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Lemernis
Senior Scribe
378 Posts |
 Posted - 30 May 2008 : 03:36:35
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Is there any deity that might be appropriate for the following type of AD&D character:
Cleric-Ranger
Chaotic-Good
Half-elf (passes for human in appearance)
who is a rather mercenary type? Not an innately bad person but isn't disturbed by shady work (sort of like the hardboiled detective ethos, come to think of it). A rugged individualist who primarily acts in self-interest. Has no qualms about breaking the law, but by the same token is not cruel, ruthless, or sadistic. Sometimes performs good deeds but it is usually for idiosyncratic reasons, rather than according to principles.
If it were just a cleric it might not be so hard. But the cleric-ranger combo makes it harder to find a deity that works. I guess this would be in the vein of a Stalker kit, where the ranger part is concerned.
Anyway, any ideas for a deity that could work here?
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2008 : 04:03:41
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For some reason, Shevarash jumps out at me. Your a Half-elf, so it should be okay (he's Seldarine).
Perhaps it is the way you describe your character - he sounds like the "Batman" type, and Shavarash is known as "The Night Hunter". He's mostly known for hunting Drow, but I could see a follower broadening that to "all enemies of the people", which in turn could be interpretted as "just about anybody" who's no good. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Afetbinttuzani
Senior Scribe
Canada
434 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2008 : 04:26:49
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For CG characters of a mercenary persuasion here's a few other possibilities:
Tymora (Lady Luck) CG
Portfolio: Adventurers, skill, good fortune
Waukeen (Merchants' Friend) N
Portfolio: Trade, Money, Wealth
Silvanus (Oak Father) N
Portfolio: Nature, Druids
If any of these interest you and don't have the 2E FR Adventures hardcover, let me know and I can give the detailed info regarding weapons allowed to clerics, granted powers, etc.
Cheers,
Afet |
Afet bint Tuzaní
"As the good Archmage often admonishes me, I ought not to let my mind wander, as it's too small to go off by itself."
- Danilo Thann in Elfsong by Elaine Cunningham |
Edited by - Afetbinttuzani on 30 May 2008 04:28:37 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2008 : 04:53:23
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| I'm not sure that your description matches the alignment you've given. He sounds more CN with G tendencies than CG. |
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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 30 May 2008 04:54:26 |
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Lemernis
Senior Scribe
378 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2008 : 11:16:59
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Thanks for the responses!
Wooly is right. Honestly, in terms of personality he's more of a Rogue than a Ranger, really. Other fictional characters who he shares some similarity with: Han Solo, Philip Marlowe, Sam Spade, Clint Eastwood's the Man With No Name from the Sergi Leone spaghetti western trilogy. Except here I have to see if I can meld those basic type of personality traits with a suitable FR deity and being a ranger!
I'm reading up a bit on rangers from the Complete Handbook of Rangers, and the whole CG/ranger aspect is really shaky to justify. The description of a Stalker as a spy, essentially, isn't really right for him (not that as a multiclass he'd be alowed to be one anyway under 2e rules, right?). I guess he could be a solitary 'nature boy' type who although tending toward solitary is actually quite comfortable in the city. He's self-possessed, has social skills, and isn't the slightest bit flummoxed by civilization or urban life.
The only way I can think to rationalize this is once he's in the city, he is perfectly capable of dealing with that world on its own terms--and in fact he is deadly effective realist. He's actually exceptionally good at adapting to any circumstances. He's an astute observer of the Darwinian aspects of nature, let's say. If the main lessons one learned were from nature, it is doubtful that they would be chilvarous, actually.
Let us say that he has grown up in a secluded community by the sea, and has seen very little of the greater world.
Mielicki is just too 'naturey' for this character... is there no other 'outside the box' possible deity for a ranger where faith is concerned?
Talos seems potentially doable what with being right on the ocean, eg, he might have spent a lot of time mesmerized by the sea, sort of communing with it, etc. I mean, that's just one example of trying to fuse all these different aspects of the character together, though I'm not really feeling an identification with storms working particularly well for this fellow. |
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Lemernis
Senior Scribe
378 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2008 : 13:46:53
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To flesh this concept out a little more:
He basically just self-interested. He's arguably more Neutral than Good. He fundamentally believes others are responsible for themselves and the messes they create for themselves (or their lack prudence in avoiding). He has derived his philosophy from observing nature. Nature is hardly forgiving or sentimental, for example. However, he would take no pleasure in deliberately causing harm to others (evil). That's out of sync with nature. He's basically Neutral but in the balance, overall, tending toward prosocial behavior, I guess (humans being social animals, after all). He has certain softspots that are kind of Chaotic in nature. He'll just like someone sometimes, and if they're in distress decide to lend them a hand, but there isn't always much rhyme or reason to it on the level of principles. Or maybe he'll help someone out not because he feels they deserve it, but because he decides he doesn't care for their oppressor or nemesis. |
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Afetbinttuzani
Senior Scribe
Canada
434 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2008 : 14:16:22
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I agree with the esteemed Hamster that your character sounds more CN than CG. In light of the fact that he is a cold realist and an observer, Oghma (N), god of knowledge, would be an option. Again, I think Waukeen is a good option for someone who is a pragmatic realist.
Afet. |
Afet bint Tuzaní
"As the good Archmage often admonishes me, I ought not to let my mind wander, as it's too small to go off by itself."
- Danilo Thann in Elfsong by Elaine Cunningham |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2008 : 18:19:15
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| The deity that jumped to my mind is Shaundakul. If the character in question likes to travel (or just happens to be a bit of a drifter), I think he'd be a great option. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 30 May 2008 18:20:08 |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2008 : 18:20:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I'm not sure that your description matches the alignment you've given. He sounds more CN with G tendencies than CG.
I agree with you about the alignment. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Lemernis
Senior Scribe
378 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2008 : 22:41:30
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| Can anyone confirm the available alignments in 2nd ed. AD&D for a half-elf cleric-ranger? I thought it was restricted to LG, NG, and CG, but I could be mistaken. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jun 2008 : 04:02:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Lemernis
Can anyone confirm the available alignments in 2nd ed. AD&D for a half-elf cleric-ranger? I thought it was restricted to LG, NG, and CG, but I could be mistaken.
I think that's correct. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Lemernis
Senior Scribe
378 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jun 2008 : 10:57:47
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Yeah, I think they can only be of Good alignment. So in that case that trait of randomly helping others out of "idiosyncratic softspots" that I mentioned will have to be pronounced enough to warrant the CG alignment.
Akadi is another candidate, since her church's "teachings amount to a doctrine of finding one's own enlightenment," and "the faithful must move from activity to activity, from place to place, pursuing a personal dream or series of interests and growing through the changing experiences each new day brings." The fact that Akadi is an elemental deity ties in to the connection with Nature suggested by being a ranger. But again, a roguish mercenary personality, being a priest, and a ranger don't all come together very well under the FR deites. I just want to be able to play that type of personality with the class skills of a cleric-ranger, but it doesn't seem to be panning out too well.
***
Edit: After pouring over Faiths and Avatars, Akadi seems the best fit. She pushes self-interest first and foremost (as a path to enlightenment) and is a kind of Nature deity. I guess I could say this character's quirky, unique individual path of self-actualization is to take his lessons directly from observing how Nature actually operates (hence becoming a ranger).
Shaundakul certainly could also work if I give him the quirk of feeling some kind of compulsion to aid traders, explorers, and travelers. But again, I wanted this character to be out primarily for himself.
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Edited by - Lemernis on 01 Jun 2008 12:24:51 |
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Hawkfeather
Seeker
Brazil
64 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jun 2008 : 15:09:37
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quote:
Originally posted by Lemernis
To flesh this concept out a little more:
He has derived his philosophy from observing nature. Nature is hardly forgiving or sentimental, for example. However, he would take no pleasure in deliberately causing harm to others (evil). That's out of sync with nature.
I think Silvanus could fit in this concept. |
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TheArchPriest
Acolyte
Brazil
14 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jun 2008 : 16:34:20
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Silvanus seems to fit well
Too bad you can't choose Kossuth... |
Black Flame Zealot
Influent Kossuthan Cleric
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MerrikCale
Senior Scribe
USA
947 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jun 2008 : 03:13:21
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| If you creep up the goodness just a bit, perhaps Selune could work. As is, Rhee's recommendation is the best IMHO |
When hinges creak in doorless chambers and strange and frightening sounds echo through the halls, whenever candlelights flicker where the air is deathly still, that is the time when ghosts are present, practicing their terror with ghoulish delight. |
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Lemernis
Senior Scribe
378 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jun 2008 : 15:20:58
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Yeah, there's no really good fit among the available deities for this, I don't think. Being a faithful cleric adds a dimension that I don't really want as part of the character's basic personality. This sort of roguish mercenary personality is better suited to cleric-thief; it's hard to reconcile with the ranger class, which requires that the character be Good, and that he have some sort of real connection to the wild. The mercenary opportunist seems pretty incompatible with the ranger class. (Note: He can't be multiclass and have the Stalker kit--but he's not a spy or snitch to begin with, so it isn't appropriate anyway.) The only creative solution I've found here feels a bit too contrived: an Akadian 'personal quest' to use Nature as a guide for living.
Otherwise I have to compromise the personality to include an interest in the tenets of the various faiths proposed. If he's a priest of Waukeen there's a bit too much emphasis on commerce. Cleric of Shaundakul brings an unwanted interest in trade routes, travel, and exploration. Being a cleric of Silvanus has him too much into a 'seeking balance in all things' schtick. And so on. |
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Vangelor
Learned Scribe
USA
183 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jun 2008 : 12:59:32
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| Erevan Ilesere? Fenmarel Mestarine? Or are elven gods not in the running? |
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Lemernis
Senior Scribe
378 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2008 : 12:39:11
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| Well, I made him a half-elf only because of the race/class restrictions in 2e AD&D. Otherwise he'd have been human. He easily passes for human and was raised as human by humans. The whole character concept is horribly metagamed. I just wanted to see if there was a credible way to meld those particular class skills with that type of personality. But tbh, it's a square peg and round hole. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2008 : 20:42:49
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| Maybe you could pass on making this guy a cleric? |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Lemernis
Senior Scribe
378 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2008 : 02:02:16
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I think cleric-thief is probably the best compromise. I've played those before and really, really enjoyed them. But I wanted a change of pace from that this time around.
I do think Akadi can basically work here. This is an offbeat character to begin with. He's someone who became fascinated with the hard lessons of life to be learned from the wild. It became a kind of personal quest. He does not at all shun humanity, and he is comfortable in civilization. But he's studied and observed how Nature works living out in the wilderness. And based on those observations he's all about living by one's wits, and using whatever one can make use of in the environment to survive (the mercenary aspect). FR is a magical place too, though. So he had a kind of spiritual revelation/awakening via feeling the divine in the wind. Akadi put her blessing on his quirky quest. I think this can work well enough for the type of personality I have in mind. |
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2e question - deity for cleric-ranger
