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 Current form of the Ba'etith

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muir Posted - 20 May 2019 : 15:34:50
From Mages and Sages Ep. 11 I think it was Eric Boyd speaking:

"The Ba'etith, they still exist. They don't really remember that they exist; they transformed into another, form, let me say, that has largely forgotten where it's come from but they are still existing and the greatest of the Ba'etith, there are 5 of them, they still have a hand in the Realms, including one of them may well have had a role (I'm going to be really obscure here) in the madness of a certain line of kings."

I am still working on assimilating the lore I have access to, and so while this intrigues me greatly, I cannot make any good guesses as to what it might refer to.

I take the "transformed into another form" as referring to the organization, rather than individuals, for they were not all the same species even by the end of the Days of Thunder. So, an organization that gathers lore of the Art, with members withdrawn from actively shaping the realms, except for the 5 'greatest.' Greatest by what measure? Political influence, magical might, depth of lore gathered?

Oh, so many mysteries...

I found myself thinking of both Iolaum and the Loretakers of Oryndoll, but the former is solitary, as far as I know. The latter, maybe, though I think they do not restrict themselves to lore of the Art, and are all one species.

Any suggestions, most worthy scribes?
14   L A T E S T    R E P L I E S    (Newest First)
sleyvas Posted - 29 May 2019 : 22:29:47
quote:
Originally posted by Starshade

Line of Kings? Madness? That got to be Cormyr.

cou

I wouldn't make that assumption. We're talking a group that spans dozens of millennia since they were formed. The mad kings could have been in Narfell. They could have been amongst the elves during the crown wars. They could have been amongst the dragons or giants for that matter.
TBeholder Posted - 27 May 2019 : 04:00:56
Maybe Aryselmalyr?
Gary Dallison Posted - 22 May 2019 : 21:44:53
The Shoon were pretty mad, but since Eric and George are focused on certain areas I would guess it is a reference to the north or impiltur.
Wooly Rupert Posted - 22 May 2019 : 20:55:28
quote:
Originally posted by Starshade

Line of Kings? Madness? That got to be Cormyr.



I don't have an alternative, but I don't think it's Cormyr. The place is not associated with mad kings.
Starshade Posted - 22 May 2019 : 15:32:32
Line of Kings? Madness? That got to be Cormyr.
TBeholder Posted - 22 May 2019 : 03:00:33
quote:
Originally posted by muir


"The Ba'etith, they still exist. They don't really remember that they exist; they transformed into another, form, let me say, that has largely forgotten where it's come from but they are still existing and the greatest of the Ba'etith, there are 5 of them, they still have a hand in the Realms, including one of them may well have had a role (I'm going to be really obscure here) in the madness of a certain line of kings."
[...]
I take the "transformed into another form" as referring to the organization, rather than individuals, for they were not all the same species even by the end of the Days of Thunder.

Why not? It could refer to individuals too, seeing how they're ancient. Once tey start taking other forms, does it matter much what they were? There are many, many forms into which something can be transformed and "still exist".
Possibilities are so wide, speculation even about the known ones is not very fruitful. Minions of Mystril/Mystra alone have many forms - shadowstaves, souls-in-artifacts, wanderers without memories of their past and whatnot. And how many are there "plain old" undead creatures?

quote:
Originally posted by muir

I have sometimes wondered whether the Nether Scrolls have any sort of 'auto-update' function. Magical knowledge continues to increase, after all, and occasionally some of the ground rules change (see: Karsus' Folly.) Updating would be easier if a soul imprint, or soul, of the creators was present.

Updating would be a bit like trying to embrace the infinite, then cling on as it grows.
But it's clear that one can read from the scrolls more than the Sarrukh or anyone at that time could write into them.
And there were mentions of content changing when someone re-reads a scroll later.
My theory is that the scrolls are interactive, that is don't contain all the information they provide, but mostly derive it procedurally, building upon what they can get both from the user and their "reading" of the Weave at the moment, via different methods implemented in each individual scroll.
This allows practically unlimited complexity, but doesn't necessarily imply a sentience, because it would be superfluous if the current user is a part of the device (when it's active) anyway. From what we know, most likely they aren't thinking, because there were two duplicate sets.
muir Posted - 22 May 2019 : 01:59:04
quote:
The Ba'etith are the Nether Scrolls, (in my version anyway)


quote:
Well the creation of the Nether Scrolls, as with all such potent magic, came at a ... cost.


I have sometimes wondered whether the Nether Scrolls have any sort of 'auto-update' function. Magical knowledge continues to increase, after all, and occasionally some of the ground rules change (see: Karsus' Folly.) Updating would be easier if a soul imprint, or soul, of the creators was present.
George Krashos Posted - 20 May 2019 : 23:10:58
Well the creation of the Nether Scrolls, as with all such potent magic, came at a ... cost.

— George Krashos
Sammael Posted - 20 May 2019 : 22:34:29
FFS just tell us who the 5 are :D

in all seriousness, I would say the organization as such no longer exists, only its legacies. Candlekeep may be one such legacy. Larloch may be another. Collecting and categorizing knowledge and ensuring it is never lost or forgotten - a noble goal and certainly one that's followed by many in modern Realms.
ericlboyd Posted - 20 May 2019 : 18:53:21
quote:
Originally posted by muir

From Mages and Sages Ep. 11 I think it was Eric Boyd speaking:




Yep. :-)
BrennonGoldeye Posted - 20 May 2019 : 18:02:40
Might they be 'Weave Ghosts' or something elder to that? I've always wondered what were the incarnations of the Weave 'before' Mystral. As often as She has changed in the past 1000 years, what were Her turmoils before Humans called Her Mystral?
Gary Dallison Posted - 20 May 2019 : 17:09:06
The baetith are the nether scrolls (in my version anyway) what better way to control the weave than become part of the weave anchors that create and extend the weave.

muir Posted - 20 May 2019 : 16:25:12
Gah! I did not forget about the Terraseer, but discounted it because it has certainly not forgotten where it came from. But perhaps it heads/steers an organization which has...

I am still learning not to discount modules as sources of lore.
The Arcanamach Posted - 20 May 2019 : 16:02:20
Well I think the Terraseer is most certainly going to be one of them and I think he is in one of the 3e modules (the sundering of the weave I believe is the one). And I think 'greatest' will refer to both magical might and depth of lore gathered.

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