| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Brian R. James |
Posted - 06 Aug 2009 : 21:25:06
http://ww2.wizards.com/Company/Press/
http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1228916 |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Asgetrion |
Posted - 16 Oct 2009 : 15:09:50
quote:
Originally posted by Ayunken-vanzan
A fellow librarian, even if he is from Cheliax, is always good news.
Fair points, but if WotC decides to sue Candlekeep I don't think that Candlekeep has the means and the money to stand through the whole trial, so WotC would win the case even if they would not win the case normally because they are the bigger ones and have the money to send their adversaries into ruin.
Ah, but if we only had the Asmodean Disciples and a contingent of Hellknights to rely on, all the answers to this dilemma would be obvious! In fact, we could ignore the whole mess about Intellectual Property...  
What you say is, sadly, true; it doesn't matter if Candlekeep has actually violated any IP laws or not... WoTC/Hasbro has enough funds to prolong the process so long that it's just not worth the fight. I also suspect that US legal processes work a bit differently than they do over here -- for example, we have an Intellectual Property Council which often issues statements in such cases; they're legally non-binding, but still often considered "official rulings" in the court (so you could practically win a case by obtaining a positive statement; it would not *guarantee* that you win, but *most* judges would likely abide by the IP Council's decision). |
| Ayunken-vanzan |
Posted - 16 Oct 2009 : 14:27:48
A fellow librarian, even if he is from Cheliax, is always good news.
Fair points, but if WotC decides to sue Candlekeep I don't think that Candlekeep has the means and the money to stand through the whole trial, so WotC would win the case even if they would not win the case normally because they are the bigger ones and have the money to send their adversaries into ruin. |
| Asgetrion |
Posted - 16 Oct 2009 : 11:38:28
Disclaimer: I'm a librarian, not an IP lawyer; I know something about European and Scandinavian IP laws, but I'm not exactly an expert in legal matters.
I'm not sure about IP laws in the States, but in my own country the case of Candlekeep would fall under "silent agreement" (not sure if that is the exact legal term in English), i.e. WoTC has been aware of the site for years, and yet has not taken any action (has not sued Candlekeep or issued a CoD-letter or any sort of warning). This means they've got no legal rights to claim for any sort of compensation or misuse for the way their IP has been handled here during these years. Now, if the company policy changes, I think the law requires that said policy should be freely available to all parties it involves, or it does not have any legal power over them (i.e. we couldn't suddenly rewrite our library user agreement and retroactively apply it to our patrons, claiming it was done two years ago but we just forgot/decided not to publish it).
So, until they publish a new fan site policy, I don't think anything has changed. They've given their silent agreement to the way Candlekeep and the posters here have treated their IP. When they publish a new fan site policy, it's another matter; IP laws concerning internet and digital content are sorely outdated. Still, I think we should be pretty safe if we rely on short citations and always remember to mention the source (it falls under citation rights, I think) -- even when writing articles for Candlekeep Compendium.
A short summary: as long as Candlekeep doesn't have to sign some sort of fan site policy agreement with WoTC, or as long as WoTC hasn't publicized a fan site policy which explicitly forbids use of their IP, we do not need to worry. Even if they did the latter, I think we could use citations and references to FR lore as long as there's no profit or money-making involved (and there isn't). We could even use stat blocks for new NPCs or monsters in the Compendium. As long as Candlekeep stays away from referencing or citing 4E books or lore in the Compendium, and sticks with OGL, it should be safe.
Now, take all that with a grain of salt; it's just my interpretation of the situation, and as I said, I'm a librarian whose meager (read: "the stuff we need to know in public libraries") knowledge of IP laws is limited to Europe and Scandinavia (and IP laws vary from country to country even here). If I were Alaundo, I might approach WIPO (the World Intellectual Property Organization) about these matters. |
| Sandro |
Posted - 16 Oct 2009 : 11:24:22
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
Maybe we will just have to wait until the first legal conflict starts, so that some sort of limits will have to be drawn.
Yes, but let's make sure that we're not the target in that... circus. |
| Jorkens |
Posted - 16 Oct 2009 : 09:33:50
Maybe we will just have to wait until the first legal conflict starts, so that some sort of limits will have to be drawn. |
| Ayunken-vanzan |
Posted - 15 Oct 2009 : 21:11:50
Now that also Scott Rouse has left WotC, I don't think that anything further substantial will come in regard to Fansites. Both people who where the driving force for releasing a GSL/Fansite Policy are no more - I would be surprised if there is anyone upholding their legacy. |
| Ashe Ravenheart |
Posted - 15 Oct 2009 : 20:34:52
An update (of sorts) to the Fan Site policy, thanks to Critical Hits.com:
Wizards response to some Blogger's concerns re: Fansite Kit Policy |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 15:02:57
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Quale
About the Compendium, sure if I come up with a worthwhile material, hope you have a good editor, like LK did with my few EoF articles.
Good editors? Yes, we do. And Wooly as well. 
Gee, thanks! |
| The Sage |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 13:11:57
quote:
Originally posted by Quale
About the Compendium, sure if I come up with a worthwhile material, hope you have a good editor, like LK did with my few EoF articles.
Good editors? Yes, we do. And Wooly as well.
|
| Quale |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 12:27:12
I see your point.
Maybe the ''pressure messages'' shouldn't mention Candlekeep, but be like a front, or hypothethical.
About the Compendium, sure if I come up with a worthwhile material, hope you have a good editor, like LK did with my few EoF articles. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 29 Sep 2009 : 00:52:06
quote:
Originally posted by Quale
Just stayed silent, from multiple sources, even saying ''Sorry, I can't answer that'' would have been better.
Maybe they are still deliberating. 
To be fair, there's about a decade or so of history regarding the use of the Forgotten Realms IP across the internet. So I'd imagine it's not simply a situation where WotC can issue a blanket declaration for how FR content can be used by non-Wizards sites on the web. There are many sites that offer tricky paths of legality that Wizards must work through. Like Candlekeep, for example, with our range of contributing FR authors and game designers.
So, at this point, I'm still willing to give WotC the benefit of some doubt, and appreciate that this isn't something that can be handled without a great deal of forethought, first.
quote:
Maybe more people should ask to generate some pressure.
Just so long as they're friendly messages and such. I wouldn't in any way advocate that scribes from Candlekeep start deliberately applying pressure to Wizards legal department, as that could potentially reflect badly on us later.
quote:
Just saying, I wasn't a contributive member, my english is pretty basic, but I enjoyed the Compendium.
If and when the Compendium is re-issued, you, perhaps, should consider about contributing. We're always on the lookout for new and future scribes.
|
| SeeDiGi |
Posted - 28 Sep 2009 : 20:57:51
quote:
Originally posted by Quale
Just stayed silent, from multiple sources, even saying ''Sorry, I can't answer that'' would have been better.
Maybe they are still deliberating.
Maybe more people should ask to generate some pressure.
Just saying, I wasn't a contributive member, my english is pretty basic, but I enjoyed the Compendium.
Even wonder if there would be enough enthusiasm for a new one considering what happened last two years. Particularly at wotc forums a lot of people lost interest and left. Weird that now there's so much freedom for the DMs with the new Realms, lol.
Lets hope
Thats what I was thinking too. Its like okay theres all this new stuff and la la la but theres hardly anyone around anymore who always talked and contributed and wrote and mapped and so on anymore. |
| Quale |
Posted - 28 Sep 2009 : 19:22:38
Just stayed silent, from multiple sources, even saying ''Sorry, I can't answer that'' would have been better.
Maybe they are still deliberating.
Maybe more people should ask to generate some pressure.
Just saying, I wasn't a contributive member, my english is pretty basic, but I enjoyed the Compendium.
Even wonder if there would be enough enthusiasm for a new one considering what happened last two years. Particularly at wotc forums a lot of people lost interest and left. Weird that now there's so much freedom for the DMs with the new Realms, lol.
Lets hope |
| arry |
Posted - 28 Sep 2009 : 11:49:29
Quale, when you asked did the staff say that they couldn't say anything, or did they just stay silent, ignore you or what?
Whatever the answer that is very depressing news. Looks like it's the end of the line for the Compendium 
Thank you esteemed Wizards of the Coast and goodnight  |
| Quale |
Posted - 28 Sep 2009 : 10:10:36
I asked some of the wotc staff, no answer. Most likely that's on purpose. Other people from wotc forums asked the customer service, the same thing, they were ignored for months.
I'm through with wotc.
Paizo is a great place. |
| Thieran |
Posted - 14 Sep 2009 : 20:41:05
Thanks!
Have any of the other scribes had the opportunity to ask Wizards staff directly during GenCon? |
| The Sage |
Posted - 14 Sep 2009 : 14:28:59
Nothing, really. And I've been keeping an eye out for any pertinent news related to the Fan Site Policy.
|
| Thieran |
Posted - 14 Sep 2009 : 10:33:59
Any news on the topic? |
| Jakk |
Posted - 01 Sep 2009 : 02:27:30
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
Markus I for one would like to see you stay around here and there.
As would I.
Anyway, back to topic... I don't have anything to add, except that it will be interesting to see if the policy gets clarified and/or changed in other ways in the near future...  |
| The Sage |
Posted - 01 Sep 2009 : 00:39:24
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Like I said... MANY factors involved here; I didn't make this decision lightly.
Regardless of your ultimate decision Markus, know that you'll always be welcome here at Candlekeep. |
| Brimstone |
Posted - 31 Aug 2009 : 21:21:18
Markus I for one would like to see you stay around here and there.
Jakk your FR Clone Wars made me LOL!
Jakk have you read Sentinelspire by Mark Sehestedt? I was thinking about using that as a possible agent of change in my Realms.
Think of a disaster like a Meteor hitting Toril, and devestating Faerun, causing the survivors to flee to Maztica, Evermeet, amd Anchornome(I probably miss spelled it).
On topic I know Quale has posted a question To Rich B on the Wizards Forums. |
| Jakk |
Posted - 31 Aug 2009 : 20:56:09
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
There's no need to leave... Just pick a timeframe and stay there, like many of us have.
I agree... but I've taken a slightly more radical path. I'm doing a "virtual reset" back to the FR Clone Wars (yes, the Manshoon Wars) and expanding on that, then moving forward event-by-event from there, throwing out or changing what I don't like and keeping what I do. It's much less time-consuming than creating my own world as detailed as the Realms, and it's what Ed has told us to do from Day 1. Canon is a tool, not a straitjacket. There will still be a Spellplague in my Realms in 1385  but it's not going to affect the geography or the wizard/sorcerer population any more severely than did the ToT. I expect to be 95% consistent with canon up to this point. I'm also advancing the timeline, but only by 25 years; Year 1 of my new campaign will be 1400DR, the Year of Lost Ships, and the ships in question are those carrying the refugees from the colonies in the former Maztica (whose natives have been entirely wiped out by plague or slain in failed uprisings against the colonists; either way, the Mesoamerican analogues are just as dead as the Egyptian and Babylonian analogues of Mulhorand and Unther, whose lands have been overrun by Thay and the Tchazzar-reunited Chessenta). There's lots going on in the Realms as I see it, and earthmotes and plaguelands don't enter into it. 
Edit: And I second Hawkins' sentiment, just for the record. 
Second edit: Re: Brimstone:
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
Plus using the Forgotten Realms Logo could prove to be a problem now. Scribes would have to stop calling the 4E Realms "Shattered", or "Sellplagued" because to would be negative towards WOTC and their products, because the site would or could possibly have an "Official WOTC Logo". Cant go and confuse the new players.
That's interesting that CK might be prohibited from using the FR logo on those grounds... seeing as Wizbro isn't using the FR logo themselves except on novels...  |
| Hawkins |
Posted - 31 Aug 2009 : 20:55:43
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Without going into a whole lot of detail, I will probably be leaving the Realms altogether, due to many factors, some of which involve my personal life (I really need to get an income again...)
Mostly, though, its 'cause I just don't feel 'at home' in the Realms anymore. In the past month, I have read three fairly recent FR novels, and only the RAS one appealed to me...
And that one took place in 3e - VERY telling.
The fansite policy and my inability to register at WotC's new forums are just a couple of other more recent things that have tipped my fence-sitting past the breaking point.
Like I said... MANY factors involved here; I didn't make this decision lightly.
Just to make sure you realize this, you WILL be sorely missed. I am sure many of us here would appreciate if you came by the 'Keep occasionally to say "hi". |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 31 Aug 2009 : 19:40:16
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Without going into a whole lot of detail, I will probably be leaving the Realms altogether, due to many factors, some of which involve my personal life (I really need to get an income again...)
Mostly, though, its 'cause I just don't feel 'at home' in the Realms anymore. In the past month, I have read three fairly recent FR novels, and only the RAS one appealed to me...
And that one took place in 3e - VERY telling.
The fansite policy and my inability to register at WotC's new forums are just a couple of other more recent things that have tipped my fence-sitting past the breaking point.
Like I said... MANY factors involved here; I didn't make this decision lightly.
There's no need to leave... Just pick a timeframe and stay there, like many of us have. |
| Markustay |
Posted - 31 Aug 2009 : 17:22:24
Without going into a whole lot of detail, I will probably be leaving the Realms altogether, due to many factors, some of which involve my personal life (I really need to get an income again...)
Mostly, though, its 'cause I just don't feel 'at home' in the Realms anymore. In the past month, I have read three fairly recent FR novels, and only the RAS one appealed to me...
And that one took place in 3e - VERY telling.
The fansite policy and my inability to register at WotC's new forums are just a couple of other more recent things that have tipped my fence-sitting past the breaking point.
Like I said... MANY factors involved here; I didn't make this decision lightly. |
| Jorkens |
Posted - 31 Aug 2009 : 16:13:43
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
With NO new lore coming out about the real Realms, No ONE wins...
AS far as I'm concerned, the party is over.
I suggest anyone who hasn't downloaded my maps yet please do so now; I will be removing them all at some point in the near future (before I'm ordered to).
So are you quitting the realms all together or just cutting back on the map-making? |
| Markustay |
Posted - 31 Aug 2009 : 02:52:42
While the pragmatist in me realizes this is the perfect opportunity for me to 'jump ship' and just forget about all the unfinished FR maps I have, the 'anal-retentive' part of me (the dominant part) loathes the idea of all that work going to waste.
We'll see...
Give me a week or so to mull things over... I really hate leaving the 98% complete K-T one unfinished.
I spent the last month hammering-out the details for my own world and site (which is indirectly why I haven't been around), and I'm really gung-ho about that, but FR is... well... The Realms.
Its hard to just forget about it, ya' know?
We'll see...
|
| Jakk |
Posted - 30 Aug 2009 : 23:57:03
Markustay... I'm guessing you've abandoned the Realms map then... or are you still planning to finish the mostly-done one? |
| Brimstone |
Posted - 30 Aug 2009 : 22:42:26
Edition Neutral sounds good to me. |
| Markustay |
Posted - 30 Aug 2009 : 18:07:49
Just from DeviantART.
CK may host them as long as they like. I just don't want to wait until I get a "Cease and Desist", which is bound to happen, considering certain wording in the policy.
Other people's maps are unlikely to have that problem - my desire to keep them as close to the official ones in appearnce as possible is now working against me.
I figure I'll pull the stuff off Deviant at the end of September - I plan on replacing them all with maps of my own world...
Which will be a FREE RPG campaign setting ready-to-use for any ruleset/edition.
All WotC did was move my timetable forward. |
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