| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Jakk |
Posted - 17 Sep 2008 : 20:17:41
George, this might be your specialty, or at least geographically close to it. I have something of a Moebius timeline for humans in the Vast. In 645, humans begin making their first permanent settlements in the Vast (shortly before the fall of Roldilar to the Vastar orcs), but around -200 the first Dalesmen arrive from "across the Dragon Reach" (which, one assumes, means "the Vast"... because even Procampur and Tsurlagol weren't founded until the -140s. Unless I have a *serious* typo in my timeline source data... or the humans came from somewhere more distant, and just crossed the Dragon reach in their migrations. The 645 date isn't in the GHotR, but the same volume says that "Humans remain in the Vast and fight the orcs to retain their new homes" in 649. Given that the foundations of the kingdom of Old Impiltur are established in -135, I'm questioning the -200 date more strongly, but all dates cited above are from the GHotR. Thanks for your help! |
| 4 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Jakk |
Posted - 22 Sep 2008 : 00:20:06
No *real* resolutions in the Ravens Bluff PDF; maybe I just need to re-read it a couple more times.  I hate reading on the computer, and my printer's acting up.  Anyway, thanks to PDK and George for the assistance, and I should be able to extrapolate the dates I'm looking for.
PDK: Sorry about missing you when handing out the thanks earlier.
It seems like every answer I find reveals two more questions... it's *almost* enough to make me stop looking for answers, but I like questions too.  |
| Jakk |
Posted - 18 Sep 2008 : 02:11:41
Thanks for the advice, George! I don't have FRA immediately available to me, however; what kind of historical data was in there? (It's been almost three years since I last opened that book.)
The numbers still aren't adding up for me; I have -153 and -147 as the founding dates for Proeskampalar and Chessagol respectively, renamed in -72 and 533 respectively. This has them founded 50 years (plus or minus 3 years) after the first Dalesmen were supposed to have arrived from there, unless I have some dates wrong; I can't confirm the renaming dates in the GHotR, but the founding dates are confirmed in that source.
I'll check out that Raven's Bluff PDF and see if that resolves my dilemma. Thanks for your help. |
| George Krashos |
Posted - 18 Sep 2008 : 00:32:04
Your answer revolves around the Earthfast Mountains. As PDK points out, the history particular to the settlement of Raven's Bluff and where its settlers came from is detailed in the accessory devoted to that place.
My writings have tended to show a trend of human settlment is stronger and longer in the area south of those mountains (i.e. present-day Procampur and Tsurlagol [formerly Chessagol]) with the support, influence and on at least 3 separate occasions, outright hegemony, of Impiltur. Procampur in its first incarnation as a dwarven city, then a dwarven/human hybrid settlement and then a mostly humans settlement is the earliest evidence of human settlement in this region. I've always chosen the place as the embarkation point for the -200 DR crossings to the Dalelands.
North of the Earthfast mountains we've had an elven presence for a long, long time (Ylraphon for example) and orcs - tons of them. Major human settlement in this area prior to Raven's Bluff has IMO been sporadic and short-lived. The 'Forgotten Realms Adventures' 2E hardcover has some small snippets of history for Calaunt and Tantras, but these haven't been fleshed out much.
It's a fairly blank canvas but my view would be that the historical development of that region shouldn't be "forced". By that I mean that it's okay to show many, many attempts at human settlement of this region as the elven and dwarven presence declines over the centuries but there is no need to equate those attempts with grand empires, large cities or significant populations. In other words there are likely a dozen or so failed attempts at human settlement of the areas of the Vast north (and south - but to a lesser degree) of the Earthfast Mountains.
It's a place I've been keen to develop historically but other projects have taken precedence. Have fun with it!
-- George Krashos
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| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 17 Sep 2008 : 22:06:39
Not George, but all your answers are in the "City of Raven's Bluff" free WotC download:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/2/fr_downloads/tsr9575.zip
Cheers! |
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