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 Blackstaff: Chapters 18 - 27

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T O P I C    R E V I E W
Alaundo Posted - 01 Jul 2006 : 23:52:08
Well met

This is a Book Club thread for Blackstaff(Book 1 of The Wizards series), by Steven Schend. Please discuss chapters 18 - 27 herein.

Steven Schend will be here to answer any questions and respond to comments
30   L A T E S T    R E P L I E S    (Newest First)
Rowan Posted - 22 Mar 2007 : 18:05:55
I don't think Blackstaff is really, truly Azoun IV-type dead. He most likely saw this coming decades ago and prepared for it, maybe even pulled a Manshoon.

My money would be on him being discovered as an amnesiac beggar in Cormyr months after the end of the book.

;)
Kyrene Posted - 06 Mar 2007 : 05:21:58
quote:
Originally posted by initiate

I notice that we're discussing this in the "Chapter 18 27" thread rather than the "Chapter 28 40" book club for some reason. Thus, there are some spoilers contained herein.

To use the vernacular: "My Bad!"

I was desperately looking for http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=7224, but somehow missed it, and forgot to use the search function...

Ye gods was it really 40 chapters worth...
Kyrene Posted - 06 Mar 2007 : 05:17:48
Edit: I know it is extremely bad netiquette to edit a post after the fact, when that editing removes the whole content. I should not have risen to KEJR's bait, and therefore feel I commit less of a netiquette breach by removing my response, than by leaving it here. My apologies to all who had their feathers ruffled by this response, and to KEJR in particular if anything I said offended him/her/it.

I thus let my original critique stand (or fall) on its own.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin Posted - 06 Mar 2007 : 03:11:17
Well, to be fair, "weird" and "stuff" are both formal and legitimate words, not slang (although I don't recall how they were used in the novel). Nevertheless I enjoyed your comments, initiate, and for the most part I agree with them.
initiate Posted - 06 Mar 2007 : 02:59:25
Kyrene talked about having problems with the many cameo appearances throughout "Blackstaff", which I find interesting because this was one of the things about which I was most concerned before picking up the book. This was not because I feared their use as "padding" as Kyrene puts it; (I am generally more concerned about Realms novels being by necessity to condensed as opposed to the reverse); but I thought the cameos might make the novel less accessible to me as a relative newcomer. I had huge, huge problems of this sort related to "Elminster in Hell" and several other novels. Perhaps I am now slightly more knowledgeable in Realmslore, or simply not as bothered, but I don't think that this book relies on references to older, less popularized lore to an extent which makes lack of knowledge crippling. I am unfamiliar, for instance, with the lore regarding Malchor Harpell and Gamalon of Tethyr, but I found that the author managed to weave their threads into the larger picture in such a way that full knowledge of their previous stories was a bonus rather than a necessity. Where I new the characters eluded to, (Sememmon and Ashemi, for instance), I took particular enjoyment in seeing them again, but when I did not, while it was a little bit frustrating, it didn't lessen my understanding of the here-and-now essential story. That being said, I think that this heavy use of some of the less well-known figures from Realmslore does give the novel greater significance for those long studied in the Realms than for those such as myself who are newer to the setting. Mr. Schend's relatively quick passage over many of the figures from lore prevents lack of knowledge thereof from derailing the story, but it also prevents us from growing to know them more than passing well within the context of the novel and that's a shame. Newer readers are sometimes unable to fully appreciate the depth and, in many cases, length of the stories which are enlarged and,/or concluded in the novel. It occurs to me that a glossary, (not an exhaustive one, just enough to be functional), of characters and events might have served the novel well but, hark ye to the editors' decree: a Realms novel may exceed 352 pages only once err every Shieldmeet, (or something of that sort.) A shame. Overall, while I sometimes wished for more detail in these cameo appearances, I would not have them other than how they are if changing them meant cutting material from the book. Much of "Blackstaff's charm, what makes it in my mind significant, is the extent to which it is rooted in Realmslore.

I really liked the book's plot, delighting in rather than being frustrated by the occasional difficulty in following its lore-rich story. I thought that the flashback sequences served Steven Schend particularly well as ways to slip in lore about Khelben's previous lives, and he managed to keep them remarkably tied to the central plot. Some of the events and revelations in the novel seemed somewhat sudden, (unlike the Rage of Dragons and Sarya Dlardrageth's feyri crusade, which were hinted at in the FRCS and Races of Faerun), but really slot into Realmslore very well in my humble opinion. I also found that things such as the nature of the Sharn and Miyeritar came as true revelations, rather than things heralded by former products. Like KEJR I don't agree that all RSEs are directly tied to Realms products, and it was nice to see some lore that is in all ways new mixed in. (It could be, of course, that I've just missed the relevant lore.)

Stylistically speaking, one thing that threw me off quite a bit the (very) few times it arose was the use of words that could be considered modern day colloquialisms like "weird" and particularly "stuff". It didn't happen often, and was pretty much confined to the dialogue of younger characters, so it could be passed over as the use of equivalent slang terms, but it certainly did disorient me. I just wasn't expecting it and thought it broke the tone of the book.

So there, after over a thousand words, I liked it. I didn't think it was perfect, but I certainly found it very enjoyable, and most definitely rich in lore.
initiate Posted - 06 Mar 2007 : 02:52:18
No tomato-hurling for me either, though I thought I'd add some ramblings as "Blackstaff" is in many ways such a significant book. Its been a few months since I read the novel, but I thought I might as well throw in my two cents, (or twenty-five, as the case may be), particularly in response to some of the points Kyrene raises above.

I notice that we're discussing this in the "Chapter 18 27" thread rather than the "Chapter 28 40" book club for some reason. Thus, there are some spoilers contained herein.

As to the main characters, I very much enjoyed the portrayal of Khelben, who is, after all, the focus of the novel. The book shows us several different aspects of the Blackstaff's multifaceted character, and Mr. Schend does this, to my mind at least, very well within such a limited space. Myself, I would have liked direct access to Khelben's thoughts beyond the flash-back sequences, but that's an authorial decision, and it does serve the purpose of keeping many of Khelben's actions suitably enigmatic. (What, after all, would the Blackstaff be without his secrets?) As to Khelben's fate, while it saddened me, I thought that it was handled extremely well, with the right mixture of tragedy and resignation and all that kind of stuff. I would have liked to see such a significant sacrifice dwelt on even a little more than it was, including more time spent with Laeral at the end of the book and, as others have mentioned, a chance to see Piergeiron's grief.

As for Tsarra, there are aspects of her character and the way its revealed that I liked allot. One of these is the author's repeated high-lighting of the ways in which she and Khelben are of like temperament. I did find her a little overly inclined to whine on occasion, but that's just my personal opinion, and she did have it pretty tough. However, (though I may be forgetting crucial details), it strikes me that in the grand scheme of things, beyond one or two vital actions, she didn't really do allot. She was an interesting character, and I enjoyed watching Khelben groom her as his apprentice and successor, but considering her role placing almost ninety percent of the narration of the story solely on her shoulders is an authorial decision that will work for some and not for others. As to her relationship with Rhaegar, I could see it developing over time, (thus becoming something to be expounded on in future stories about these characters), but as it is it seemed to just be there because its the kind of thing that happens in books. Speaking of Rhaegar, I didn't mind him, but thought that more space was needed to do him justice.

As for the villain, Priamon Rakesk, I have to agree with Rinnonalyrna Fathomlin that he wasn't the highlight of the novel for me, but I did find him interesting in so far as he was a former apprentice of the Blackstaff and is now the Frostrune of the Twisted Rune, an organization about which I know very little. He is certainly not an insignificant lich, as from what little I know the Twisted Rune is a relatively select group, and as KEJR pointed out, he did play a significant part in abducting Halaster Blackcloak, a wizard most certainly not to be messed around with. I could have done with a little more grounding in his activities since leaving Khelben, such as his involvement in Halaster's Highharvestide, but the succinct summaries that the author provides inform the reader perfectly well for the purposes of the novel in my opinion.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin Posted - 06 Mar 2007 : 00:42:22
I liked this book, myself, though I won't be throwing any tomatoes.

I would agree however that the villain was (at least for me) not quite the highlight of the novel.
KnightErrantJR Posted - 05 Mar 2007 : 11:27:41
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and I'm glad you elaborated on it, but I hope you don't mind a dissenting opinion now that you have clarified your position.

1. I generally tend to avoid trying to ascribe motives to an author when discussing their work, since you really can't know exactly why they did the things they did unless they specifically state their reasons. That having been said, the myriad cameos weren't, in my opinions, "padding" the novel, but introducing characters that haven't been heard from in Realms products in years, and using them to tie up loose ends in storylines that haven't been tied up for so long.

2. Obviously you can like or dislike Priamon Rasek as a villain as you will. However, to say that he is an unconvincing villain and a "minor lich" is to discount the fact that he was involved in Halaster's Highharvestide, in which he managed to kidnap a wizard more powerful than even Khelben. My point being that Priamon managed to be a major thorn in the sides of powerful wizards before, so its not like, say, a mid level funtionary of the Zhentarim or the Red Wizards being pegged as a major villain all of the sudden.

3. There have been tons of RSEs and major Realms events that haven't been tied into RPG products from WOTC. In fact, often times its a bit frustrating that there AREN'T more products tied to major events. So the massive evil corporate conspiracy theory doesn't seem to hold up here.

I've already given my thoughts on the novel throuout these threads, so I'll not backtrack into my old opinions. I will say that your opinion might be taken a bit better if you avoided hyperbole like "rubbish," especially in regards to the hard work that Steven Schend put into this book. Not liking the book and saying so is one thing, and its great that you give specific reasons so that its clear what worked and what didn't for you, but using dismissive terms like rubbish is just disrespectful.

That having been said, I appreciate that you did take the time to add what you found as a positive in the novel as well.
Kyrene Posted - 05 Mar 2007 : 06:19:37
quote:
I'd be interested to know why you think "Blackstaff" was 'rubbish' - in a constructive sense of course, not a "Khelben was always my favourite and killing him off was stupid"-sense.

-- George Krashos

While -– once I have determined something to be rubbish -- I try to remain away from the same rubbish in future, I was prompted by George to actually explain why I initially determined “Blackstaff” to be rubbish in the first place.

Preamble
Let me start off by saying I’m a relative newbie to anything Realmsian, having only really gotten into Toril midway through the lifecycle of Neverwinter Nights. I did read and collect –- or is that collect and read? -- the TSR comics of old, but I fell out of touch with the realms for a long time. I like the NWN product immensely and was intrigued by the setting, therefore wishing to find out more about it -- and re-acquaint myself with the place where the Agrivars lived -- did some initial googling, only to find out that NWN and all expansions were what was called non-canon*. Wishing to also create a module for NWN, but then with a more canon or truer feel, I started my research. This led me in turn to the novels, which I started to like, love and despise for their own sake. That is how I in turn bought my copy of “Blackstaff” and decided to read it. I must stress that it was not my very first FR novel. As for my critique of that book, I shall break it up into three parts. Hopefully I won’t belabor my points overly much.

Characters and Characterization
In the prologue we are introduced to Tsarra Chaadren and some of her students. Steven Schend, hereafter simply known as the author, sets up a good premise of things to come, only to abandon all of these cameo characters, moving into chapter one. We are introduced to Raegar, who while fairly interesting in his own right, is far from entertaining. I should have stopped reading at this stage; the best of the novel was over.

However, the author carried on in this vein, with each chapter introducing -- or for the more lore astute, reintroducing –- us to various and sundry cameo characters, seemingly in an effort to re-acquaint us with the who’s who of the Realms zoo. I could say that in an effort to pad his ‘novel’, the author used this as a device to propel the plot, but I won’t. It did feel that way, but I suspect a different motive for this novel altogether.

Plot and Device
The plot can be summed up in one sentence. Tsarra and Arun’s son have a couple of -– was it four? -– days to collect information, or was it artifacts, or both, in order for a once in a gadzellium** RSE™ to take place, or not (if they fail). There is also a cardboard villain out to thwart their plan –- actually Blackstaff’s plan, since Tsarra is never in the know –- played very unconvincingly by a minor lich, with a forgettable name.

Tsarra has some minor apoplectic moments, triggered each time by her puerile simpering, sulking and or tantrum throwing, introducing us to some of Khelben’s past deeds, which she dreams (or shares) while in a comatose state. While these were mildly interesting, in a pure lore aspect, they were too disjointed to be entertaining.

Then there is the shared bond, introduced in chapter two, that never seems as life threatening –- or realms threatening -– as the two protagonists decide it must be in order for them to scamper from one famous realms figure™ to another to get the stuff in time for the whatever-is-supposed-to-happen-but-is-vital-for-future-realms-survival-event.

Setting
The really good part of this novel was the descriptions of the myriad settings, and I suspect this is where the author's other hat as FR designer filtered through with good effect. The settings were rich, well described, not unlike one would wish from any good DM in any campaign. Since I have nothing negative to say about this aspect, I shall keep it short.

In Conclusion
I suspect that this novel was prompted to set the scene for some WotC product. An RSE™ doesn’t just occur willy-nilly. I further suspect that while the author tried his level best, he just wasn’t the right tool for the job. I have to salute Mr. Schend for actually killing off Khelben -– although at that point I was just too gods damned thankful he did to actually care -– as not many authors are willing to do that to one of their protagonists. Both protagonists grated on me from the start (and I actually liked Arun’s son before this novel), the plot was flat and while the scenery was like something out of “Lord of the Rings” (the books and the movies), I felt totally cheated out of the 65 ZAR I paid for this book.

Ironically George signs his posts with a quote that can be applied to this novel. To take some artistic liberty: A novel stands and falls on its own merit. If it is well written and the author resists the invariably fatal temptation to overly use dropping the names of the ‘big folk’, it will be liked by all, not just the select few familiar with those ‘big folk’ already.

And, now that I’ve broken my own rule about revisiting rubbish, let the tomato throwing begin…

* Interestingly the latest WotC web enhancement to Fiendish Codex II, actually gives a nod to NWN HotU, and I quote “Rumors insist that Mephistopheles, or an aspect of him, is trapped in Undermountain, but no one has ever found it.” (dnd_we_20070216a.pdf – page 21)
** gadzellium - like gadzillion is to million, so this is to millenium

Edit: Formatting, now that I've figured out some more forum tags.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin Posted - 30 Dec 2006 : 22:38:02
quote:
Originally posted by Foxhelm

Actually in The Fall of Myth Drannor page 27-28, he is called "He whom Magic, Honour and Duty Defines" by Mystra.



I suppose that's pretty accurate (well, in my opinion), and better it be bestowed by a goddess rather than a mortal--or worst of all, himself.
Foxhelm Posted - 30 Dec 2006 : 22:13:45
Actually in The Fall of Myth Drannor page 27-28, he is called "He whom Magic, Honour and Duty Defines" by Mystra.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin Posted - 30 Dec 2006 : 21:52:02
quote:
Originally posted by Steven Schend
Not quite, no. Akhelben directly translates (as per Cormanthyr, again) into "He who defines duty and honor," if memory serves me correctly.



Who gave Khelben that name? As much as I like the character, that epithet isn't particularly humble.
Steven Schend Posted - 30 Dec 2006 : 20:36:24
quote:
Originally posted by Galaeron Nihmedu

Thanks, Mr. Schend. I still have more questions, though, if you don't mind. Do sharn usually have three heads and two main arms per body, and does the number of heads they have equal the number of souls they have sharing that body? (I know they share a group mind, but I'm not sure if they share individual bodies except for the big sharn comprising the three grand mages of Miyeritar.)


Sharn always have the same identical look as they've always had--3 heads, the arms with the tri-trunk hands, etc. The number of original souls within them matters little, as they are each and all the same (at least until WotC decides to redefine how the sharn are statted up). This is the sort of question Eric Boyd's much better at answering than I am, if you want a straight answer that makes sense in game terms.

quote:

I also notice in the book that the high magic city that the story revolves around is referred to as both Rhymanthiin and Faer'tel'miir. Is Faer'tel'miir the old name and Rhymanthiin the new?


Correct.

quote:
And the Three Watchers—the three grand mages of Rhymanthiin named T'karon, Hamra, and Alunor—are they the leaders of the sharn and the ones who first divised the means to become sharn, thus making them the original sharn?


Correct; these are the three grand mages who disappeared into the Dark Disaster as noted in Cormanthyr's timeline. And this novel is the first time they'd been named.

quote:
And about Oacenth's Vow…Khelben says Oacenth was the coronal and grand mage of Jhyrennstar and that the last person the Three Watchers spoke to in any direct manner was he (Page 265, Ch. 30). Was his vow about uniting all races to work together and live in peace or some such?


Yes, something like that; I don't have Cormanthyr at hand to check the exact wording of his vow, but it's noted in the history of Jhyrennstar and Oacenth's death.

quote:
Those Miyeritaari who chose to remain sharn would have become dhaerow with the Corellon's Descent if they had not remained sharn. I think I read in some Forgotten Realms sourcebook that dhaerow meant "traitor" and was what the elves called the drow, and the Corellon's Descent was the spell that transformed the dark elves into drow, right?


Yes--any dark elves would have become drow had they relinquished their sharnforms.

quote:

Akhelben is Elvish for "blackstaff," right?


Not quite, no. Akhelben directly translates (as per Cormanthyr, again) into "He who defines duty and honor," if memory serves me correctly.

quote:
And what eventually happens to Danthra the Dreamer? Does her spirit move on to the heavens, or is she revived?



That was answered (and repeated) earlier. She's the Oracle of Rhymanthiin, for lack of a better title at present.

Thanks for all your interest.

Steven
Kuje Posted - 30 Dec 2006 : 02:02:46
quote:
Originally posted by Galaeron Nihmedu

And what eventually happens to Danthra the Dreamer? Does her spirit move on to the heavens, or is she revived?



Steven said this about that, earlier in the year on Keep in a thread.

Sorry about that dropped plot thread. I'd planned a scene at the end where Tsarra visits the Dreamer in her new state, but as I already was running long, it never got developed. My bad.

Danthra still exists in a new state in Rhymanthiin. Think of it as a combination of visiting Sylune in Shadowdale, the Oracle at Delphi, and the Mouth of Truth in Rome (think Audrey Hepburn in Roman Holiday). She's a whisper in the ear of penitents seeking oracular advice, and she's able to manifest visually when the moon is more than half full (but only as a wispy ghostlike figure).

That help? Again, apologies for leaving her hanging there....

Steven

Galaeron Nihmedu Posted - 30 Dec 2006 : 01:31:33
Thanks, Mr. Schend. I still have more questions, though, if you don't mind. Do sharn usually have three heads and two main arms per body, and does the number of heads they have equal the number of souls they have sharing that body? (I know they share a group mind, but I'm not sure if they share individual bodies except for the big sharn comprising the three grand mages of Miyeritar.) I also notice in the book that the high magic city that the story revolves around is referred to as both Rhymanthiin and Faer'tel'miir. Is Faer'tel'miir the old name and Rhymanthiin the new? And the Three Watchers—the three grand mages of Rhymanthiin named T'karon, Hamra, and Alunor—are they the leaders of the sharn and the ones who first divised the means to become sharn, thus making them the original sharn?

And about Oacenth's Vow…Khelben says Oacenth was the coronal and grand mage of Jhyrennstar and that the last person the Three Watchers spoke to in any direct manner was he (Page 265, Ch. 30). Was his vow about uniting all races to work together and live in peace or some such?

Those Miyeritaari who chose to remain sharn would have become dhaerow with the Corellon's Descent if they had not remained sharn. I think I read in some Forgotten Realms sourcebook that dhaerow meant "traitor" and was what the elves called the drow, and the Corellon's Descent was the spell that transformed the dark elves into drow, right?

Akhelben is Elvish for "blackstaff," right? And what eventually happens to Danthra the Dreamer? Does her spirit move on to the heavens, or is she revived?
Wandering_mage Posted - 30 Nov 2006 : 00:31:50
I still love all this Sharn talk! Steven, you really know how to put a twist on a story. I'll say it again. Great book! :)
Steven Schend Posted - 29 Nov 2006 : 16:15:00
quote:
Originally posted by Galaeron Nihmedu

I have a few questions: Were some of the sharn Netherese? If not, why did they fight the phaerimm?


It's inherently possible that some of the sharn could have been Netherese, just as they could have been refugees or survivors of any civilization that had a precipitous or sudden fall (i.e. Uvaeren, Ammarindar, villages stomped by the Black Hordes, etc.).

As for why they fought the phaerimm, one of the sharns' hidden purposes at all times (and even now with those left) was to prevent abuses of magic and fight against corruptions on the Weave. As much of what the Phaerimm have done fall under those descriptions, they made themselves the sharns' enemies. (Case in point--we don't necessarily always hear all the news of what goes on in Thay, but I'd suspect that there are always sharn working against some of the worst abuses of magic therein...)

quote:
And why would the Pentad transform survivors of lore hubs into such strange creatures as the sharn (as opposed to angelic beings or Chosen)?


Because they were either approached by the sharn themselves or inspired by Miyeritar or Uvaeren and their studies drew them to that conclusion/secret.

I'm loathe to say more, as I've got some stories and articles in mind to flesh all this out, some of which must remain NDA. Suffice it to say that the five faiths of the Pentad did not come together without reason or purpose...so what their faithful did has meaning. I just can't discuss what that meaning is at present.

quote:
What does fhaorn'quessir translate to?


Didn't I translate that over in my folder somewheres? I'll have to double-check my notes on that and get back to you. One thing to note--This is NOT a common name for the sharn, but it's one ONLY known among the Pentad's elven worshipers. If memory serves correctly, it's loosely transltated as "changed/altered Person" and acknowledges that there are elves within the sharn.

quote:
Is Khelben truly dead?


Yes, I'm afraid so. He's earned his peace after 960 years, don't you think?

quote:
After reading Elminster in Hell and this book, I am very curious about who Halaster Blackcloak truly is.


Then Ed's and my work is done here. I've enjoyed scattering hints and nibbles about Halaster into everything I've done in the Realms. It's one of the biggest scavenger hunts of lore out there--just ask George, and he'll confirm the only thing worse is sussing out the true history of The North.

quote:
And lastly, what the heck is an otyugh?


A scavenging garbage- and offal-eater that's been a D&D staple monster for decades. Look to your Monster Manual.

Hope these answers helped, Galaeron.
Marc Posted - 29 Nov 2006 : 10:38:26
Otyugh, you can find it in MM, truly a hideus creature
Galaeron Nihmedu Posted - 29 Nov 2006 : 03:13:53
I have a few questions: Were some of the sharn Netherese? If not, why did they fight the phaerimm? And why would the Pentad transform survivors of lore hubs into such strange creatures as the sharn (as opposed to angelic beings or Chosen)? What does fhaorn'quessir translate to? Is Khelben truly dead? After reading Elminster in Hell and this book, I am very curious about who Halaster Blackcloak truly is. And lastly, what the heck is an otyugh?
Steven Schend Posted - 21 Oct 2006 : 02:27:00
quote:
Originally posted by Dhomal

Hello-

Well - its a month and a half after the last comment here.

I think I know why.

After I finished chapter 27 - I just HAD to keep reading. It did not help that I was at work -a nd had 1/2 my lunch break left - with no access to the internet to pop on and read through this.

So - I kept reading to the end. :)

And Thats why I beleive that this thread is less-posted in than others.

Next stop - the last thread!

Thanks again for a wonderful read!

Dhomal



Thanks, both for stopping by and adding the nice comments. Glad the book pulled you along; now I'll have to swing by and see what your final thoughts were.

SES
Dhomal Posted - 19 Oct 2006 : 06:55:45
Hello-

Well - its a month and a half after the last comment here.

I think I know why.

After I finished chapter 27 - I just HAD to keep reading. It did not help that I was at work -a nd had 1/2 my lunch break left - with no access to the internet to pop on and read through this.

So - I kept reading to the end. :)

And Thats why I beleive that this thread is less-posted in than others.

Next stop - the last thread!

Thanks again for a wonderful read!

Dhomal
Steven Schend Posted - 22 Aug 2006 : 03:04:15
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR

Okay, a question. Obviously we get the idea that Sharn are kind of like composite creatures of fallen societies that sort of fuse together to survive and preserve what might be lost from their societies (I hope I am close here). What I am wondering is if all Sharn are from the events in chapter twenty, or if there were other societies that preserved themselves by turning into sharn?



Realized I'd never answered this comment/question....my bad.

The sharn were made of composite survivors and/or willing entrants who sacrificed their lives and knowledge to join the collective sharn. (Strange that a few years AFTER Ed, Eric, and I had discussed the sharn as one big collective underdark LAKE of sharnstuff that splintered off pieces to make individual sharn, Star Trek DS9 had the same idea for the Founders/shapeshifters.)

No, not all the sharn came from the events in Chapter 20, though every living being in that Pentad enclave became sharn. The original sharn were the lorelords and such of Miyeritar--the 3 High Mages and the 80 that entered the storms as noted in a few places in the timelines. They took in a few other survivors who didn't get mentioned in elven histories, like the guards and scouts of Miyeritar--the centaurs.

Over time, I figure there's been a few who've been offered salvation from certain death by joining the sharn, and a few folk of Uvaeren, Eaerlann, Ascalhorn, and many many other realms joined the collective.

Thus, Rhymanthiin is going to be a hotbed of historical knowledge as there are now living denizens of many lost realms who can correct or compile information on places that have little (or perhaps have even been forgotten) detail.

Does this help clarify things, Knight? Or just add more questions, as any good designer does?

Steven
Who highly recommends the very odd movie LITTLE MISS SUNSHINE to anyone who can attend R-rated movies
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin Posted - 28 Jul 2006 : 00:42:52
quote:
Originally posted by Crust


The flow of the reading is also very high-brow. This is one of the few FR novels that I feel is written toward an older audience, an audience who will appreciate both the extensive Realmslore and the style of writing itself, rather than any kewl action that almost quotes rulebooks.


I totally agree with that.

quote:
The flow of events can be a tad confusing at times, but like I said above, the characters are often just as confused as the reader, and that's a very compelling thing to experience while reading.



This, I don't agree with quite as enthusiastically. There really are times when the writing just isn't very clear, and that can't simply be written off as style (IMO). That being said, the book improves in this respect towards the end.
Crust Posted - 27 Jul 2006 : 19:14:52
By this point in the novel, I'm reluctant to read too quickly, as I want to savor these pages before turning them.

The Realmslore, the tour of Waterdeep, the use of classics like sharn, phaerimm, Semmemon, the Wands family, the references to dozens of other Realms novels, the very mention of Eltargrim... I am loving this novel. I agree with others who've said this is a must-read for Realms fans.

The plot is unfolding in a way that I've never seen in an FR book (with the possible exception of certain Greenwood and Cunningham novels). The most delightful aspect of the plot is just as I'm saying to myself, "What's happening here?" one of the characters asks the same question a couple paragraphs later, and that's an awesome union of character and reader. It happens over and over, and I love it.

The flow of the reading is also very high-brow. This is one of the few FR novels that I feel is written toward an older audience, an audience who will appreciate both the extensive Realmslore and the style of writing itself, rather than any kewl action that almost quotes rulebooks.

The flow of events can be a tad confusing at times, but like I said above, the characters are often just as confused as the reader, and that's a very compelling thing to experience while reading.

I dare say Blackstaff is literature.
Mkhaiwati Posted - 27 Jul 2006 : 03:42:53
Recently I asked Steven Schend about some sayings in the book, and he graciously gave me answers. It has also been remarked I should share with others:

quote:
quote:
Page 189, the Pentad say to Khelben, "We all take Oacenth's Vow and Dragmar's Promise to heart." I can figure out Oacenth's Vow, but Dragmar's Promise?



Just like Oacenth, I figured I could easily slide in a dwarven leader's name who'd vowed to find ways to work together with the other races as well. Only thing else we know about Dragmar is that he was a high priest of Dumathoin and probably a leader in a long dead dwarven civilization between the times of Miyeritar and -300 DR.


There we go, another mystery created and solved!

Mkhaiwati
Conlon Posted - 21 Jul 2006 : 07:15:42
This book has been an excellent addition to my library. The interesting, yet brief, introductions of so many Realms luminaries has been a lot of fun to read. I have often wondered why so many interesting characters found in sourcebooks rarely, if ever, recieve any attention in novels.

Mr. Schend, I am on chapter 37 and enjoying pretty much every minute.
Beezy Posted - 19 Jul 2006 : 03:39:54
Mr Schend has done a wonderful job of including a great deal of realmslore throughout this tale. I don't own source books or the campaign setting as I only read the novels so it was nice to get this much lore and detail from a novel, I can only imagine what he can do with a trilogy!
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin Posted - 19 Jul 2006 : 02:45:10
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR

I'm sorry, I thought you had read it. Appologies if I messed anything up for you.



No, it didn't...I asked for you to clarify, and I appreciate it. I just think maybe *I* commented too soon.

And yes, I'm "cheating" a little by even being here...but so what?
KnightErrantJR Posted - 19 Jul 2006 : 02:43:31
I'm sorry, I thought you had read it. Appologies if I messed anything up for you.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin Posted - 19 Jul 2006 : 02:42:15
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR

But, to be fair, if author that someone "likes" over other authors selectively exclude Realmslore, then how can we argue that authors that don't follow Realmslore are at fault for not keeping up on current events?


I'm not arguing that anyone should exclude Realmslore. As I've said before, I'm here simply to give my opinion...even if, in truth, it amounts to less than a hill of beans in the greater picture. If my opinion is as unsubtle and emotional as "yuck", that's what it is.

quote:
As for context, Khelben had just told Maskar that he was needed, the symbol of Mystra showed up, and then Maskar says, "Very well, what's the task--fully restoring Myth Drannor?" to which Khelben replies, "No, though a few worthies of that realm may join us for the working. No, 'tis something older still."



Hmm, maybe I should refrain from commenting until I get to that part, all right?

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