| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 14 Sep 2017 : 13:52:04
So, I know in the old war captain's companion that the red wizards had a very fast spelljammer that they had only recently developed, and I'm specifically targeting these spelljammers to Mythrell'aa and trying to shore up some lore to surround them. However, the only canon source I can find is the Spelljammer book War Captain's Companion. That being said, I see this site on the web, and it has a beautiful picture that's so much better than the one on the war captain's companion AND it also has deck plans
http://lost.spelljammer.org/bwafer/quadthay.html
Does anyone know, was there some other source besides the war captain's companion that details these? I'm interested to see if there was any kind of plot dealing with them that I just need to thread my needle through.
BTW, given that these were known for use in smuggling AND my intended use is to have them tied to the (formerly lost) netherese city of doubloon (renamed Luneira) AND having them tied to Mythrell'aa, I intend to throw in two things on these ships which were "hidden/undocumented" features.... basically a cloak (invisibility) and a very big displacement effect (because a minor shift of something this size wouldn't help). |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 09 Oct 2017 : 00:15:12
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by TBeholder
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
no one sticking noses into Thayan business, and there would be a far greater degree of autonomy and secrecy. It would also serve as a better port for their ships, for the same reasons.
One (or two, or...) of the Tears is close to "needle in the needle stack" place.
The problem with the Tears is that they are not isolated. You've got multiple inhabited Tears, and the Rock of Bral, all in one area that's going to see a lot of traffic coming and going. And all those neighbors and traffic means you've either got to seal yourself up in a rock and hope no one decides to land there, or you're going to be noticed sooner or later by someone -- perhaps several someones.
Picking a rock out in the middle of nowhere, on the other hand, means no neighbors, and if someone does decide to drop in unexpectedly, you blast them out of the sky and no one is the wiser.
Hmmm, makes me think..... Tear of Selune, portal, large hollowed out cave on the interior with no exterior openings.... decanter of endless water, exported underdark fungi, something to recycle the air. Granted not foolproof, but might make for an interesting farming community, along with a mining community that continues to excavate the rock and ore. In fact, doesn't really need to be a "portal" as much as a teleportation circle endpoint, especially if you aren't interested in giving an easy means of escape.
Along these same lines, similar asteroid, fill it with water, cave fish, underwater plants, and some kind of artificial magical light. Periodically you fish all the big fish out, then fill it with new fingerlings. You could even use the place to dump some of your refuse to decompose and help the habitat. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 08 Oct 2017 : 23:27:33
quote:
Originally posted by TBeholder
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
no one sticking noses into Thayan business, and there would be a far greater degree of autonomy and secrecy. It would also serve as a better port for their ships, for the same reasons.
One (or two, or...) of the Tears is close to "needle in the needle stack" place.
The problem with the Tears is that they are not isolated. You've got multiple inhabited Tears, and the Rock of Bral, all in one area that's going to see a lot of traffic coming and going. And all those neighbors and traffic means you've either got to seal yourself up in a rock and hope no one decides to land there, or you're going to be noticed sooner or later by someone -- perhaps several someones.
Picking a rock out in the middle of nowhere, on the other hand, means no neighbors, and if someone does decide to drop in unexpectedly, you blast them out of the sky and no one is the wiser.
|
| sleyvas |
Posted - 08 Oct 2017 : 01:32:25
@Tbeholder
Most of the reasons you mention are exactly why my version of all this involves Mythrell'aa and hiding the red wizard fleet. The Quads of Thay are not meant for combat, but rather for avoiding combat, smuggling, and possibly spy work. They are essentially trying to turn Wa and Shou Lung into even more fervent enemies of one another, meanwhile trying to steal their helms in order to build up their own fleets (and planting evidence to blame others).
Now, that all was BEFORE the spellplague and BEFORE they transferred to Abeir (in my homebrew). Over the past hundred years, maybe their own studies of helms has allowed them to develop a new type of helm.... similar to a artifurnace... a titan helm, using portions of the dawn titans. They might now have a small handful of big ships like Ayrik describes with bombards, greek fire projectors, mage shot, etc... and maybe this is one way they've managed to hold onto their tharchs over in Maztica/Anchorome/Katashaka/Osse. Not sure if I like it, but I'm gonna play with the idea a bit.
|
| sleyvas |
Posted - 08 Oct 2017 : 01:15:47
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
I hadn't actually considered a Thayan college IN space...
I would imagine Thayans in space would be received about as well as the Netherese were.
However, I've gotten another (post-Spellplague) idea in my head - a floating college. Not Necessarily Thayan (at least, not officially), just a 'College of Magic' built on an Earthmote. The beauty of that is that an adventure set at such a locale becomes of the 'use anywhere' variety (which is pretty-much how they meant all the 4e modules to be). A smaller earthmote could also be an excellent 'base' for PC's, if they could figure out how to steer it (sails?), but now I'm veering off-topic again. Imagine a base-camp you could just bring with you, like a combination 'Inn', stables, supply depot, etc.*
So to bring this back around to SJ-ing at least, what if Dwarven Citadels are actually built on Earth-motes? 
*EDIT:
On the other hand, I suppose a large enough SJ craft (or even a normal 'skyship') would make an excellent base as well. I would imagine you'd definitely need some sort of 'cloaking device' for it, because the first time the party went delving deep into a dungeon, someone would come along and steal the thing.
Yep, this was one of my ideas as well when I was throwing out ideas a few years back before 5e was detailed. Before I settled on the "United Tharchs of Toril", I was discussing "the United Tharchs of the Shaar" and I had the Underchasm still in place but there were small Tharchs surrounding it with red wizards, but there were earthmotes that red wizards setup colleges on. They couldn't move them, but they were relatively secure places for wizards to learn at, and they forced isolation to ensure students were spending time studying, etc...
In fact, my tharch of Peleveran, I still want to have some earthmotes with it. One will be a small college. The other will be an earthmote with canals and water dropping from it, but the red wizards control where to send the water. I've got a couple ideas for the source(s) of this water, but one piece of it might generate a new river that then dumps down into the great rift, and then out through the underground river to the gorge of Peleverai to become the river Shaar that feeds to western shaar. |
| TBeholder |
Posted - 07 Oct 2017 : 20:17:58
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
another local tear of Selune
I'd expect them to go for something further afield, myself... Maybe a random asteroid or something, at a Lagrange point
Aren't they?..
quote:
no one sticking noses into Thayan business, and there would be a far greater degree of autonomy and secrecy. It would also serve as a better port for their ships, for the same reasons.
One (or two, or...) of the Tears is close to "needle in the needle stack" place.
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
Thayan illusion can be used to produce a "cloaking device". Thayan bombards, hurling missiles with "alchemical fire" instead of giff smokepowder,
As much as catapults - as long as one can get enough of "mage shot" or helmseekers as such.
quote:
could (at least they would hope) be fired through openings in the crystal sphere at vessels still located within the volatile phlogiston. Perhaps they plan to blockade Realmspace,
You know that the crystal sphere radius is usually 2x that of the farthest orbit and Realmspace supposedly has 3200 portals opened at any time, right? And even if it wasn't, it would be still enormous. Blockading lots of points over such ranges would be a pipe-dream even if they had this many ships; Wa has 6 Tsunamis, EIN in the Triangle is what, 5-10 Armadas and 11-18 other ships per sphere?.. and the Grand Helm is much more expensive than what either uses. Also, blockade implies standing here, which would make disguise less useful once those on the inside find out what's going on.
It's much easier and cheaper to just drop a few helmseeker mines near a portal - assuming they can procure one and reverse-engineer the seeker enchantment.
Of course, those are moot points anyway, since there are always temporary portals opened by spell or device at an arbitrary point on the sphere - which is fairly common, both because the spheres are indeed enormous and people don't like having to run around while short on air or water, and also because pirate ambushes at the permanent passages do indeed happen.
quote:
seize vessels (to build an interplanetary or interstellar armada, crewed by undead) or
If you firebomb a vessel in phlogiston, there's a good chance hull and loot will be mostly ruined.
The slime grenades or old good skeleton ball mines are so much better.
quote:
I imagine that if the Red Wizards are active in Realmspace then they could indeed be a potent and serious threat to everyone else. Except for their typical lack of unified focus, their own plots and schemes turning self-destructively inward. An alliance with some other species - neogis, giths, beholders, illithids - could benefit the "Redjammers" greatly.
Those entities tend to be everyone's enemy already. Red Wizards' role would be what - fencing their loot and selling minor magic back?
Also, there's EIN, and they have a habit of trying to cull non-Elven upstarts without half as many reasons as Red Wizards would give them.
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
firing alchemical fireballs at your vessel ... on top of all the usual magics a shipload of wizards could hurl. To my mind the Netherese would be significantly outgunned. So to my mind the Redjammers enjoy a potent advantage the Netherjammers never had.
In ship-to-ship action spellhurling is only good at point-blank range, unless the caster teleports back and forth. Which can be nasty, but ultimately not very efficient.
As to fire-bombs - they, bioweapons and "mage shot" are less than common, but not too rare either. It's an advantage to have a steady supply, but that's about it. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 07 Oct 2017 : 17:06:00
But, c'mon, Thayan great bombards firing alchemical fireballs at your vessel ... on top of all the usual magics a shipload of wizards could hurl. To my mind the Netherese would be significantly outgunned. So to my mind the Redjammers enjoy a potent advantage the Netherjammers never had.
(Take note of human scale in that photo. That is the 39-ton 35-inch Russian Tsar Pouchka, "King of Cannons", cast in 1586. Most bombards were smaller, the 7-ton 20-inch Mons Meg is somewhat typical.) |
| Markustay |
Posted - 07 Oct 2017 : 16:15:04
I hadn't actually considered a Thayan college IN space...
I would imagine Thayans in space would be received about as well as the Netherese were.
However, I've gotten another (post-Spellplague) idea in my head - a floating college. Not Necessarily Thayan (at least, not officially), just a 'College of Magic' built on an Earthmote. The beauty of that is that an adventure set at such a locale becomes of the 'use anywhere' variety (which is pretty-much how they meant all the 4e modules to be). A smaller earthmote could also be an excellent 'base' for PC's, if they could figure out how to steer it (sails?), but now I'm veering off-topic again. Imagine a base-camp you could just bring with you, like a combination 'Inn', stables, supply depot, etc.*
So to bring this back around to SJ-ing at least, what if Dwarven Citadels are actually built on Earth-motes?
*EDIT:
On the other hand, I suppose a large enough SJ craft (or even a normal 'skyship') would make an excellent base as well. I would imagine you'd definitely need some sort of 'cloaking device' for it, because the first time the party went delving deep into a dungeon, someone would come along and steal the thing. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 06 Oct 2017 : 12:09:49
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
Thayan illusion can be used to produce a "cloaking device". Thayan bombards, hurling missiles with "alchemical fire" instead of giff smokepowder, could (at least they would hope) be fired through openings in the crystal sphere at vessels still located within the volatile phlogiston. Perhaps they plan to blockade Realmspace, seize vessels (to build an interplanetary or interstellar armada, crewed by undead) or seize cargos (to make themselves and their nation richer). Perhaps they experiment with magical bindings and Red Magic tattooes on captured "organic" ships.
I imagine that if the Red Wizards are active in Realmspace then they could indeed be a potent and serious threat to everyone else. Except for their typical lack of unified focus, their own plots and schemes turning self-destructively inward. An alliance with some other species - neogis, giths, beholders, illithids - could benefit the "Redjammers" greatly.
I've personally got an alliance going in this, a secret one (though I've announced it here previously) with a secretive people, and their plans (prior to the spellplague that is) were to work against the other spelljamming cultures of Toril in secret, seize as many helms as they could, and thus become the preeminent spelljamming people of Toril (they had not even begun to consider other planetary issues, much less other crystal spheres or planes).... then the spellplague happened. As another spin on all this, the Zulkir involved wasn't necessarily keeping the other Zulkirs aware of her involvement with spelljamming, and with the aid of Samas Kul, was hiding the stealing of funds to build the handful of Quads (and in fact, some Zulkirs prior to the spellplague still didn't even know of its existence.... just because your an archmage shared ruler in a magocracy doesn't mean you know all the universe's secrets). |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 06 Oct 2017 : 10:04:18
Redjammers, I like that one.  |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 06 Oct 2017 : 06:48:01
Thayan illusion can be used to produce a "cloaking device". Thayan bombards, hurling missiles with "alchemical fire" instead of giff smokepowder, could (at least they would hope) be fired through openings in the crystal sphere at vessels still located within the volatile phlogiston. Perhaps they plan to blockade Realmspace, seize vessels (to build an interplanetary or interstellar armada, crewed by undead) or seize cargos (to make themselves and their nation richer). Perhaps they experiment with magical bindings and Red Magic tattooes on captured "organic" ships.
I imagine that if the Red Wizards are active in Realmspace then they could indeed be a potent and serious threat to everyone else. Except for their typical lack of unified focus, their own plots and schemes turning self-destructively inward. An alliance with some other species - neogis, giths, beholders, illithids - could benefit the "Redjammers" greatly. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 06 Oct 2017 : 03:56:42
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
And just to try and steer the topic kind of back as well.... hmmmm, spelljaming Thayan colleges..... might be interesting to have portals from the floating enclave I'm figuring in orbit forporting students to another local tear of Selune for the express purpose of hurling magic in a safe environment. Picturing this one little asteroid full of blast marks.
I'd expect them to go for something further afield, myself... Maybe a random asteroid or something, at a Lagrange point or maybe in its own solitary orbit. Something like that, they don't have any neighbors to worry about accidently blasting, no one sticking noses into Thayan business, and there would be a far greater degree of autonomy and secrecy. It would also serve as a better port for their ships, for the same reasons. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 05 Oct 2017 : 23:48:06
And just to try and steer the topic kind of back as well.... hmmmm, spelljaming Thayan colleges..... might be interesting to have portals from the floating enclave I'm figuring in orbit forporting students to another local tear of Selune for the express purpose of hurling magic in a safe environment. Picturing this one little asteroid full of blast marks. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 05 Oct 2017 : 23:41:28
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Not sure how my discussion in the other (also inappropriate) thread migrated to this one,
Lol, I just realized it too when I logged in..... man, I need sleep. |
| Markustay |
Posted - 05 Oct 2017 : 18:13:10
Not sure how my discussion in the other (also inappropriate) thread migrated to this one, but to roll with it: My idea for that Dmitra Flass clone (and I am still toying with the very icky notion that it could very well be her own daughter... she wasn't exactly a saint) is that it would age and grow normally, not 'magically' (so no 'a20 days' thing), and the reasoning behind that is that Szass Tam would be looking for precisely that type (normal Clone spell) of contingency among his enemies (and by 'enemy', I mean every single living being in the universe who does not accept his will or authority over them).
So it is either "a clone thats not a clone" (grown at the normal rate, like a normal child), or is another child she can takeover at a certain time. That was my thinking, just for 'story purposes'.
HOWEVER, now that you've brought it to my attention a clone can be made to be younger, how about this - She DID do the 'normal clone' thing, just before the events of book II of the Haunted Lands, which I guesstimate took about a month (and if it did take longer, she could have started the process at any time during the novel, when she was off-camera). In fact, it even makes a lot of sense for having done so (it began to look like they could lose at that point). Then the Spellplague hits, and other stuff happens (probably too late for me to even be worrying about spoilers, but still...), and the rolling waves of 'Cerulean Energy' touch the growing clone and halt its progress. Now, you can say it went to Abier (your preference, Sleyvas), or you could say it was just hold-up in some cave or sme-such (my preference), or perhaps even hidden somewhere in Mulmaster, and for whatever reason, it was 'stuck', along with the magic that should have transferred Dmitra to it. Then Ao hits the big ol' RESET button, and she wakes... in an unfinished body (girl of about seven, or so).
Thing is, she still knows what she knows, and although she may have to practice her hand-signs... errr.. somatic components.. because of 'muscle memory', she still knows everything she knew (this was more of a mind-transference than a normal clone). The other caveat is that since she is in a new, young body, she wouldn't have acquired the stamina it would have taken her years to develop (since we don't have 'spell pts.', we'd have to represent this through some other means). Basically, she knows the spell, and can cast most of them with some practice, but she gets extremely tired very fast... she could never keep-up with an adult caster, even if they were of a lower class than her.
The funny thing is, that whole scenario works much better with the stamina system I came up with for magic (spells cost 1HP per spell level +1) - we need a way to simulate getting tired from over-casting (in my system, everyone got a D10 HP; barbarians got dam. reduction and fighters have much better means to 'protect' their HP).
And since we went WAY off-topic now, I'll try to steer this back just a little: Back when I use to hangout at the local SUNY campus (in HS - the game store I went to was right next to the college campus and I use to stay in the dorms with my college friends over the weekends), the campus dorms were all referred to as 'quads'. I don't know if that's standard for universities, or just SUNY Stonybrook, but now every time I read this thread title, my mind automatically thinks 'Dorms of Thay', and I start thinking about Thayan magical colleges... perhaps as an extension of Thay Enclaves (so, outside of Thay).
Like I said... not really on topic, but sort of related via the name.  |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 05 Oct 2017 : 14:01:58
TSR actually shied away from such things, back in the day... From an older Ed response:
quote:
Hello again, all.
Markustay, what SORT (wink, giggle) of comment were you looking for, re. “Raw Ed”? After all these years, I can make SO many . . .
And yes, Ed did create archliches for LOST SHIPS (after obtaining design approval from the TSR designers of the day to include a “good lich” in the game, to support some good or at least benign to PCs liches that had appeared in fiction and game products).
As for this comment, from Wooly Rupert: “I've always thought the deliberate embrace of undeath was a bit of an odd option for cheating death. One idea I've always preferred was for a mage to transfer his consciousness into a specially-prepared automaton. The end result (no longer worrying about death, aging, and other physical frailities) is the same, plus the automaton body would be more durable, nicer to look at, and wouldn't be physically rotting away. I know if I wanted to last a few more centuries, I'd choose an option where my fingers falling off wouldn't be a concern...”
. . . Ed has a response, as follows:
I see nothing at all wrong with your reasoning, Wooly, and although Newt Ewell specifically asked me to add a brief “drow biomech” section to the original (2nd Ed) DROW OF THE UNDERDARK, the “official but secret” design directives of the time were to avoid all “android and robot” flavouring in AD&D® because TSR was planning a robot roleplaying game, PROTON FIRE. Longtime DRAGON® readers may recall that it was featured in the back pages of just one issue of the magazine, as a preview; the game was “killed” on the very brink of its release by TSR’s upper management. So, just like de-emphasizing psionics in the Realms because they were to be a cornerstone of Dark Sun®, we were told to avoid mechanical/robotic/android/bionic elements for the AD&D® game. THAT’S why the embrace of undeath rather than the “build your own new body.”
As for the alternative “clone or birth your own new body and then move into it” approach, THAT ran afoul of the internal Code of Ethics, TSR wanting to avoid further trouble with the religious Moral Majority stances of the day. For years - - as various Realms NPCs have aged - - I have flirted and toyed in my Realms fiction with exploring the ethical choices they make about how to prolong life (for those who wish to do so). I plan, editors willing, to do more of that in future fiction.
So saith Ed. Illuminating the design backrooms of the Realms and D&D® for us all.
love,
THO
|
| Ayrik |
Posted - 05 Oct 2017 : 13:22:22
Magical transference/possession has been around since 1E, along with clones and ways of avoiding magical aging (or at least ways of imposing the burden onto somebody else). Although these methods typically boiled down to stealing life (usually against the victim's/subject's will, of course), so they were decidedly evil, blood relation or not. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 05 Oct 2017 : 13:15:18
BTW, in 5e, the idea of mages transferring themselves to a younger body isn't that much of a problem to tell the truth. Granted that's 5e and not 3.5e. So, 3.5e might have required a blood relation, possibly even a child, as you were describing, which makes it more nefarious. From the 5e player's handbook on the Clone spell entry below
This spell grows an inert duplicate of a living creature as a safeguard against death. This clone forms inside a sealed vessel and grows to full size and maturity after 120 days; you can also choose to have the clone be a younger version of the same creature. It remains inert and endures indefinitely, as long as its vessel remains undisturbed. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 04 Oct 2017 : 17:53:04
The old Forgotten Realms Adventures doesn't definitively say they exist, but it does say dead magic areas can exist in Realmspace. The Realmspace book mentions some dead magic "sargassos" around the sun, but these do not function quite the same way a regular dead magic area does, especially with regards to what FRA says about dead magic areas and spelljamming helms.
Personally, I'd say that the dead and wild magic areas in the Realms are from the avatars being there, on Toril, and that both types of area would be rare to non-existent anywhere in Realmspace aside from Toril.
But that's just my thinking, with nothing official to back it up aside from the lack of mention of such areas in Realmspace. And as a further caveat, I'll further note that given how problematic and downright incorrect some of the Toril-specific info in Realmspace is, I don't consider that to be Realms canon. It is, officially, so far as I know, Realms canon, but it is my opinion that it should not be. At least the Toril-specific info, and maybe the Selûne info, as well. The rest of the book is fine -- it's just the Toril stuff that's really disconnected from Realmslore. |
| Markustay |
Posted - 04 Oct 2017 : 17:29:18
Artifacts are NOT constrained to the spheres they are 'born' in. Some may be more likely to reappear elsewhere on the same world, but I would say they are far more likely to appear on another well-populated (typical fantasy) world in another sphere, then some 'dead' planet within the same sphere. Artifacts are , by their very nature, meant to 'appear' and cause problems (cursed or no - wars get fought over these things).
In fact (I just had an epiphany), I would say that perhaps they somehow get possessed or maybe 'controlled' (to a degree) by trickster gods, since they do have a capricious nature, whether intended or not. Maybe in the great 'divine scheme of things' thats actually the one important thing trickster gods are responsible for - keep the artifacts moving around. It could be an interesting 'deep secret' of D&D, in that anyone who discovers this may be able to influence how and when such things appear (I'm thinking about that new AP right now - the one with all the trickster gods... could there be a reason they were all gathered together?)
The Crown of Horns is an artifact now - could be Myrkul was turning into such a 'trickster vestige', until Ao forced him back out of there.
Also, they could be one good reason why some entities become multi-spheric. Would most of the crystal spheres even know about Vecna, if not for his hand and Eye? Think about it - if demi-power or even a full Power were to put some of its energy into a relic/artifact, and then 'sent it about the cosmos', it would slowly spread knowledge of the being through its existence. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 04 Oct 2017 : 12:56:27
Oh, and the galleon nebula does possess wild magic. The color spray nebula can drain magic items (also can cure sickness or cause disease).
Also, in regards the previous post, there's also "the Seed Beholder Company" which cares for newborn beholders for the various beholder groups until they become viable (which is a very short term, like a month). I'd bet they are selling some of these on the sly to the illithids out at the "Skull of the Void" and claiming that the offspring died (even if its less than 1%). |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 04 Oct 2017 : 12:47:52
Hmmm, so in reading realmspace to see if there are any magic dead/wild magic areas, just because I was as curious as Ayrik, I come across the "Skull of the Void". The "Skull of the Void" is a 12 mile high, 10 mile wide human skull that sits WAAAAYYYYY past all the planets in a stationary spot just 50 million miles from the crystal sphere (for comparison sakes, this is 3,150 million miles from the sun, and the closest planet is 1,550 million miles from it). Anyway, this giant human skull is filled with illithids who have captured around a hundred beholders and have been experimenting with them. I'd imagine that the new "mindwitness" from VGtMonsters originated with this colony. Anyway, so this colony has been experimenting with beholder brains to breed the ultimate beholder brain, but they've also been consuming beholder brains. This has resulted in these illithids gaining levitation, which is genetic and passed to offspring even if they haven't consumed illithid brains (and ironically causes other illithids to have animosity towards these illithids that are different... kind of like beholders of different types). Anyway, it says that these are the only things developed so far. So, that brings me to the point of this. Its now 130+ years later. Might there be some other genetic modifications? Perhaps a pair of extra "mouth tentacles" that actually are eyestalks? Perhaps a central third eye? Maybe their regular eyes are on stalks/antennae now? This might not all be from consuming brains, but may actually have come from grafting of sorts that has possibly bred true. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 04 Oct 2017 : 04:23:10
Some artifacts are not "indestructible" in the usual sense. Some can suffer physical destruction, sometimes without much extraordinary effort, yet they somehow manage to reform or reappear somewhere else. Nether scrolls are a fine example, some of them have been burned, melted, or pounded into chunks of gold before, always to eventually be found (perfectly intact) somewhere else.
Artifurnaces might be named more metaphorically. I don't see any requirement for them to be actual furnaces which consume fuel through heat and flame. They might "burn" magical dweomers in some other sense. It makes me wonder if purely magical flames (faerie fire, darkfire, etc) would ignite phlogiston. I suppose, too, that an "indestructible" item would be made of "indestructible" materials, so it could be a lot easier to engineer seals and fixtures and chambers and conduits which never leak or fail. Compare to nuclear engines ("nuclear furnaces") we can make, their "fire" and power outputs are carefully controlled, with tons of redundant safeties, accidents happen and toxic waste is a byproduct, but overall they're entirely sealed and isolated systems which can operate "safely" in almost any environment (including outer space).
Are there any dead-magic or wild-magic zones in Realmspace? In any other spheres? |
| nblanton |
Posted - 04 Oct 2017 : 02:06:09
I just checked my copy of The Concordance of Arcane Space regarding the artifurnace and one other thing about it is that the artifurnace and its associated artifact are indestructible while the two are together. Also, removal of the artifact destroys the artifurnace.
No mention of fire damage from use in the phlogiston, so my thoughts are they aren't like typical furnaces. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 01 Oct 2017 : 23:55:46
Wait! What?
Spelljamming helms/engines constrained to a single sphere? I'd forgotten that detail. Wildspace can offer endless adventure in itself. But being unable to go beyond the sphere seems to largely defeat the grandest purpose for installing such a device. But I suppose you do what you gotta do and adventurers can't always be picky.
It makes sense for most artifacts to be anchored within a given sphere, anyhow, since they're strongly tied to their histories and deities and whatnot. I'm sure that many exist which have less specific and more global scope, especially the (few) artifacts unique to the Spelljammer setting, and artifurnaces unique to these (which are capable of travelling through the Flow) must surely exist. |
| TBeholder |
Posted - 01 Oct 2017 : 23:31:28
quote:
Originally posted by nblanton
Well, there was the artifurnace, which is pretty much the best helm in the game.
IIRC there were different answers as to whether it's possible to use in the Flow, or will it just go kaboom like a common furnace, continuously until the artifurnace breaks aart and only the artifact will be left.
Of course, "no Flow travel" also means that this artifact won't leave the sphere where the parties aware of its existence and interested in it live (or un-live).
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
All the drawbacks with only half the paperwork!
"All the drawbacks" would include things like artifact transformation. With artifurnace, the artifact doesn't even keep the furnace operator (let alone the whole vessel) cursed. Almost boring. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 01 Oct 2017 : 04:57:21
All the drawbacks with only half the paperwork! |
| nblanton |
Posted - 01 Oct 2017 : 04:31:32
The artifurnace was a good way to introduce an artifact into the campaign mcguffin style. No worries about having to deal with the actual use of the artifact, but have some group to want it back. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 28 Sep 2017 : 05:11:32
Each arti-furnace is uniquely designed for a particular artifact, although it's reasonable to assume it has at least partial compatibility with other (similar) artifacts.
An arti-furnace is a magical item/construct (and a sort of "helm") so modifying it is not impossible, only "difficult" and "risky". |
| Markustay |
Posted - 28 Sep 2017 : 04:54:12
I thought an artifurnace could use any artifact?
I didn't know each one had to be custom-made.
People need to start chopping more parts off Vecna. |
| nblanton |
Posted - 28 Sep 2017 : 04:35:29
Well, there was the artifurnace, which is pretty much the best helm in the game.
You just had to have the artifurnace crafted specifically for the artifact that it was going to hold. Basically becoming an artifact itself. |
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