne, until such time as Azoun V can produce an heir (he is still a blood Obarskyr, but the regency and the will of the people would favor Alusair over him)

b) He could rally enough nobles and commoners to support an abdication of the young Azoun in his favor. Of course, by this time, Foril's pushing 50, so this isn't very likely in real terms, but it is possible.

c) He could gather his supporters and engage in civil war for the Dragon Throne.

For b or c, the success of the endeavors is totally dependent on Alusair's opinion. She is, in the eyes of many, the Queen of Cormyr, regardless of her title; she is formally the Lord Marshal of the Kingdom (and therefore commands all loyal Purple Dragons); and she is more than capable of out-generalling, well, anyone.

No matter what the facts are, the reappearance of a thought-dead Foril is likely to drive Filfaeril entirely insane, as much of her life for 40 to 50 years (depending on the exact date of return) is forged around her inability to protect her infant son from assassination.

To answer the salient question, though: an heir to the throne, thought dead, does not immediately supplant another heir that has been declared heir apparent. Foril was, at the time of his death, the heir presumptive to the Dragon Throne, but his reappearance does not in any way place him first in line for the job.
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

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Posted - 04 Mar 2009 :  03:52:35  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi, all. I forwarded Garen's last post (immediately above this one) to Ed, and he read it and responded:

EXACTLY right. Of course.

Dead on.

(So Ed thinks the above absolutely nails it. Ed thinks the civil war option would be the most likely, because of nobles WANTING to go to war - - but they'd end up doing it with a pretender, because Foril would never agree to it.
That's his reading of Foril's character - - but think also of this: in some ways (if, as Garen says, we begin with those assumptions), Foril has been set free from his destiny. "Robbed" of it, perhaps, but also set free from what was otherwise inescapable from birth. He might well welcome that.)
love to all, and especially Garen Thal (Ed is DELIGHTED with your work on the Forest Kingdom, and looking forward to your Golarion gig; first of many, we both hope!),
THO
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