| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Wendolyn |
Posted - 25 Feb 2021 : 20:07:28
Greetings learned sages,
I've been working on Turmish for some time now, and it has always seemed strange that Turmish has no major river. Turmish has mountains that would capture clouds and a sloping landscape leading down to the sea. There is also plentiful moisture, humidity, and rainfall. It seems it would be very logical for a river that collects water flowing from all of the mountains that surround Turmish, and empties into the Sea of Fallen Stars. (Possibly there is such a river and it is not on the maps, but I think Elminster is pretty clear in the Polyhedron magazine series there is no such river).
But what if there is an underground river? Such underground rivers are common in Karst type topographies, which Turmish very well might have. Water could flow from the mountains and highlands and then disappear into sinkholes into a large subterranean river that flows out past Alaghôn into the inner sea.
Such a river would make sense for the internal trade of Turmish. The city of Gildenglade produces lumber and the town of Quorngar produces stone but both are far from Alaghôn and the sea beyond, almost surely their export destination. But how could it be profitable to transport those extremely heavy goods (low value to weight) very long distances overland? On the other hand, it would be easier to ship them downriver via this proposed underground river (with both aboveground and underground tributaries). This could also be an exciting caravan route for adventurers to guard, also.
Such a river, and a Karst topography, also dovetails with the known underdark presence in the region, containing both Drow and Duerger kingdoms.
Curious what you wise sages think! In particular if it contradicts or, even better, dovetails with any other known lore. Many thanks. |
| 4 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| George Krashos |
Posted - 27 Feb 2021 : 05:27:27
River Evenstar looks to be exactly what you theorised. The idea that the topography involves karst terrain makes sense given the volcanic aspects of the nearby Orsraun Mountains.
-- George Krashos |
| Wendolyn |
Posted - 27 Feb 2021 : 01:19:49
Thank you for your responses!
Yes about the Alaoreum. Definitely a big river there, but a strange one. As TBeholder says it empties into a lake and not the Sea of Fallen Stars.
And the most natural Turmish river start near Xorhun and flow down the length of the country, emyting into the Sea of Fallen Stars. Tributaries would flow into it as it did so. But there is no such river.
I've done some research and I think I have found some more evidence for the existence of my proposed underground river.
From Polyhedron #104 (Elminster's Everwinking Eye article) describes a town called Centaur's Bridge: “This town surrounds an arching stone bridge that carries the road over a long, tranquil pond that flows from nowhere to nowhere, rising from springs only to vanish down sinkholes not far away.” The presence of sinkholes I believe suggests a Karst topography, which would be consistent with an underground river (which possibly this water flows into).
But the best evidence I have found comes from Dragon #267 describing Dunspeirrin, the duergar city. First, this city is beneath the Orsraun mountains very near to Turmish (and often battles the drow kingdom Undraeth, which is beneath the Aphrunn mountains on the other side of Turmish).
Dunspeirrin is in the Middledark, so three to ten miles below the surface. It is also in an enormous open chamber so large nobody has explored the bottom. But key for my purposes, it is described in no uncertain terms as a place where four rivers meet. These rivers must be subterranean. They rivers are named in a map of the city,
River Evenstar (coming from the southeast, towards Turmish)
River Hmuur (coming from the northeast, towards the Sea of the Forgotten Stars & Hmuur plateau)
River Gulth (coming from the northwest, towards the Gulthmere forest)
River Osraun (coming from the west)
So possibly this River Evenstar is the river I want? All of these rivers have gone deep underground to get to the Middledark.
I cannot find anymore information whatsoever on these rivers, and I doubt any exists. But perhaps you sages have heard of something?
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| TBeholder |
Posted - 26 Feb 2021 : 21:43:36
Well, there are two rivers flowing from southern Osraun mountains into Vilhon Reach the way it usually works, with bridges on Ormath-Hlondeth road.
And Turmish is surrounded by mountains indeed. Which continue into the sea as island chains and clusters: Pirate Isles for Orsraun, Ilighon and Altumbel groups for Aphrunn. It's a very stony land, there's volcanic activity.
Another anomaly is: Alaoreum River flows along the sea shore line.
That's evidence strongly in favor of Sea of Fallen Stars not being the sink for most of Turmish: it doesn't slope to the sea, the water-parting line is somewhere along the shore.
Remember, the inner sea is there due to many large craters (of impact, tectonic and explosive origin). Perhaps without those there would be other highlands right North of Turmish.
So there are small rivers feeding small lakes.
And some underground sinks, indeed: water may evaporate, but minerals won't, hence some outlet is necessary to prevent Turmish from becoming a land of salt flats and salt marshes.
Not large ones, but it's plausible-ish: between hard stone resisting water trying to make short path for itself and alluvium clog as feedback to growing sinks, they drip, not roar.
Flowing into Glimmersea, Deep Reach, and whatever is that body of water between them, with some evaporation up the vents due to volcanism. |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 26 Feb 2021 : 01:48:24
-Turmish has the Alaoreum River, which flows between the Alaoreum Peaks (part of the Orsraun Mountains) and Nonthal/Evenstar Lake. The Orsraun Mountains also have some unnamed rivers that empty into the Vilhon Reach near Hlondeth that might start in Turmish territory. |
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