Candlekeep Forum
Candlekeep Forum
Home | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Active Polls | Members | Private Messages | Search | FAQ
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 Forgotten Realms Products
 Forgotten Realms Novels
 Old Covers vs. New Covers

Note: You must be registered in order to post a reply.
To register, click here. Registration is FREE!

Screensize:
UserName:
Password:
Format Mode:
Format: BoldItalicizedUnderlineStrikethrough Align LeftCenteredAlign Right Horizontal Rule Insert HyperlinkInsert Email Insert CodeInsert QuoteInsert List
   
Message:

* HTML is OFF
* Forum Code is ON
Smilies
Smile [:)] Big Smile [:D] Cool [8D] Blush [:I]
Tongue [:P] Evil [):] Wink [;)] Clown [:o)]
Black Eye [B)] Eight Ball [8] Frown [:(] Shy [8)]
Shocked [:0] Angry [:(!] Dead [xx(] Sleepy [|)]
Kisses [:X] Approve [^] Disapprove [V] Question [?]
Rolling Eyes [8|] Confused [?!:] Help [?:] King [3|:]
Laughing [:OD] What [W] Oooohh [:H] Down [:E]

  Check here to include your profile signature.
Check here to subscribe to this topic.
    

T O P I C    R E V I E W
ranger_of_the_unicorn_run Posted - 08 Dec 2008 : 15:19:22
Hello! I'm curious about something. I have heard people comment on how they like the new cover art for FR and D&D books in general since the switch to WotC and illustrators like Lockwood came into the picture.

I really like the older cover art because to me it feels more homey and it brings back memories of when I first started reading the books.

How do you feel about it? Do you like the old covers better or the new ones?
30   L A T E S T    R E P L I E S    (Newest First)
ranger_of_the_unicorn_run Posted - 03 Jan 2009 : 21:04:16
quote:
Originally posted by Brynweir

I have to say that I like the older covers better, but Lockwood does some fine work. Brings to mind Michael Whelan, who happens to be my favorite... though not so much in FR.


I like Lockwood's stuff quite a lot as well, but the old covers just make me feel happy. They remind me of some of the first Realms books I read when I was about 10 years old.
Calen Posted - 03 Jan 2009 : 19:10:11
I am for sure into the older covers. Having a lot of the vintage books, I usually scour the used book stores for the old covers to work n completing the collection. I have always loved Easley's and Elmore's work the best
Brynweir Posted - 03 Jan 2009 : 15:28:41
I have to say that I like the older covers better, but Lockwood does some fine work. Brings to mind Michael Whelan, who happens to be my favorite... though not so much in FR.
swifty Posted - 03 Jan 2009 : 09:23:46
for me its a case of good cover in the late 80s up to the mid 90s but there were some shocking ones in the late 90s.eg the drizzt books faces of deception and the shadow stone.my favourite cover is probably darkwalker on moonshae.
Thalos_Milathriel Posted - 03 Jan 2009 : 01:26:19
There are some exceptions, but I'd have to vote NEW just because of Todd Lockwood. All his stuff is very detailed, and so well done that it encourages the suspension of disbelief, which I think is the mark of great fantasy art.

I'm even planning on purchasing some Lockwood prints to hang in my new basement office/den/FR collection storage room.
Laerrigan Posted - 02 Jan 2009 : 04:57:46
I'm a sucker for attempts at photorealism, maybe with twists of romance (art style, not that kind of romance) and/or impressionism, to say nothing of natural-looking dragons, so I'll always gravitate toward Lockwood....
dwarvenranger Posted - 18 Dec 2008 : 01:25:59
quote:
Originally posted by scererar

mostly old. Can't beat Elmore, Easley, and Caldwell Art. I do like many of the newer covers as well though.



Gotta agree with Scererar here.
Hawkins Posted - 11 Dec 2008 : 19:06:36
Personally, I find the older covers "campy" for the most part, which is why I prefer the new covers.
rockyoumonkeys Posted - 11 Dec 2008 : 17:14:55
I think I definitely prefer the old covers, though some of the new covers are pretty nice.

I guess I just prefer that old-fashioned fantasy art.
BARDOBARBAROS Posted - 11 Dec 2008 : 14:17:29
Old Covers
BEAST Posted - 11 Dec 2008 : 09:35:18
The Space Hamster was referring to the effectively black color of the drow character's resultant skin in the created image ("The end result was a black-skinned drow"), while Dag was referring to the pigments of the paint or digital tools used in order to create the images in the first place ("that Drow isn't colored in using black, but rather, dark hues of blue, purple, and gray"). Apples and oranges. Or maybe apples and appleseeds. Dagnirion is talking tools, while Wooly was talking end-product.

To say what color something is really is highly subjective and relative. There are so many factors that go into contructing an image, lighting it, transporting it through intermediary media, conveying it into our eyes and peripheral anatomical components, clearing whatever obstacles lie in wait (such as color blindness, cataracts, or tinted lenses), and then finally into our psychological perceptions of it all, that to say what color an object is really does depend on one's particular frame of reference at any given moment in time and space. What color an object has or should be characterized by depends on all of that intermediate stuff, right down to the individual viewer's mind. Dag, the color of the materials or tools preliminarily selected in order to craft the image really is only the beginning--not the final answer.

If Wooly said that drow was black-skinned, then he was right for himself (and a whole lot of other people, I would reckon). Dag, if you perceive the finished drow image to appear to have skin that does not look black, then for you, I guess, it is not black.
ranger_of_the_unicorn_run Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 23:02:33
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Dagnirion

-Looking black =/= black, thus enabling the claim that it cannot properly be done with black to be correct.



The claim wasn't that it couldn't be done with black, the claim was that it couldn't be done, period.


What I meant was that maybe it could be done by some artists, but maybe other artists just didn't have the right style or skill level to do it.
Wooly Rupert Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 22:59:45
quote:
Originally posted by Dagnirion

-Looking black =/= black, thus enabling the claim that it cannot properly be done with black to be correct.



The claim wasn't that it couldn't be done with black, the claim was that it couldn't be done, period.
Lord Karsus Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 22:19:20
-Looking black =/= black, thus enabling the claim that it cannot properly be done with black to be correct.
ranger_of_the_unicorn_run Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 18:15:52
There is also a difference in art styles. Maybe some artists are more skilled at shading and therefore capable of creating the black look, while others don't use heavy shading in their work and therefore aren't as skilled in its use.
Wooly Rupert Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 17:44:40
quote:
Originally posted by Dagnirion

-So, you are accepting that Drow cannot be colored and shaded using black, with the caveat that other colors/hues can and should be used to make the individual appear as black to the naked eye as possible.

-I, myself, have become partial to the "purple Drow".



No, I'm not accepting that. I'm saying that it doesn't matter if they mix orange, pink, mauve, indigo, and plaid to make black, or if they use just black -- so long as the end result looks black, I don't care how they got there. The end result can be achieved, and it has been achieved. That's all that matters to me.
Lord Karsus Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 17:19:17
-So, you are accepting that Drow cannot be colored and shaded using black, with the caveat that other colors/hues can and should be used to make the individual appear as black to the naked eye as possible.

-I, myself, have become partial to the "purple Drow".
Wooly Rupert Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 16:54:45
quote:
Originally posted by Dagnirion

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

It doesn't matter how it was done. The end result was a black-skinned drow. That proves it could be done.



-It's not, though. If dark blue, purple and/or gray hues were indeed used (and, by my eye, that's what it seems, but I'm no art connoisseur, so...), then you've got a dark blue, purple and/or gray Drow that looks black, not a black Drow.



If the end result is a drow that appears to have black skin, then how they got there doesn't matter. The drow on that cover (and on some other books I've seen) appears to have black skin -- so that's enough for me. The art matches the description.
Lord Karsus Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 15:53:07
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert



"Does the Dark Side make you horny, baby?"





-See, it just naturally works.

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

It doesn't matter how it was done. The end result was a black-skinned drow. That proves it could be done.



-It's not, though. If dark blue, purple and/or gray hues were indeed used (and, by my eye, that's what it seems, but I'm no art connoisseur, so...), then you've got a dark blue, purple and/or gray Drow that looks black, not a black Drow.
The Sage Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 14:47:56
I don't think I'll ever be able to enjoy watching either of those characters in quite the same way as I did previously.
Alisttair Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 13:40:50
quote:
Originally posted by ranger_of_the_unicorn_run

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Dagnirion

-Drizzt looks like a cross of Emperor Palpatine and Austin Powers there.





"Does the Dark Side make you horny, baby?"




That made my day!



After dealing with all this snow here in Ottawa, this just brightened me up also.
ranger_of_the_unicorn_run Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 11:39:26
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Dagnirion

-Drizzt looks like a cross of Emperor Palpatine and Austin Powers there.





"Does the Dark Side make you horny, baby?"




That made my day!
Wooly Rupert Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 06:22:39
quote:
Originally posted by Dagnirion

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

But I don't buy that argument, because we have some old TSR artwork that shows black-skinned drow. http://home.flash.net/~brenfrow/gh/gh-wg12.htm



-Not having the actual product, but having seen it many times, I'd say that said Drow isn't colored in using black, but rather, dark hues of blue, purple, and gray. You *can't* color something in black, and then be able to include "detail lines" (for a lack of a better term) in black as well. If both were black, the "detail lines" would not appear. To fix this, "detail lines" other than black could be used- white would stand out the most, since this is black we're talking about here- but I'd think that would look fairly tacky.



It doesn't matter how it was done. The end result was a black-skinned drow. That proves it could be done.
Wooly Rupert Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 06:20:59
quote:
Originally posted by Dagnirion

-Drizzt looks like a cross of Emperor Palpatine and Austin Powers there.





"Does the Dark Side make you horny, baby?"

Lord Karsus Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 05:09:33
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

But I don't buy that argument, because we have some old TSR artwork that shows black-skinned drow. http://home.flash.net/~brenfrow/gh/gh-wg12.htm



-Not having the actual product, but having seen it many times, I'd say that said Drow isn't colored in using black, but rather, dark hues of blue, purple, and gray. You *can't* color something in black, and then be able to include "detail lines" (for a lack of a better term) in black as well. If both were black, the "detail lines" would not appear. To fix this, "detail lines" other than black could be used- white would stand out the most, since this is black we're talking about here- but I'd think that would look fairly tacky.
Lord Karsus Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 05:05:49
-Drizzt looks like a cross of Emperor Palpatine and Austin Powers there.
mnb128 Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 05:04:34
Didn't any of you know that Drizzt is actually Anthony Kiedis from the Chili Peppers?

Long link 1
Really long link 2
(not quite as long as link 2) link 3

"Under the Bridge" was actually a about present day Luskan. "Under the bridge down town, that's where I drew some blood..."

Mod edit: The links were stretching the page. I have destretched it.
scererar Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 02:12:47
quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart

I honestly can't vote on this... I love the old fiction covers, with Elmore 'defining' the look of D&D for my youth, while the new Lockwood paintings are just masterpieces in their own right. Meanwhile, I think the design of the 3.0/3.5 Realms RPG products did a terrific job of selling the setting and showing it's uniqueness from the D&D core (in contrast, the Eberron RPG books get 'lost' in their design compared to the core books).

I also have to agree with the Space Hamster on a lot of the new artwork on the fiction books. A lot of the books have art that looks like they painted it with watercolor, then ran it under the faucet for a bit, creating too much blur and not enough definition.

And yes, 'old man Drizzt' was something that was just wrong. Especially with the 12-year old Catti-brie on Starless Night.

Edit: Found a link.



now I concider this cover "new" art. I am getting old I imagine we are talking pre and post 3E art
scererar Posted - 10 Dec 2008 : 02:11:30
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

Though I generally do prefer the old artwork, there are some exceptions -- and a lot of those were the Drizzt covers after the original trilogy. He does look like an old man in that one pic, and I never understood where that funky gold headpiece came from...

And though Elmore got Drizzt's skintone wrong on the cover of The Crystal Shard, that remains one of my all-time favorite Realms covers. It's just an incredible bit of artwork.
http://www.o-love.net/realms/covers_large/pic_ice1.jpg



+1. This was one of the novels that first drew my attention to FR
Arion Elenim Posted - 09 Dec 2008 : 20:42:27
Well if I recall, Salvatore once said the infamous "Clint Eastwood" cover from The Legacy occured due to a misunderstanding between his take that Drizzt needed to look "mature" and the artist's intrepretations...

Where the earrings, muttonchops and pink flesh came from, none have said.

Candlekeep Forum © 1999-2024 Candlekeep.com Go To Top Of Page
Snitz Forums 2000